iv made my decision. where to now?
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iv made my decision. where to now?
i have made my decision to leave college with my as-levels and start my long road to becoming a pilot now.
the thing is i dont know where to start.
Can anyone suggest anything?
(please dont try and talk me into going back to college)
thanks in advance
Dave
the thing is i dont know where to start.
Can anyone suggest anything?
(please dont try and talk me into going back to college)
thanks in advance
Dave
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Well I know you dont want me to talk to you about going into college but airlines/forces educational requirements normally ask for 2 A-Levels.
Anyway, try to seek sponsorship, or, if you're fortunate enough to have enough dosh for a ppl then find your nearest flying club and crack on with learning to fly. A ppl in Britain will probably set you back around £4000 (I think!!!)
If anyone disagrees then just say so as I'm quite junior myself within the aviation world.
Anyway, try to seek sponsorship, or, if you're fortunate enough to have enough dosh for a ppl then find your nearest flying club and crack on with learning to fly. A ppl in Britain will probably set you back around £4000 (I think!!!)
If anyone disagrees then just say so as I'm quite junior myself within the aviation world.
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LH
Think long and hard about jacking college now.
I binned Uni 2 years through after the RAF binned me and it was the biggest mistake I've made in my life.
It's much better to get your a levels and then you've got a chance of joining the forces or getting sponsorship, what's another year in your life when your 17
and there's nothing to stop you doing your A level and having a part time job so you can start your PPL, It'll just take a lot of work.
But the main thing has to be get A levels, not just as a fallback if the medical or something doesn't work out but wouldn't it be far nicer to have BA pay for your licence than have to spend the next X years struggling to get there through your own finances?
Sorry if this isn't what you want to hear, and I'm sure you've got great reasons for leaving college now, I know I did and look where it's got me.
Not big or clever
Think long and hard about jacking college now.
I binned Uni 2 years through after the RAF binned me and it was the biggest mistake I've made in my life.
It's much better to get your a levels and then you've got a chance of joining the forces or getting sponsorship, what's another year in your life when your 17
and there's nothing to stop you doing your A level and having a part time job so you can start your PPL, It'll just take a lot of work.
But the main thing has to be get A levels, not just as a fallback if the medical or something doesn't work out but wouldn't it be far nicer to have BA pay for your licence than have to spend the next X years struggling to get there through your own finances?
Sorry if this isn't what you want to hear, and I'm sure you've got great reasons for leaving college now, I know I did and look where it's got me.
Not big or clever
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Mate,
I know you won't be talked into going back, but don't get into thinking that people will employ you with AS levels. All they show is that you did GCSE's and have a little bit more experience...But other than that they mean very little unless backed up with the more in depth A2 study - believe me, it's in depth!
For now, if no oppourtunities jump out at you - get working for a few months, think about the USA for the PPL...Ormond Beach and Naples etc... have some attractive packages...
Don't close any doors yet mate, and don't rule out Year 13 all together!
Regards
Mike
I know you won't be talked into going back, but don't get into thinking that people will employ you with AS levels. All they show is that you did GCSE's and have a little bit more experience...But other than that they mean very little unless backed up with the more in depth A2 study - believe me, it's in depth!
For now, if no oppourtunities jump out at you - get working for a few months, think about the USA for the PPL...Ormond Beach and Naples etc... have some attractive packages...
Don't close any doors yet mate, and don't rule out Year 13 all together!
Regards
Mike
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To be fair mate, if you're getting out of college at this point without knowing where to go, that is mistake number one that you have already made. I would not be surprised if degrees become a prerequisite in the future, and as others have said, another year in education is not long compared to your career: you may want to rush into it now but it is quite possibly a big mistake. Few people will employ or sponsor 17/18 year old, especially without A-Levels. AS-Levels are not really a hugely recognised qualification beyond GCSE, and additionally, whatever you may feel right now, there is no need to rush in as soon as you can. There are jobs and there will be for a while.
You have the opportunity to open your options; why close them prematurely?
You have the opportunity to open your options; why close them prematurely?
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The next thing to do is to get a reasonably well paid job and save as much money as you can for a couple of years or so. In the meantime you can try for sponsorship opportunities (although the chances of getting on to one of those schemes are less than favourable with AS qualifications).
If you can get your hands on 55K though, go straight to an approved flying school and get yourself a JAA CPL/IR with frozen ATPL.
Remember there are no formal educational requirements for pilots (although it helps) other than the CPL/IR with ATPL.
