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Modular V Integrated (Merged) - Look here before starting a new thread!

Professional Pilot Training (includes ground studies) A forum for those on the steep path to that coveted professional licence. Whether studying for the written exams, training for the flight tests or building experience here's where you can hang out.

Modular V Integrated (Merged) - Look here before starting a new thread!

Old 26th Apr 2011, 13:18
  #261 (permalink)  
 
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So some good posts since I last looked in.

For the hard of reading, what I and several other sensible posters were alluding to, is that you [by which I mean "the general reader looking for advice as to how/where to start" - not any specific individual] CAN cut down on the standard 15 months of an integrated course by going at your own pace. Of course you can. However, I would think it very foolish to base any planning around being ABLE to do so. Integrated courses are approx 15 months from start to finish. This is not because the schools have a vested interest in keeping you there longer - in fact in pure business terms, it's MORE in their interests to get rid of you sooner. It's because HISTORY SHOWS THAT'S HOW LONG IT TAKES A NOMINALLY ABLE PERSON TO COMPLETE THE TRAINING SATISFACTORILY.

You - dear reader- may of course be one of those that just finds it really easy and breezes through and in so doing could complete in 8/9 or 10 months. Equally, you could be one of those who REALLY struggles with non precision approaches, or just can't get PFLs right. YOU could be the one who needs 18/19 or 20 months.

The point is I would question the sanity of anyone who without prior indication that they could do it quicker than a normal full time course of study, planned for completing in less than 15 months. Plan for 15 months full time and take it as a considerable bonus if you can complete earlier.

As ANYONE that has trodden the weary path to CPL/ME/IR will tell you, there is a LOT of very hard work ahead of you when you set out. Much of it does not and will not sink in "straight away" - both the flying aspects and certainly the ground school.

This is why *I* think it's probably unwise to be trying to learn what the industry experts (by which I mean just about everyone that offers full time ATPL learning as a course) reckon will take six months of VERY hard graft at the same time as trying to learn to fly a plane. This is why *I* would be very dubious indeed of anyone who said that they'd gone from 0-(f)ATPL in only 8 months.

The simily with cooking is actually quite good. The only additional point I'd make is that all should remember that Gordon Ramsey can probably whip up a gourmet delight in a fraction of the time most of us could whip up bangers and mash....a lot depends on your ability.

Mod or integrated, the best advice you can get is it's about what works for YOU. Just be very sure at the outset that you FULLY understand ALL of the implications of whatever route you tread.
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Old 29th Apr 2011, 16:29
  #262 (permalink)  
 
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I'm only 16, so have 2 years to choose
Ha ha ha. No, mate, you don't have to make a decision so soon. You could get some life experience, save some money and then commit yourself to a flying career.
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Old 29th Apr 2011, 17:45
  #263 (permalink)  

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Jambone,

You have time on your side. Which is a good thing. The question only you can answer is what sort of career do you want?

Do you want to go straight from full time flying school straight to a RHS of a jet but potentially with a massive debt and a contract that is more like indentured servitude? (see the easyJet MPL thread...)
One of my colleagues was a BA cadet, did 13 years with them and was bored silly. He went to GA.

Or do you want the opportunity to do "other" things with your flying before pitching up to the airline offer (if ever?)?

Whichever one you decide, work hard at getting the best A levels you can, do some team sport stuff (good for leadership and working in a team etc).
Then get a job for at least a year. Do any thing that earns money. This will teach you the value of labour for pay. This will help you realise when employers are taking the p!ss, a very useful skill to have in the aviation industry.

I'll hold my hand up and say I am a bizjet pilot and love it.
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Old 30th Apr 2011, 12:25
  #264 (permalink)  

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Interesting.
Have you thought about what sort of work you'll be doing in order to pay for the flight training? It's not cheap in case you haven't noticed.
Going modular will take a few years if money is in short supply. (I am assuming it will be - ie no money from the Bank of Mum and Dad)

You realise that the IR needs renewing as well? So I am curious as to your plan to go to uni post flight training. As you know, uni isn't cheap either.

