EK Resignations
Join Date: May 2004
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Thanks Don,correct,except we werent "sold" anything,it was forced upon us,without consultation,as usual,but you are quite right,I personally cannot in any form,shape or manner see how it was "cost neutral".
FF,the legal insurance is very new,and we need a min number to sign up,it is extremely cheap 900 dhs/pa,and I know the people involved put much effort in to secure it.
To not take this ,with NO OTHER insurance to help you currently in place,is IMHO an act of supreme folly.
Desert Nomad,you say that EK would have to pay across the board,indeed they should,to RETAIN and attract good quality staff,unless Im mistaken,they continue to make huge profit,so why not "pay the best,to be the best"?
Finally,I meant no disrespect toyou or your colleagues,bums on seats critical,but safety on the flight deck,in poor weather,high workload,can be I assure you fatal.
Agreed,if someone is leaving voice your concern,but such usis the culture here,to do so would result in retribution,IMHO.
And no Seaman,no news ref pay,but again,I think for many damage is done,unless it is corrected soon,significantly.QB
FF,the legal insurance is very new,and we need a min number to sign up,it is extremely cheap 900 dhs/pa,and I know the people involved put much effort in to secure it.
To not take this ,with NO OTHER insurance to help you currently in place,is IMHO an act of supreme folly.
Desert Nomad,you say that EK would have to pay across the board,indeed they should,to RETAIN and attract good quality staff,unless Im mistaken,they continue to make huge profit,so why not "pay the best,to be the best"?
Finally,I meant no disrespect toyou or your colleagues,bums on seats critical,but safety on the flight deck,in poor weather,high workload,can be I assure you fatal.
Agreed,if someone is leaving voice your concern,but such usis the culture here,to do so would result in retribution,IMHO.
And no Seaman,no news ref pay,but again,I think for many damage is done,unless it is corrected soon,significantly.QB
Cast your mind back to SQ6...in deepest darkest South East Asia, on a dark blowy night. Horrible outcome. But without some legal help (in this case IFALPA) The flight deck fellas would still be rotting in some jail.
Now fast forward to some of the lovely spots in the world we get to fly into everyday. If one day you have one of those days, I think this insurance (the legal cover) would be worth its weight in gold. You pay a hell of a lot more than that to insure your car each year. For the sake of a few hours overtime I think the peace of mind is worth it.
Don
Now fast forward to some of the lovely spots in the world we get to fly into everyday. If one day you have one of those days, I think this insurance (the legal cover) would be worth its weight in gold. You pay a hell of a lot more than that to insure your car each year. For the sake of a few hours overtime I think the peace of mind is worth it.
Don
Last edited by donpizmeov; 2nd May 2005 at 05:04.
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Back to the original thread - anyone got any definitive numbers on resignations last month - I've heard everything from 11 to 26 to 45!
Rumours re pay rise seem to have moved on from 5% up to 10% but to include the increment...anyone know any better?
Rumours re pay rise seem to have moved on from 5% up to 10% but to include the increment...anyone know any better?
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True, two is pretty close to one. However, with 1200 or so pilots, if I know two, chances are there are significantly more than that.
Statistics are bollox anyway, if it's two you're 100% wrong if it's one I'm 100% wrong - the question remains does anyone know the true figure?
Statistics are bollox anyway, if it's two you're 100% wrong if it's one I'm 100% wrong - the question remains does anyone know the true figure?
Last edited by sanddancer; 2nd May 2005 at 10:03.
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330 Man,
I get home from a trip all through the night and I find that you have enlightened me on the ways of the airline industry. If I only had your words of wisdom the trip would not have been so tiring or so long.
For your information I am not the one complaining about you and United dropping your pensions. Have you read the North American section of this forum? Airline pilots from all the airlines in the states feel that you did a huge disservice to them by cancelling your pensions because now their management is demmanding the same from them because they can not compete with the lightier US Air. Does this sound familiar? If not go to the site yourself and weigh in. Also Flight International had an article sometime late last year talking about the pension issues in the states and the downward pressure on pilot groups from other airlines because of your actions. Maybe not you specific but you as in US Air pilot group. I find it hard to believe that someone in your pilot group did not "vote" to shed that huge bonus you had. Did your leadership consult the pilot group and if not why? I guess your pilot group was just thinking of themselves and not the industry as a whole. Typical pilots!
You are right on some accounts though. I have no idea about PBCC and what they did to you or the court actions involving you. All I am going on is what I read, some not entirely accurate but at the same time not lies and falsehoods either.
Where did all that money you put into your pension for 20 years go? Don't tell me that US Air took YOUR money to pay their bills?
Maybe when I get to your age I will have the wisdom and experience that you seem to possess, I can only strive to reach that level. Thanks for the psycho-analyst. If you ever get sick of this job you can move on to higher paying endeavors in the medical field of psychology.
I get home from a trip all through the night and I find that you have enlightened me on the ways of the airline industry. If I only had your words of wisdom the trip would not have been so tiring or so long.
For your information I am not the one complaining about you and United dropping your pensions. Have you read the North American section of this forum? Airline pilots from all the airlines in the states feel that you did a huge disservice to them by cancelling your pensions because now their management is demmanding the same from them because they can not compete with the lightier US Air. Does this sound familiar? If not go to the site yourself and weigh in. Also Flight International had an article sometime late last year talking about the pension issues in the states and the downward pressure on pilot groups from other airlines because of your actions. Maybe not you specific but you as in US Air pilot group. I find it hard to believe that someone in your pilot group did not "vote" to shed that huge bonus you had. Did your leadership consult the pilot group and if not why? I guess your pilot group was just thinking of themselves and not the industry as a whole. Typical pilots!