[ 22 July 2001: Message edited by: Seth Gecko ]
If you can get your hands on 55K though, go straight to an approved flying school and get yourself a JAA CPL/IR with frozen ATPL.
Remember there are no formal educational requirements for pilots (although it helps) other than the CPL/IR with ATPL.
[ 22 July 2001: Message edited by: Seth Gecko ]
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Come on people - liquidhockey did say the decision has been made! We don't even know if the decision is in his/her control!
Liquidhockey - Assuming you don't have £55k stashed away just yet... the way I'm doing it in NZ is in 3 phases (though I'm doing it slowly, as I'm studying as well).
Phase 1: Work and get your PPL at the same time. This will quench your immediate thirst for flying, while not costing the earth.
Phase 2 (where I am now): Work and save for a big stint of training to get a plain CPL (in NZ no-one will employ a 250hr pilot on twins - in the UK you might want a MEIR and frozen ATPL?)
Keep current with as much cost-sharing flying as you can get. Take your friends, your friend's friends and your friend's friend's friends, though don't piss anyone off by twisting their arm! Cost sharing is great as you get to go wherever you want for 1/4 of the price - a great way to build hours (and it is possible - I've got 35 cost sharing hours, with another 15 or so in the pipeline).
Phase 3: Train for CPL with cash saved, and either find a job or do an instructor rating and find a job.
From there it's just a matter of getting hours, an MEIR, a twin job, and climbing the ladder as high as you want to go
Hope that helps - make yourself a timeline of what you're doing and when. Work as much as you can, live frugally, and above all STICK TO IT and you'll make it eventually!!
Dupre.
Liquidhockey - Assuming you don't have £55k stashed away just yet... the way I'm doing it in NZ is in 3 phases (though I'm doing it slowly, as I'm studying as well).
Phase 1: Work and get your PPL at the same time. This will quench your immediate thirst for flying, while not costing the earth.
Phase 2 (where I am now): Work and save for a big stint of training to get a plain CPL (in NZ no-one will employ a 250hr pilot on twins - in the UK you might want a MEIR and frozen ATPL?)
Keep current with as much cost-sharing flying as you can get. Take your friends, your friend's friends and your friend's friend's friends, though don't piss anyone off by twisting their arm! Cost sharing is great as you get to go wherever you want for 1/4 of the price - a great way to build hours (and it is possible - I've got 35 cost sharing hours, with another 15 or so in the pipeline).
Phase 3: Train for CPL with cash saved, and either find a job or do an instructor rating and find a job.
From there it's just a matter of getting hours, an MEIR, a twin job, and climbing the ladder as high as you want to go
Hope that helps - make yourself a timeline of what you're doing and when. Work as much as you can, live frugally, and above all STICK TO IT and you'll make it eventually!!
Dupre.
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LH
Well, you have ruled out sponsorship due to your lack of qualifications, that does not make you a bad person, but it’s a fact, but not the end of the World
You now have to accept, like most student pilots, that you are on that well worn money trail. There is no other way round it you will have to find a way to pay your way through your own training.
So, two questions to ask yourself…and give yourself honest answers or you will pay the price later on.
1 Do you have the academic skills and ability to study HARD for the ATPLS? The college work you are giving up is a breeze compared to what you are about to take on!
2 Can you raise the money to start and FINISH what will be a long hard expensive slog. Whatever anyone tells you add at least 15% for living expenses, re-sits, exams, tests, equipment etc etc etc!
As has been said earlier, age is on your side in many ways, and against you in others, so,… take your time.
I would suggest that modular is your best route. Stop at CPL and do some instructing. Build some hours, experience, some money then do your IR (you’ll have 3 years). You will then have the hours, the age and experience on your side to start looking for Airline work. IMO to go integrated and come out with 250hrs at 18 puts you pretty low down the list of airline candidates. I expect to be shot down in flames for that, and yes I know there are exceptions.
Your problem is not so much which route to take, but how to find the money an lots of it!.
Good luck
Well, you have ruled out sponsorship due to your lack of qualifications, that does not make you a bad person, but it’s a fact, but not the end of the World
You now have to accept, like most student pilots, that you are on that well worn money trail. There is no other way round it you will have to find a way to pay your way through your own training.
So, two questions to ask yourself…and give yourself honest answers or you will pay the price later on.
1 Do you have the academic skills and ability to study HARD for the ATPLS? The college work you are giving up is a breeze compared to what you are about to take on!
2 Can you raise the money to start and FINISH what will be a long hard expensive slog. Whatever anyone tells you add at least 15% for living expenses, re-sits, exams, tests, equipment etc etc etc!
