Atlas/AABO
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Atlas/AABO
Can somebody explain the following?
I find the latest furlough/downgrades about to occur at Atlas a big disappointment for everybody, but specially the newly upgraded Captains. How is it possible that Atlas mainline takes the big hit with 70 furloughs, and several downgrades, and displacements while AABO is only downgrading 3 people, and ZERO furloughs..... Amazing!!!
Scenario 1-
If Atlas is affected AABO should be affected, if everything went by date of hire ALL AABO pilots will be downgraded SAVING ALL mainline Captains, there will still be furloughs, but at least the pain is being shared!!!!
Scenario 2-
If they are to be treated different because of super seniority, then they still need to show downgrades, AND FURLOUGHS proportinate to Atlas. 3 Downgrades is not ENOUGH!!
Any comments? Time to do something!
I find the latest furlough/downgrades about to occur at Atlas a big disappointment for everybody, but specially the newly upgraded Captains. How is it possible that Atlas mainline takes the big hit with 70 furloughs, and several downgrades, and displacements while AABO is only downgrading 3 people, and ZERO furloughs..... Amazing!!!
Scenario 1-
If Atlas is affected AABO should be affected, if everything went by date of hire ALL AABO pilots will be downgraded SAVING ALL mainline Captains, there will still be furloughs, but at least the pain is being shared!!!!
Scenario 2-
If they are to be treated different because of super seniority, then they still need to show downgrades, AND FURLOUGHS proportinate to Atlas. 3 Downgrades is not ENOUGH!!
Any comments? Time to do something!
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My guess is that, with the Democrats in control, and several million out of work in the US, the AABO boys should probably dust off the old CV. Congress will not stand for outsourcing anymore - that goes for MX as well as pilots.
I hope you had a fun few years of flying boyz.
A Teamster consultant, Jack Albertine, has been visiting politicians on the hill for the past two weeks in order to build support. Bob Fisher from United IAD has also attended some of these important meetings. Our aircraft mechanics from California and Massachusetts have been focusing a call in and letter writing campaign on Speaker Pelosi, Senator Boxer and Senator Kennedy. Without the green light from these distinguished politicians our moratorium amendment will not see the light of day.
I hope you had a fun few years of flying boyz.
Teamsters Lobbying Effort
The Teamsters Airline Division remains dedicated to ending foreign aircraft maintenance outsourcing and is fighting for an amendment to the 2009 stimulus package that would place a temporary moratorium on this practice. Captain Bourne will be calling upon all Teamsters to assist in this important effort by signing an on line letter and placing calls to the offices to urge Congressional leaders to support this amendment. A Teamster consultant, Jack Albertine, has been visiting politicians on the hill for the past two weeks in order to build support. Bob Fisher from United IAD has also attended some of these important meetings. Our aircraft mechanics from California and Massachusetts have been focusing a call in and letter writing campaign on Speaker Pelosi, Senator Boxer and Senator Kennedy. Without the green light from these distinguished politicians our moratorium amendment will not see the light of day.
Last edited by Beaver_Driver; 17th Jan 2009 at 00:56.
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It would certainly appear that one of the previous writers (John Galt) comments indicate a total lack of knowledge of the IBT process. Negotiations are done by the local, not the International, headed by Captain Bourne. Hence it would be Local 1224, headed by Joe Muckle, with assistance from his legal staff and the currently appointed Atlas representative who is in place until the membership elects their leadership.
That said, it would also appear that the writer has not availed himself of the information sent to crewmembers this week, in which Bourne and others met with the management of the airline and are working on options.
Anyone familiar with the Atlas CBA would know that the AABO situation has been a thorn for years and worked on by Bourne and his people to no avail because the AABO crewmembers are not covered by the RLA and are foreign contractors to Atlas. Consequently, there is little leverage to force the issue other than what was later agreed to; that no additonal hiring could occur at AABO or any other company the company envisioned offshore unless they were on the Atlas seniority list (read: junior)
It can be easily assumed that the management would have been willing to work a deal to let them go as their individual contracts expired. But given the extensive delays in the merger created by the other pilot group, the AABO people have stayed longer. Had a combined CBA been executed 2 years ago, the AABO types would likely have been gone by now. But given the cost and penalties imposed in the UK when those types of contracts are cancelled early, it's clear management decided to wait.
The real question is this: Will the Polar crewmembers have the courage of their convictions and refuse to join IBT and pay dues or will they stand up and refuse as a group?
What say they?
That said, it would also appear that the writer has not availed himself of the information sent to crewmembers this week, in which Bourne and others met with the management of the airline and are working on options.