At the moment and possibly for the next couple of years, a full time course seems to be the "only way in" to the 2 airlines that have been recruiting low houred pilots. (Namely Ryanair and easyJet) This may change, but no one knows when. Bizjets rarely take low houred pilots unless you know someone and have another skill to bring to the party.

For the time being, focus on getting good A levels and saving as much cash as possible. By the time you are ready to begin flight training, the market may have changed.
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Old 30th Apr 2011, 13:21
  #265 (permalink)  

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Sounds feasible. As usual, before spending a penny, check you're not colourblind or have diabetes etc.
In 2 years time, things hopefully will be on the rise for low houred pilots but you seem to have a plan there.
Earn some money and work hard on those A levels in the mean time.
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Old 1st May 2011, 19:14
  #266 (permalink)  
 
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Learning

I am a seventeen year old Jewish boy who is religious. This means I can't work on Friday afternoons and Saturday. Is it possible for me to become a commercial pilot with an established airline.

Thanks
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Old 8th May 2011, 11:00
  #267 (permalink)  
 
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Hey!

I've done a little looking around for you and didn't turn up anything substantial, I imagine it's hard seeing as pilots have rough hours and I know the Shabbat doesn't allow jewish people to work, drive, and in some terms even cook, so if you were following your religion to the letter I'd guess your options as a CPL would be things like flight instruction where you could just not work on those days. Now that I think about it, Israir must have a fair few non-jewish pilots to be able to operate all week round and would probably be your best bet in terms of employment with an airline, I've tried looking for a careers page but didn't turn up anything, it seems they have no job openings at the moment, but it might be worth emailing them and asking them the T&C's of their pilot jobs as a jewish pilot and whether they are cool with it

Google Translate

Israir Airlines & Tourism Ltd.: Private Company Information - BusinessWeek
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Old 10th May 2011, 20:24
  #268 (permalink)  
 
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modular expenses

Airberlin2010 can i ask where you did your modular building?
30000 seems cheap and money is a bit tight at the moment... thanks
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Old 26th May 2011, 23:02
  #269 (permalink)  
 
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HEP

i i have just read your very interesting feed about the costs you incurred in training, can i enquire what you thought about the CATS online course? How did you find it? I also see that you have done training just about everywhere, do you have any advice for me, basically i have got my ppl and need to get my atpls done asap so this is my focus at the moment, problem is money as always and i am based in cardiff?

Any help/advice would be very much appreciated
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Old 29th May 2011, 12:33
  #270 (permalink)  
 
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Distance learning is usually the cheapest option for ATPL ground school.

There's a new ATPL distance learning ground school called ProPilot. It was at the Flyer show and has all the ATPL manuals on an i-pad. There's an introductory offer on at the mo. It's another option for anyone considering the modular route.

Last edited by Matron; 30th May 2011 at 18:54.
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Old 29th Jun 2011, 10:37
  #271 (permalink)  
 
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Hi i really want to do one of these courses. Im now looking at getting my PPL ad have seen some places in essex/london areas but does anyone the best cheapest place to get my license? Also could someone explain to me what the difference is between modular and integrated?

Do i need good exam results to do any courses to become a commercial pilot? I was expected to get good results but i didnt do too well in the exams and was wondering will that effect my dream of becoming a pilot? If so does anybody know how and where i can redo my exams?

Thanks in Advance
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Old 29th Jun 2011, 11:29
  #272 (permalink)  
 
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Im so confused with all of this.

Can somebody tell me what the pilot ratings are and how you get them and what different ratings there are?

Ive searched all over the internet but cant find anything.
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Old 29th Jun 2011, 13:58
  #273 (permalink)  
 
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...oh boy

Well the first thing you need to understand is the difference between a licence and a rating.

Licenses:
NPPL
PPL
CPL
ATPL

Ratings:
SEP
Night
MEP
Twin
IR
Type Ratings eg (Dash 8, B373 etc)
Others include: tailwheel, seaplane

To fly you need a licence + a rating ie when you initially fly privately you have a PPL + SEP.

To get a job in the RHS you generally need what is called a frozen ATPL which consists (from zero hours);

Modular: PPL + Night + ATPL ground exams + CPL + Twin + IR + MCC (Multi-crew course)
Integrated: All of the above training thrown in together to get an f/ATPL

There are various hours requirements at each stage as well as a 300 nm cross country flight to get issued with your CPL.