As has been said earlier, age is on your side in many ways, and against you in others, so,… take your time.
I would suggest that modular is your best route. Stop at CPL and do some instructing. Build some hours, experience, some money then do your IR (you’ll have 3 years). You will then have the hours, the age and experience on your side to start looking for Airline work. IMO to go integrated and come out with 250hrs at 18 puts you pretty low down the list of airline candidates. I expect to be shot down in flames for that, and yes I know there are exceptions.
Your problem is not so much which route to take, but how to find the money an lots of it!.
Good luck
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Liquidhockey, with respect you are either making one of the boldest decisions of your life, or the biggest mistake. You may be too physically close to that decision to realise it.
So therefore, if you are being offered feedback, it is best to accept it in a non-defensive manner. I use those words carefully, they come straight from a document used in my airline to highlight some of the traits demonstrated by an effective crew member. Would you choose to fly with someone whose position was "I've made my mind up and will not change it on receiving further information" with regard to a dynamically evolving situation, like the working environment you want to enter?
I wish you luck, but caution that you turn down advice offered on this board, freely and with good intentions, at your peril. From my personal take, going only on the wording in your post above and not knowing any other background I would step back and reconsider for a while, a week, a month whatever.. a flying job does not happen overnight, and you must manouever yourself into the correct position before you even enter the frame. By restricting yourself academically you close many more doors than you open for a flying job.
Once again, good luck, but believe me decisions that can seem so clearcut one day can look so foolish the next. I've been there before.
£6
[ 22 July 2001: Message edited by: Sick Squid ]
So therefore, if you are being offered feedback, it is best to accept it in a non-defensive manner. I use those words carefully, they come straight from a document used in my airline to highlight some of the traits demonstrated by an effective crew member. Would you choose to fly with someone whose position was "I've made my mind up and will not change it on receiving further information" with regard to a dynamically evolving situation, like the working environment you want to enter?
I wish you luck, but caution that you turn down advice offered on this board, freely and with good intentions, at your peril. From my personal take, going only on the wording in your post above and not knowing any other background I would step back and reconsider for a while, a week, a month whatever.. a flying job does not happen overnight, and you must manouever yourself into the correct position before you even enter the frame. By restricting yourself academically you close many more doors than you open for a flying job.
Once again, good luck, but believe me decisions that can seem so clearcut one day can look so foolish the next. I've been there before.
£6
[ 22 July 2001: Message edited by: Sick Squid ]
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Lets not be too hard on this lad!
Hes made his decision (or his parents have) to leave college with AS-levels. Lets face it, the purpose of A-Levels is really to allow entrance into University. Yes I'm aware BA and RAF require two A-levels. However, most jobs want either GCSEs or a degree in a related subject. Thus if you intend to leave anyway with A-levels and not go to university its not such a tragedy. I am aware that education is never lost, broadens horizons and helps self study skills - important for those ATPLs! However, its not the end of the world though!!
Liquid you should really have had a sound battle plan worked out before leaving, but sometimes you have to take stock of the situation and take time out to think what youre going to do next.
I was in a similar position to yourself, although much further down the education path in the realms of postgrad. I made a break from that because I was deeply depressed and now I'm happy earning money towards my flying.
Hope everything works out for you.
Tarmach.
Hes made his decision (or his parents have) to leave college with AS-levels. Lets face it, the purpose of A-Levels is really to allow entrance into University. Yes I'm aware BA and RAF require two A-levels. However, most jobs want either GCSEs or a degree in a related subject. Thus if you intend to leave anyway with A-levels and not go to university its not such a tragedy. I am aware that education is never lost, broadens horizons and helps self study skills - important for those ATPLs! However, its not the end of the world though!!
Liquid you should really have had a sound battle plan worked out before leaving, but sometimes you have to take stock of the situation and take time out to think what youre going to do next.
I was in a similar position to yourself, although much further down the education path in the realms of postgrad. I made a break from that because I was deeply depressed and now I'm happy earning money towards my flying.
Hope everything works out for you.
Tarmach.
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Liquid Hockey,
This may seem harsh, but quitting college to become a pilot 'not having a clue where to start' is absurd.
I assume you can quit because you've got £55k in the bank for an Integrated ATPL course? If so I take it back. If not, why not just continue for 1-2 years (or how ever long you have left) just to apply for sponsorship. Even if unsuccessful with sponsorship get a good job and start saving.
I know you seem to have made up your mind but please think again.
