In all honesty, even back during the last vote, I recognised that both new rostering systems are identical in all respects, except for how much they will cost BA. The currently planned system will have optimisation which if BA gets its act together, will produce precisely the same rosters as the new proposed system. The only advantage with sticking with the current plan is that we all know they will cut corners with their software to save a penny, which will of course cost a pound in inefficiencies which would work in our favour.

I've personally spent very little time worrying about the new systems - I've hardly even read what little literature we've been given. The one BALPA has recommended is coming, and I'll learn how to use it when it arrives.

GS Alpha. I agree 100% with your mindset. How long will it take before the membership realise that 'the Emperor is stark bollock naked!'?

Slightly worrying reading, given that I start in 10 days...

Will the PBS system get rid of the CAP system and considerably limit the ability to swap? Will it get rid of overtime?

I've spent the last few years on 5/4/5/3 and it's not ideal either. The days off never seem to fall when I need them. The ability to build CAP credit and swap was a factor in my decision to de-orange. Hope it's not all going away...

The CAP system is still going to exist in some format or other because part of the deal is a change to annual CAP. Swapping is the main problem. I think a theoretical ability to swap will still exist, however when everyone is working efficiently with minimum days off inbetween trips, it will be very difficult to organise swapping of trips in order to obtain different days off to the ones you have been rostered.

Worth re-joining for I would say, where do I sign-up?

Thanks GS-ALPHA. Am I correct in guessing that ability to swap under the new system will be more reduced for SH than LH? Never done LH before, so might have guessed completely wrong.

Permafrost,

It's early days for EASA FTLs in Longhaul but I think even under Bidline swapping is becoming more difficult. Unless you are swapping two trips which cover the same days you're now quite likely to fall foul of the rules concerning post rotation rest and/or pre duty acclimatisation rules. Also legit combinations for Longhaul back to backs at base are much more limited. I can say with some degree of certainty ;) that there are swaps in Longhaul that would have been legal in January but are now being refused due FTLs..

In short it looks like under either Bidline or JSS whilst you might be able to swap to get to a preferred destination, it's going to be difficult to swap to get preferred days off.

Does anyone know how this 'JSS' is going to function?

My previous employers used preferential based system and it effectively allowed the top 10% of each rank to write there own roster while the other 90% got rosters that contained anything from 1 or 2 granted requests to absolute zero as it was based solely on seniority - if this is what BA are asking you to start using I would do everything you can to make sure it doesn't get implemented, even if they 'rotate' seniority it doesn't work ask the EK guys, the system is awful. BA has always been 'less money more lifestyle' it could turn into less money less lifestyle.

Not all preferential based systems operate to that extreme but has BA shown anyone examples of what the rosters would look like? If the bidding will be done entirely on seniority or if it would operate more like the leave system and be done using 'points/credits'? i.e I really want my daughters birthday off so use all my 100 points to bid for that day off, if no one senior to you uses the same amount of points/credits you get that day but with no more points to use you can't bid for anything else.

On a separate note how many long haul trips are being rostered under EASA? Normal 4-5 or have they squeezed in 5-6?

Thanks Wiggy. My timing, as usual, is exquisite!

FlyingTinCans my understanding of the impact of EASA on long haul means that they can't "squeeze in" more work as the regulations are far more restrictive on doing things like back to back trips. The impact of EASA has left BA with the requirement for more pilots on Long Haul to cover the work (hence the current recruitment) not less.

What's the difference between this new JSS and the Carmen (preference based) system that LGW use? Is that being replaced aswell?

The general consensus on Carmen is it's actually a bit better for juniors as you can all-but-guarantee yourself one block of days off a month by making it your sole preference (at the expense of a random mix for the rest of that month)

On another note, those going through the BA selection will be assessed on the 747-400 sim from Apr.

Can't comment on Carmen, all I know is it is proposed we adopt a bespoke :rolleyes: version of this:


http://ww1.jeppesen.com/documents/av...0eBrochure.pdf

I believe some have been quite impressed having "attended" Webinars on the subject given by BALPA, and some of the more junior are singing it's praises, but my eyes were drawn to this in the brochure:

Hi guys!
I am applying to BA.
I have a little issue with the 3 essais to write down at the application stage.
Is there any model showing exactly what HR want to read?
English is not my 1st language, I think I am doing well with it but writing is not the best for me.
You can think I am lazy! I have tried to write the essais myself but the result doesn't sound great!����
Thanks for you help!