Anyone familiar with the Atlas CBA would know that the AABO situation has been a thorn for years and worked on by Bourne and his people to no avail because the AABO crewmembers are not covered by the RLA and are foreign contractors to Atlas. Consequently, there is little leverage to force the issue other than what was later agreed to; that no additonal hiring could occur at AABO or any other company the company envisioned offshore unless they were on the Atlas seniority list (read: junior)
It can be easily assumed that the management would have been willing to work a deal to let them go as their individual contracts expired. But given the extensive delays in the merger created by the other pilot group, the AABO people have stayed longer. Had a combined CBA been executed 2 years ago, the AABO types would likely have been gone by now. But given the cost and penalties imposed in the UK when those types of contracts are cancelled early, it's clear management decided to wait.
The real question is this: Will the Polar crewmembers have the courage of their convictions and refuse to join IBT and pay dues or will they stand up and refuse as a group?
What say they?
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All very true. 44 AABO people left and not one of them senior to the most junior downgraded Captains recently announced by Atlas. Which makes them junior to most of the Polar crew. The boyz have all been told for years that it was time for them to campaign to get on the Atlas roster in seniority order. Now it may be too late.
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I doubt anyone was happy about any part of the Harris award. The no bump no flush was the section that Hair was so upset about. I wonder if he feels the same way now? The real point of this thread though is how the Polar guys feel about having 44 with super-seniority.
Last edited by Beaver_Driver; 17th Jan 2009 at 16:58.
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divide and rule
Go back in history and pull out the books from year 2000/2001 where Mike Citrano, Grant Kashishke, John Kunkell and Mike Bryant designed this monster of AABO/ATLAS. Some of them, still here, and craving more medals to be famous in the hall of fame, they all worked for their masters.
It is upon us to seal this page and put an end to this travesty. An Obama nation can only be successful responding maybe after their 8 year reign ends, as this is not political, is about Capitalism, a society permissive of this acts, in essence to protect the companies, and the thieves, not the slaves. "Controversy of Zion"!
Charity starts at home, neither Captain Bourne as he call himself, nor Joe Muckle can bring any hope, it is incumbent on every pilot left here to bring this joint venture to an end. Citicorp succeeded and yet others may have to follow up, and make no mistake, management at Atlas will look at the most profitable angle of this crisis.
It is upon us to seal this page and put an end to this travesty. An Obama nation can only be successful responding maybe after their 8 year reign ends, as this is not political, is about Capitalism, a society permissive of this acts, in essence to protect the companies, and the thieves, not the slaves. "Controversy of Zion"!
Charity starts at home, neither Captain Bourne as he call himself, nor Joe Muckle can bring any hope, it is incumbent on every pilot left here to bring this joint venture to an end. Citicorp succeeded and yet others may have to follow up, and make no mistake, management at Atlas will look at the most profitable angle of this crisis.
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It seems that beaver driver and icarus are under the impression that a colored president and socialist congress will thwart the musings and downright dishonesty of AAWH/AABO. They won't. All politicians think alike with total disdain for the citizenry. Just when they (the union) think they won, the company will fold and voila, a new one will be on the horizon. I have learned over the years that unions tend to think in 5 year terms, companies think in 30 year terms, therefore the company will always win.
After ALPA and the rumblings from the IBT, with no input from the aggrieved over our already won arbitration, I have little faith that anyone will ever win anything against the slugs at AAWH. It is tough to win when the opponent has no morals.
Pessimistic? Yeah. Hope that I am wrong? Yeah. But what I am seeing there no other outcome at this time.
After ALPA and the rumblings from the IBT, with no input from the aggrieved over our already won arbitration, I have little faith that anyone will ever win anything against the slugs at AAWH. It is tough to win when the opponent has no morals.
Pessimistic? Yeah. Hope that I am wrong? Yeah. But what I am seeing there no other outcome at this time.
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Atlas at Stansted - Furloughs?
Anyone know if Atlas let go crews based at Stansted UK?
If so when and how many?
Just interested as I used to have a friend worked their and I am trying to get in touch with no luck.
Anyone got a contact number or email for Atlas at STN?
If so when and how many?
Just interested as I used to have a friend worked their and I am trying to get in touch with no luck.
Anyone got a contact number or email for Atlas at STN?
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It seems that beaver driver and icarus are under the impression that a colored president and socialist congress will thwart the musings and downright dishonesty of AAWH/AABO. They won't. All politicians think alike with total disdain for the citizenry. Just when they (the union) think they won, the company will fold and voila, a new one will be on the horizon. I have learned over the years that unions tend to think in 5 year terms, companies think in 30 year terms, therefore the company will always win.