If you are so sure however, start reading up on the modular route to a CPL/IR which will cost you around £30-40K (thats the cheaper option).
JT8
This may seem harsh, but quitting college to become a pilot 'not having a clue where to start' is absurd.
I assume you can quit because you've got £55k in the bank for an Integrated ATPL course? If so I take it back. If not, why not just continue for 1-2 years (or how ever long you have left) just to apply for sponsorship. Even if unsuccessful with sponsorship get a good job and start saving.
I know you seem to have made up your mind but please think again.
If you are so sure however, start reading up on the modular route to a CPL/IR which will cost you around £30-40K (thats the cheaper option).
JT8
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It seems that the general concensus is that you should reconsider your decision to leave college. Even suppposedly final decisions can be reversed!
Unless you have hit the principal or something similar, swallow your pride and get back to college. 3 or 4 years can appear an extremely long time when you are 18 years old or so, but in reality it isn't.
Unless you have the necessary £30-55k sitting around you will either need sponsorship or a decent job.
Unless the job market has changed since I left full time education, I don't see how you will be able to land a job that will fund your aspirations without further qualifications or a good deal of time working your way up from the bottom.
Working at McDonalds would be as good for your flying aspirations as it would be for your skin - I know, I worked there whilst studying for my A Levels.
Sometimes when you ask for advice, you don't always hear what you wanted. Knowing very little about you, I'd say you've made a mistake.
Don't be in such a rush. Play the percentage game - stay in full time education as long as you can, and enjoy it. You will be at work for 35 years plus anyway. That's enough for anybody.
Unless you have hit the principal or something similar, swallow your pride and get back to college. 3 or 4 years can appear an extremely long time when you are 18 years old or so, but in reality it isn't.
Unless you have the necessary £30-55k sitting around you will either need sponsorship or a decent job.
Unless the job market has changed since I left full time education, I don't see how you will be able to land a job that will fund your aspirations without further qualifications or a good deal of time working your way up from the bottom.
Working at McDonalds would be as good for your flying aspirations as it would be for your skin - I know, I worked there whilst studying for my A Levels.
Sometimes when you ask for advice, you don't always hear what you wanted. Knowing very little about you, I'd say you've made a mistake.
Don't be in such a rush. Play the percentage game - stay in full time education as long as you can, and enjoy it. You will be at work for 35 years plus anyway. That's enough for anybody.
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Liquid Hockey,
You say the decision has been made, as though that means it's set in stone and can't be changed.
When flying, one frequently has to change decisions that have been made, sometimes when you really really don't want to. One also has to listen to others, again, even when they're saying what you don't want to hear.
Are you sure you have that flexibity and maturity? I'm only asking, that's all.
You say the decision has been made, as though that means it's set in stone and can't be changed.
When flying, one frequently has to change decisions that have been made, sometimes when you really really don't want to. One also has to listen to others, again, even when they're saying what you don't want to hear.
Are you sure you have that flexibity and maturity? I'm only asking, that's all.
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Alright LH,
I was on the same boat as you 1 month ago,(I am 18 in three weeks)
I was wanting to start learning to fly as soon as i could gaining my CPL as quick as possible and getting a job (instructing)
(only getting a lesson around once a month)
but i was thinking if i left college i would work for a year(already been offered a job with BT customer services which was good money for my age(clearing 260 a week)
I thought great I will go to florida in a year for the CPL req course.
But with some mates urging me to stay on at college for my Higher National Diploma in Aeronautical Engineering i decided the saving up for flying can wait 1 year and I am now staying on (even though facing not flying of to florida till Im almost 20)
The only bad bit is my mates are all driving about in corsa SRI's and done up motors whilst Im trying to save up for flying but I know that when they are working as the ground engineer for BA(if they can even get that far) at manchester and I fly in as the first officer in a BA 757 they will see me getting in my TVR with my pilots uniform on
You still driving that corsa mate
HA HA HA HA
you could wait to
send me an email mate
See ya later people
I was on the same boat as you 1 month ago,(I am 18 in three weeks)
I was wanting to start learning to fly as soon as i could gaining my CPL as quick as possible and getting a job (instructing)
(only getting a lesson around once a month)
but i was thinking if i left college i would work for a year(already been offered a job with BT customer services which was good money for my age(clearing 260 a week)
I thought great I will go to florida in a year for the CPL req course.
