Professional Pilot Training (includes ground studies)A forum for those on the steep path to that coveted professional licence. Whether studying for the written exams, training for the flight tests or building experience here's where you can hang out.
@flyhelico.. not exactly a constructive comment mate.
i studied long and hard to get through my assessments so i'm pretty sure that's why i was accepted. it was a test for me not them, to see if i had the aptitude for it before i spent my own had earned money!
..even then i wasn't about to dive in without considering other options.
Would all of the above like to add some credibility to the point of this thread and state your current employment status and earnings?
I spent around £45k all in (see post 23). Finished the IR in late 2007, aged 36, with a whopping 220hrs under my belt. Q400 job offer early 2008, no charges for the type rating, uniform, crew water etc, just a 3 year bond on the TR.
Today I’m still on the Dash, and average take home is around £2,100 per month. Not a fortune, but I consider myself extremely fortunate to have a job (and if I was obsessed with earnings I'd have stayed in my previous career).
Before we all pull them out and see how high we can pee, the fact that I had trained modular rather than integrated was largely irrelevant to my airline (in fact, on my TR course there was pretty much a 50/50 split between integrated and modular people). Rather more importantly:
(a) Every low-hours candidate had been recommended by his or her school, and therefore had a sound and verifiable training record.
(b) They were then recruiting at least 10 FOs per month, meaning jobs were (relatively) plentiful.
We’re not recruiting at the moment, which means your choice of school and training route is pretty academic. However, if anyone insists on training right now – and God knows how long some of the more experienced people have been saying “Don’t do it” – then by choosing modular, you will:
(a) Save a considerable amount of money compared to integrated.
(b) Have the opportunity to train part time and thus work to finance your training.
(c) Be able to slow down or even accelerate your training to match the job market.
(d) End up with exactly the same licence at the end of it all.
Some time ago, I was a slave of the integrated pr tricks as you may remember. But along the way I thought about it and researched and now I have understod that my future will be so much brighter, if I go modular. I thank you very much for spending the times arguing with me in the long posts hehe.
Anyway I am not an expert on this area. I´ve completed my PPL and as I am 18 years old now, I still have one year left in upper secondary school. If I would be starting training now, I would go for modular instantly, regarding the situation we are in nowdays. But the industry tend to change. I mean, I will most likely start my training some time between September 2011 and January 2012. What if during that time + the time it takes for me to complete my training, everything will change and the big boys will start hiiring again. BA wil open it´s OAA program again etc. And let´s say the industry will start rolling again slowly during my training and I will end up, graduating when it has turned for the worse once again.
What I´m saying is. Modular is the best option now when there is no jobs and you want your training to go slow. But will it be the best later on when maybe, the airlines starts hiiring again?
This is the idea I have gotten now through many people that support integrated. Is there any truth to this or is it just pure bullshit?
Didnt read all the pages of this thread however got the gist:
Hope my info helps peeps save money, I found it the best value for money (so far)
Do PPL(A) and PPL (H) £££ depends on you I supose
ATPL Ground school is just 1 more exam now so an extra £66 £3k total
The nice thing is now....get your IR and CPL on the fixed wing then take advantage of the dispensations given by the CAA towards the ATPL H. IR is a 10 hour conversion pluss a type rating (budget £30k depending how good you are) CPL you only need 105 hours.
Not for every one I supose, but not a bad way of grabbing a really usefull ticket to ride, it also gives you great versatility in the market.
Good luck all! and dont forget.....its only money!
DO Oxford or jerez offer integrated courses skipping ATPL
No they do not.
The reason for a zero2hero course is to provide a consistent structure of study through which individual performance can be constantly monitored. When the airlines decide to look at hiring ab-initio guys they can see how each has fared and developed in an intensive learning environment. A seemless training program - it is hoped - minimises airline training risk.
The notion of doing an integrated program is, in this current climate, a little optimistic since the airlines are not hiring ab-initio directly at the moment anyway (regardless of what the likes of OAA will tell you)...not unless you've got another £30K odd to spend on a limited PTF program that is.