You are right on some accounts though. I have no idea about PBCC and what they did to you or the court actions involving you. All I am going on is what I read, some not entirely accurate but at the same time not lies and falsehoods either.
Where did all that money you put into your pension for 20 years go? Don't tell me that US Air took YOUR money to pay their bills?
Maybe when I get to your age I will have the wisdom and experience that you seem to possess, I can only strive to reach that level. Thanks for the psycho-analyst. If you ever get sick of this job you can move on to higher paying endeavors in the medical field of psychology.
So Brix (he, boys and girls, is the fella who started the topic), what is the outcome of this story. Did you stay or did you go?
I hope whatever choice you end up making works out ok.
Don
I hope whatever choice you end up making works out ok.
Don
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LHR Rain says:
Maybe when I get to your age I will have the wisdom and experience that you seem to possess, I can only strive to reach that level.
Hopefully you WILL reach that age, but it is apparent from your unwillingness to listen to those who know EXACTLY what they are talking about ( 330 Man and Typhoonpilot ) that you will never posess their wisdom! But keep trying son!
330 heavy
P.S. If you would educate yourself on the intracacies of a Defined
Benefit vs. a Defined Contribution Retirement Plan and how the U.S. laws at that time required them to be funded, ( US Airways was funded to around 47% of the minimum required if I remember correctly) then maybe you would better understand what actually happened. ALPA did NOT give the pilots the chance to vote on the fate of the monies that had "supposedly" been set aside to fund their retirement. It was a last minute decision, made by the M.E.C. and NOT sent to the membership for ratification, based on financial data the company provided to ALPA. If there is blame to be placed, it should lie with the US Airways and ALPA National executive boardmembers, and the airline's mangement. They are the ones who gave away aprox. 75% of the pension.
Oh well, at least it's only money.
--- back to under my rock!
Maybe when I get to your age I will have the wisdom and experience that you seem to possess, I can only strive to reach that level.
Hopefully you WILL reach that age, but it is apparent from your unwillingness to listen to those who know EXACTLY what they are talking about ( 330 Man and Typhoonpilot ) that you will never posess their wisdom! But keep trying son!
330 heavy
P.S. If you would educate yourself on the intracacies of a Defined
Benefit vs. a Defined Contribution Retirement Plan and how the U.S. laws at that time required them to be funded, ( US Airways was funded to around 47% of the minimum required if I remember correctly) then maybe you would better understand what actually happened. ALPA did NOT give the pilots the chance to vote on the fate of the monies that had "supposedly" been set aside to fund their retirement. It was a last minute decision, made by the M.E.C. and NOT sent to the membership for ratification, based on financial data the company provided to ALPA. If there is blame to be placed, it should lie with the US Airways and ALPA National executive boardmembers, and the airline's mangement. They are the ones who gave away aprox. 75% of the pension.
Oh well, at least it's only money.
--- back to under my rock!
Last edited by 330 heavy; 3rd May 2005 at 02:15.
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LHR Rain,
It was a court order, supported by the federal government, and not the pilots that terminated the pension fund.
Practicing Psychology would be a relief when compared to babysitting a know it all like you on the flightdeck. You need to learn to lock and load before pulling the trigger.
My father used to say " never argue with the village idiot. Eventually we will not be able to tell the two of you apart".
You and I are done with this conversation!
Regards,
330 Man
It was a court order, supported by the federal government, and not the pilots that terminated the pension fund.
Practicing Psychology would be a relief when compared to babysitting a know it all like you on the flightdeck. You need to learn to lock and load before pulling the trigger.
My father used to say " never argue with the village idiot. Eventually we will not be able to tell the two of you apart".
You and I are done with this conversation!
Regards,
330 Man
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Meanwhile... back on the thread topic...
You could always try waiting until you are as far away downroute as possible, armed with a fistful of ID90's slope off back to the airport and jump on the first flight to normality, leaving your "allowances" behind for your now "ex-cell mate" along with a small note starting with "Dear F/O..." or "Dear Captain...".
All the while your former uniform, hanging all alone in the hotel bedroom wardrobe, pockets bulging with raw bacon, porn, empty minature spirit bottles, a pocket sized version of the Gideons Bible and reeking of liberally sprinkled alcohol.
It may not get you a good reference but it will give the rest of us something to talk about.
Only kidding!!! But seriously folks who's is the 4 stripe jacket on the comfy chairs outside the FMA's offices? It's lay there for weeks now.
You could always try waiting until you are as far away downroute as possible, armed with a fistful of ID90's slope off back to the airport and jump on the first flight to normality, leaving your "allowances" behind for your now "ex-cell mate" along with a small note starting with "Dear F/O..." or "Dear Captain...".
All the while your former uniform, hanging all alone in the hotel bedroom wardrobe, pockets bulging with raw bacon, porn, empty minature spirit bottles, a pocket sized version of the Gideons Bible and reeking of liberally sprinkled alcohol.
It may not get you a good reference but it will give the rest of us something to talk about.
Only kidding!!! But seriously folks who's is the 4 stripe jacket on the comfy chairs outside the FMA's offices? It's lay there for weeks now.