But with some mates urging me to stay on at college for my Higher National Diploma in Aeronautical Engineering i decided the saving up for flying can wait 1 year and I am now staying on (even though facing not flying of to florida till Im almost 20)
The only bad bit is my mates are all driving about in corsa SRI's and done up motors whilst Im trying to save up for flying but I know that when they are working as the ground engineer for BA(if they can even get that far) at manchester and I fly in as the first officer in a BA 757 they will see me getting in my TVR with my pilots uniform on
You still driving that corsa mate
HA HA HA HA
you could wait to
send me an email mate
See ya later people
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well i do have an idea so its not such an absurd idea like some of you have said.
here is roughly what i am thinking of doing.
A)go straight to work and start earning the pennys and eventually do my ppl.
B)Go back to work and earn around 10k. goto the banks and get 1/2loans to boost it up to 30k.
C)Use the money and do my CPL/ATPL/IR/MCC and possibly an instructers course.
D) Go back to work/intructing and apply to every airline and cargo airline on the earth!
Ok does that sound like a good action plan? and dont say no because i havent got my a-levels.
Cheers
Dave
here is roughly what i am thinking of doing.
A)go straight to work and start earning the pennys and eventually do my ppl.
B)Go back to work and earn around 10k. goto the banks and get 1/2loans to boost it up to 30k.
C)Use the money and do my CPL/ATPL/IR/MCC and possibly an instructers course.
D) Go back to work/intructing and apply to every airline and cargo airline on the earth!
Ok does that sound like a good action plan? and dont say no because i havent got my a-levels.
Cheers
Dave
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dont say no because i havent got my a-levels
Why would an airline hire you when they can hire another pilot with equal potential who has also demonstrated the ability to pass a higher level of academic studies?
Better question: Why are you so strongly against higher education, especially when you've learned through these pages that it will actually HELP you get an airline job?
I'm not telling you to go back to college. BUT, you will be doing yourself a huge disservice if you think that you will be on equal footing with other applicants.
[ 22 July 2001: Message edited by: AA76757 ]
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I wish you the very best of luck LH. Before you embark on the course of action you have stated, it is probably wise to get a class one medical. Also it might be prudent to complete a GAPAN test. I am not personally familiar with these tests but from what others say, they give you a good indication as to whether or not you have the potential to become a pilot. A little financial outlay now will be much better than spending alot of money down the track only to find you will not be able to make the grade either medically or in a flying sense (some people just can't).
It will get hard, and people will tell you you are mad to spend all that money just to become a pilot. But ignore the detractors and give it all you have got, it will be worth it in the end. Good luck once again
[ 23 July 2001: Message edited by: Seth Gecko ]
It will get hard, and people will tell you you are mad to spend all that money just to become a pilot. But ignore the detractors and give it all you have got, it will be worth it in the end. Good luck once again
[ 23 July 2001: Message edited by: Seth Gecko ]
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LH
Sadly, what has become evident during this thread, is the complete and utter lack of homework done on your part before dumping college to become a pilot.
For someone who has made such a dramatic and potentially expensive career/education decision, you appear to know very little about what’s involved…now is not the time to be finding out!!!
There seems to be a lot of ‘cart before the horse’ going on here!
Before you go any further I would suggest that you at least read Clive Hughes book on how to become an Airline Pilot ( use the search function, there is a recent and current post). Then, as has been stated, GET A CLASS ! before you spend a penny.
(please don’t come back and ask how you do that!)
If you do go on to train as a commercial pilot, one thing you will have to learn is never again to say, ‘I’ve made my decision what next?’. Decisions are made based on available information NOT the other way around!!!!
Sorry to be so blunt, but you do not appear to be listening to any of the sound advice given here…..slow down my friend!
[ 23 July 2001: Message edited by: clear prop!!! ]
Sadly, what has become evident during this thread, is the complete and utter lack of homework done on your part before dumping college to become a pilot.
For someone who has made such a dramatic and potentially expensive career/education decision, you appear to know very little about what’s involved…now is not the time to be finding out!!!
There seems to be a lot of ‘cart before the horse’ going on here!
Before you go any further I would suggest that you at least read Clive Hughes book on how to become an Airline Pilot ( use the search function, there is a recent and current post). Then, as has been stated, GET A CLASS ! before you spend a penny.
(please don’t come back and ask how you do that!)
If you do go on to train as a commercial pilot, one thing you will have to learn is never again to say, ‘I’ve made my decision what next?’. Decisions are made based on available information NOT the other way around!!!!
Sorry to be so blunt, but you do not appear to be listening to any of the sound advice given here…..slow down my friend!
[ 23 July 2001: Message edited by: clear prop!!! ]