After ALPA and the rumblings from the IBT, with no input from the aggrieved over our already won arbitration, I have little faith that anyone will ever win anything against the slugs at AAWH. It is tough to win when the opponent has no morals.
Pessimistic? Yeah. Hope that I am wrong? Yeah. But what I am seeing there no other outcome at this time.
After ALPA and the rumblings from the IBT, with no input from the aggrieved over our already won arbitration, I have little faith that anyone will ever win anything against the slugs at AAWH. It is tough to win when the opponent has no morals.
Pessimistic? Yeah. Hope that I am wrong? Yeah. But what I am seeing there no other outcome at this time.
And still we don't know why you care. You have a better job than you would at Atlas. I guess it is just your nature to keep the beans on the bottom from burning.
Last edited by Beaver_Driver; 18th Jan 2009 at 21:59.
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Just been reading Atlas/Alpa LOA STN vacancies,and I am gobsmacked,how could the Atlas MEC sign away seniority to the AABO contractors, now of course, they want to reneg on it,but why was it signed in the first place.
Nothing against the eurotrash contractors
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Judging from multiple posts and only a thimble full of knowledge in them (mostly wrong) the old misinformation machine has starting up again.
AACS (now AABO) was formed to circumvent European wet leasing laws and as a ready cadre of replacement pilots for the newly formed Atlas union beginning negotiations if they went on strike. British Authorities said BS to the wet leasing circumvention in Europe so that killed one side of that which initiated the new airline GSS (global supply systems).
Atlas kept growing the AACS group and started furloughing mainline Atlas crews later to increase negotiation leverage against the union and group. Their was no status quo since this was a first contract (no title 6 protections) and the Railway Labor Act only works with us based crews so we could not look to any federal help (yet again) to stop the lorenzo tactics. The STN letter of agreement was negotiated originally under the Amussin MEC to try and slow the mainline job losses. It later became part of the final contract as a LOA also under the Bourne MEC which followed the Amussin MEC which could not get their version of the contract passed under membership ratification. Under the Bourne MEC, they were able to get it negotiated were anyone hired had to be on the Atlas ALPA seniority list at any new offshore base that was created by the company and any subsequent hiring at STN halting that particular tactic from repeating by the company. That unfortunately did not include the currently employed AACS/AABO guys already hired. Those guys got their reward of STN super seniority. They were about 170 at the time and are now around 40-50.
During that same time, the company did not let up on the pressure on the Atlas crews and association during negotiations. The company had bought a nearly defunct airline in which they moved about five Atlas aircraft and associated flying contracts over to (PAC), furloughing more Atlas crewmembers while hiring off the street at the newly aquired carrier. More Atlas guys on the street. Later proved out financially that it was another negotiation tactic in the later bankruptcy court discovery a few years later.
So your facts are wrong. Judging from who was giving it out on one side, I'm not surprised. Luckily he is not a factor in the combined group anymore other than being source of discontent.
AACS (now AABO) was formed to circumvent European wet leasing laws and as a ready cadre of replacement pilots for the newly formed Atlas union beginning negotiations if they went on strike. British Authorities said BS to the wet leasing circumvention in Europe so that killed one side of that which initiated the new airline GSS (global supply systems).
Atlas kept growing the AACS group and started furloughing mainline Atlas crews later to increase negotiation leverage against the union and group. Their was no status quo since this was a first contract (no title 6 protections) and the Railway Labor Act only works with us based crews so we could not look to any federal help (yet again) to stop the lorenzo tactics. The STN letter of agreement was negotiated originally under the Amussin MEC to try and slow the mainline job losses. It later became part of the final contract as a LOA also under the Bourne MEC which followed the Amussin MEC which could not get their version of the contract passed under membership ratification. Under the Bourne MEC, they were able to get it negotiated were anyone hired had to be on the Atlas ALPA seniority list at any new offshore base that was created by the company and any subsequent hiring at STN halting that particular tactic from repeating by the company. That unfortunately did not include the currently employed AACS/AABO guys already hired. Those guys got their reward of STN super seniority. They were about 170 at the time and are now around 40-50.
During that same time, the company did not let up on the pressure on the Atlas crews and association during negotiations. The company had bought a nearly defunct airline in which they moved about five Atlas aircraft and associated flying contracts over to (PAC), furloughing more Atlas crewmembers while hiring off the street at the newly aquired carrier. More Atlas guys on the street. Later proved out financially that it was another negotiation tactic in the later bankruptcy court discovery a few years later.
So your facts are wrong. Judging from who was giving it out on one side, I'm not surprised. Luckily he is not a factor in the combined group anymore other than being source of discontent.