Modular schools will sell you the individual bits, Integrated schools the whole shabang.

There is also the MPL but that is only airline sponsored, I believe
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Old 10th Jul 2011, 09:40
  #274 (permalink)  
 
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Best starting point...

Hello all,

I've been reading this forum with great interest for the last few months and i apologise if this topic has come up before..(which I am sure it has somewhere)

I am starting the modular route this September beginning with the humble PPL. I was just wondering if anyone can give some advice on the best way to do this..it seems a popular option to go to the US to do it in 4 weeks (having done the ground exams beforehand) but my online research doesn't show a massive saving in cost compared to the UK when you take account of return airfares, living costs etc...

Am I missing something? Is there a flight school that offers a competitive deal?

I'm looking at around 6,500 for the course here in Scotland. (45 hrs)

Regards,
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Old 10th Jul 2011, 10:28
  #275 (permalink)  
 
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Rupert, I do believe that if you do everything in the U.S. and then you convert the FAA ratings and licences to JAA it will be cheaper.
Bristol Fligh Centre has good prices to convert the FAA licences to UK CAA/JAA.

Some schools have their homes where you can stay for the lenght of your training. Just give a look around.
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Old 11th Jul 2011, 21:07
  #276 (permalink)  
 
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Rupert,

I did my PPL in the US. The main advantage is that if you set out to get your PPL in 4 weeks and choose somewhere with good weather, you can do it. In the UK if you are unlucky with weather it can take much longer. The main disadvantage is that when you get back you have to get used to UK airspace, radio, etc which takes a little while.

On the cost side, I'm not sure if there are still cost savings to be made so when you are doing the comparison make sure to add in the extras like accomodation, books, exam fees, visas, and conversion / signoff costs (see below)...

In some places in the US you get a CAA (UK) PPL but there is less demand so fewer schools to choose from.

If you get an FAA PPL you have many more choices of where to learn. Currently you can fly in the UK on an FAA PPL. You'll need a few hours of dual time to rent privately so take this into account when calculating your costs. If you plan to fly on your FAA PPL you will also need to get a radio licence: in the US there isn't any separate radio licence (it's part of the PPL) but in the UK you need a separate document. You can get a standalone UK radio licence or get a document issued by the (US) FCC. (Both will involve extra costs.) When the EASA (EU) rules come into place I don't think it will be possible to fly on an FAA PPL any more (I don't claim to be expert on this so others on the forum should correct me if needed).

If you get an FAA PPL and plan to convert, there are different processes depending on how many hours you have. If you convert with less than 100 hours of flying time, you will need to sit all 7 UK PPL theory exams as well as do the checkride. If you have more than 100 hours, you only need to sit 3 exams and do the checkride.

I hope that helps.
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Old 12th Jul 2011, 15:22
  #277 (permalink)  
 
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Thanks very much for your info, much appreciated.

At the moment the best flight school I can find is European Flight Training (EFT) based in Fort Pierce, Florida. They offer a good sounding sounding package including the JAA PPL, Radiotelephony course, Night Rating along with 21 days accommodation (the duration of the course)

I am currently getting a few hours logged with the hope of going over and getting my PPL in the minimum time, here's hoping!

EFT seem a reputable school but would be grateful if anyone has any comments or past experiences there.

I plan to head out in October to complete the PPL so I'll be sure to provide anyone with info regarding the school etc...

Regards,
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Old 21st Jul 2011, 14:48
  #278 (permalink)  
 
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Im so confused with all of this.

Can somebody tell me what the pilot ratings are and how you get them and what different ratings there are?

Ive searched all over the internet but cant find anything.
He cracks me up
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Old 29th Jul 2011, 08:13
  #279 (permalink)  
 
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ask your dady for t/r and XXXX hours of line training, and PAY TO WORK until the airline kick you out for the next idiot who believe he will get a paid job!
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Old 25th Aug 2011, 14:43
  #280 (permalink)  
 
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YOU HAVE JUST INSPIRED ME (op).

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