With regards to Modular students: G SXTY is a good example of success. If I'm right in thinking, the airline he/she works for and at the time of hiring actually rejected a batch of "recommended" integrated students a while back because they were so poor - and yet they originated from a well known FTO. They took modular guys instead. This same airline, at the time of hiring, openly welcomed applications from modular guys who had trained at not more than 2 FTOs.
There are requirements to do modular flight training (none for ATPL theorey) with OAA and Jerez and you may want to check LASORS for them.
I've just seen my post has been made in to a sticky, which was not intentional!
I completed my MCC at European in Bournemouth in June last year, all the training was done with out any time off inbetween, the hour building was slightly longer than I hoped due to the typical northern weather between September and Feb.
For my training I appreciate it was still not the cheapest way to get the pieces of paper, however I wanted to do all my training within the UK, as it was important for me to train in the UK airspace, with the weather and to get the most out of it. I had heard of peoples experiences that being shipped off to the States was not as promised in the PPL brochures (the ones with 737s glossy pictures on the front!) I looked around 3/4 flying schools before selecting the right one, you can't really do that in America..
The costs I initially put up are current to this day, and I think if I were to do it again I could make it cheaper with the PPL on a Cessna 150/152, and make sandwiches rather than have all day breakfasts for lunch!
PPL, go for a simple 2 seater. Groundschool, checkout groundschools for offers - or possibly distance learn? Hour building, buy in to a 100hr building package. CPL/IR - If you are going for a multi-engine rating, I would suggest doing the CPL.IR all in the multi, otherwise you will be learning to fly two aircraft. Keep it simple! MCC - 737-200 at European in Bournemouth can not be beaten! Top quality course, lower prices than some static King Air sims, Instructors who can not be beaten on knowledge, and lets face it you have a go in a 737 for the first time!
Accommodation whilst doing the full time ATPL groundschool, some guys I knew hired their own house during the time and shared the costs between them, worked out very cheap, and shared lifts to/from the airport.
These are my thoughts, some of you I am sure will have better/different views!
And if I get my PPL in a local flying club, does this count as a 'school'?
Yes, it does. However, if where you get your PPL from isnt able to accommodate next stages of training i.e. MECPL/ME-IR then no problem. Simply ensure that all the remainder is done in one place.
Employers are not so happy to see PPL done at one school, MECPL done at another, then ME-IR at another school with MCC done at a 4th school!! As said before they want to be able to track your progress from one source with a view to minimising training risk.
If you are going to train commercially attempt to do it all in one place and committ to it full time so you benefit from that continuity of training.
hi everyone New here on this forum, not a professional pilot yet, but looking closely to start training in a month or so.
Sounds a good argument everyone has going on here, been scanning through an i think the modular way will be the route im going to take. been looking at doing from 'zero to hero' at flight academy blackpool, which at the moment have just started a scheduled modular course.
would just like a few pilots opinion on this flight school, are they successful? a recognise school with airlines? and does it seem worth going for, hopefully to complete in 4 years time?
Basically, you do all your training in the states under an FAA PPL, add the ratings on to it as you go and then convert the lot to a JAA licence at the end in stapleford...
Oh, the only thing missing from that is you have to do the JAA ATPL exams seperately before you can convert, but it is possible to do those on the cheap post-ppl on the side...
I know PTC (waterford, ireland) do something similar as an integrated course and it still magically works out at some ridiculous figure too...
So im wondering... has anyone tried a route similar to this and actually gotten a job from it?
By the way, for disparity, im not talking about doing your JAA training course in the states directly like they do at Naples or Ormond Beach. I'm talking about doing your training under an FAA licence and then converting that...
I have been researching training options for quite some time and have been told many a time that the Airlines prefer students fresh out of integrated courses. Is this not true? I was told at a recent seminar that BA for example take the top 2-3 students from integrated courses conducted by Oxford, Cabair, CTC and FTE.
I would much rather pay twice the price for an Integrated course if it gave me a better chance of getting a job at the end of it.