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Light Aircraft Crash in Oxfordshire

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Light Aircraft Crash in Oxfordshire

Old 15th Jan 2017, 15:39
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Light Aircraft Crash in Oxfordshire

Man dies in Oxfordshire plane crash - BBC News Anyone know anything?
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Old 15th Jan 2017, 16:39
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The crash site is on the top of the Chiltern ridge very close to the M40, another scud running CFIT ?
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Old 15th Jan 2017, 17:15
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"BBC reporter Claire Hawke said there was "very thick fog" at the scene of the crash."
Quite possibly.
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Old 15th Jan 2017, 17:19
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Poor man, it must be terrifying going down because of the weather or to be forced down in that weather. Damned shame.
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Old 15th Jan 2017, 17:28
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the viz in the photos on the BBC news webpage would suggest going home on the bus unless your IR is up to speed.
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Old 15th Jan 2017, 17:31
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You wouldn't fly for fun on a day like today would you?
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Old 15th Jan 2017, 18:42
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Miserable day in Oxford today. Not a good day to go flying.
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Old 15th Jan 2017, 20:05
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You wouldn't fly for fun on a day like today would you?
No, and I will be aurprised if he was. If not an IF qualified pilot in a suitably equiped aircraft then he should not have been up in the weather and I very much suspect, given the forecast and actual that he was so qualified and something went wrong, until the report is out or someone who knows the pilot well puts a comment I would leave it there!

Last edited by foxmoth; 16th Jan 2017 at 11:29.
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Old 16th Jan 2017, 20:57
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Some more info for those who may have known the pilot.

FYI. Chris at Turweston kindly posted the following information on FB. "For those that do not know, the pilot we lost was longtime Turweston resident Dave Norris who was flying Pa30 G-ATMT.
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Old 16th Jan 2017, 21:43
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Very sad news. Dave was I believe either a current or past examiner and the PA 30 should have been up to job. We await the AAIB.
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Old 16th Jan 2017, 23:48
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An observation that may or may not be related to this sad accident. The 326' "Stokenchurch Mast" is very close to the Reserve.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 08:04
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It is - and is well known for being hard to see in poor or marginal visibility. It seems likely that this was significant in the pilot's mind , whatever other problems were going on in the aeroplane at the time of the accident.

Of course, there is unlikely to be anything to indicate what was in the pilot's mind immediately prior to the accident - so the AAIB are likely to be unable to say much about that.

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Old 17th Jan 2017, 09:10
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Highly qualified and able pilot operating in appalling weather in a fully IFR equipped aircraft. Normally there would be no need to stay "Vmc below" flying towards high ground and a 1000ft mast - in fog!!
There must be a lot more to this and, hopefully, the AAIB will be able to decipher what it is.
Sincere condolences.

Last edited by Arfur Dent; 17th Jan 2017 at 10:30.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 15:48
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operating in appalling weather in a fully IFR equipped aircraft
All due condolences of course but I could not help noticing that the aircraft does not display any de-icing equipment on any of the photos available online (including GINFO). One can only hope that icing did not play a part in events.

I am sure the AAIB will do their usual excellent job of deducing a cause and I add my sympathies to those who knew the pilot.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 16:42
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The crash location appears to on the very edge of the Chilterns overlooking the low ground towards Oxford. For anyone who knows the M40 it's on the left at the start of the cutting as you head South towards Stokenchurch.

An obvious place for a CFIT in bad weather but a coincidence if it was icing.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 18:37
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I did a quick check - the outside air temperatures at Oxford and Cranfield around that time were about +8/9 deg C so I doubt airframe icing is a factor in this accident.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 19:03
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The a/c took off from Turweston, but what was the destination & purpose of the flight. I would assume a PA-30 was IFR equipped and it seems the pilot was IFR experienced. How far is the crash site from takeoff, and is it in the direction of the planned flight? If the weather was as bad as is reported one would assume an IFR flight was planned. I remember the SE performance on PA-30 was not great, but that was with 3 up. Solo should have been better. Still curious as to what might have happened. Over to you, AAIB.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 19:30
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IFR question for one of you folks that fly down south. Do NATS or the controlling authority for that area have "pre-canned" low level IFR routes between airfields in the Southeast of England similar to Tower en Route clearances in the US? and if so where could I find them.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 20:30
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In the US I have flown IFR over fog, and in cloud and ATC confirmed my destination was clear. In days before I was qualified for IFR I have been uncertain of my position at low level in lowering cloud near the Chilterns and the M40, with the top of the TV tower actually lost in the cloud. Benson was helpful, confirmed my position and once finding the M40 simply flew low along the road toward the East until Wycombe Air Park appeared on the right of the motorway. The Chilterns are well known for orographic cloud when the wind blows against those hills.

I am wondering if Dave Norris was receiving any help from controllers at Benson....or anywhere.
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Old 17th Jan 2017, 21:02
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Mary I am not sure that Benson would have been able to provide a radar service especially on a Sunday - Brize and Farnborough would but I am not sure down to what level.

We don't have pre- canned low level IFR routes in here so far as I know except for departure from major airports -eg. the "Juliet" departure from Luton and possibly heli routes within the London CTR/CTA.

Some speculation on other forums about non-published IFR let downs into Chalgrove- these could be GPS based, or based on the WCO NDB or the CPT VOR/DME if you knew how to use them.
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