HR would be interested to read about the history of Caen airfield 1939-2016:ugh:

I think HR might want to read an essai which has been through spell check! :ok:

That's the problem....it would be more than 600 words!

Thanks for that. An interesting read for a new joiner.
My immediate concern is being able to have some control over where days off fall, rather than individual trips (though I'm sure I'd develop a preference for east/west, trip length etc). As you will no longer be bidding for a line, do you think you will be able to bid for days off as well as trips? My understanding of the existing and proposed systems is fairly basic.

LFRK .....

Here are my essay answers from nearly 10 years ago. Obviously the subject matter is a little dated now but it worked for me.

Don't fret over English not being your first language, I'm confident the recruitment team will take this into account. Good luck.

CB

--------

1) Why would you like to join BA as a pilot and how can you contribute

As a member of the travelling public whenever I think of British Airways, excellent customer service and the very highest of safety standards always come to mind. That said, as a pilot I recognise that these are consistently achieved because of the world class training crews receive at BA.


Believing sincerely in the above values and fully understanding how important training is, I feel I could reach my fullest potential were I given the opportunity to work for British Airways. My contribution would be to represent all that the company stands for - safety, quality, efficiency, loyalty - demonstrating the highest professional standards, each day, every day.


2) Give an example in your current role of when you have made an important decision. Consider the sources of information, how you prioritised and the final outcome.


Our duty involved two round trips to Manchester from Southampton. There was widespread fog and our allocated aircraft had no automatic pressurisation as well as a permanent fuselage door warning (defects were MEL acceptable). In manual pressurisation mode the workload is extremely high especially on routes where the cruise phase accounts for a small percentage of the flight time. This particular duty also involved crossing some of the busiest airspace in the world - four times, all with bad weather and the doors warning constantly on our minds -it is fair to say that I was feeling uncomfortable about the developing situation. Given all the information available as well as the safe conduct of the flight being our main priority I expressed to the captain that I would be much happier were the company to re-file us as FL80 - allowing us to fly unpressurised and allowing both of out attentions to concentrate on spacial awareness, ATC compliance and gathering MET information en-route. I thought conveying this to the captain was an important decision - a line of thought he too had been thinking along and ultimately flying at FL80 is what we did.


3) Give an eample of when you have been involved in a major change in the work environment. How did you adapt to this and what did you learn from it.


The integrating of Connect into Flybe was a major change in the work environment for all employees. For a while afterwards there were occasions when the atmosphere in the joint crewrooms became quite sour as hardliners from both sides made their respective thoughts known. As a very junior first officer I had not experienced a merger/takeover before and the subsequent period while things settled. In terms of how I adapted the truth was I had not been with Flybe very long when it all happened and was still in an adaptive frame of mind anyway, this was just one more thing to get use to. I knew the situation would calm down and as somebody who via my staff number could be recognised instantly as 'original Flybe' I made a point of being as congenial as possible when interacting or rostered with new colleagues. There were of course occasions when people were curt and it is from these times that I learnt that some people take longer to come round than others, some never do and really all you can do is have patience and understanding and not take it too much to heart.

4) Outline the competition facing BA at present and how in the role of flight crew you can contribute to the overall success of the business.


Low cost carriers are a direct threat to any full service airline serving the same routes in economically uncertain times such as these. Relatively new companies like Oasis and to some extent Zoom are evidence that the LLC might no longer remain simply an intra continental competition phenomenon (like Ryanair) but rather one that starts to appear more and more on transcontinental routes. This coupled with the EU-US Open Skies Agreement means that some very competitive times lie ahead - exacerbated for all concerned by rising fuel costs. Flight crews need to be continually aware that with fuel being the biggest operating cost the aircraft must be flown at its most efficient at every phase of flight and must always work to depart on time keeping in-check those overheads that are directly under their span of control. Flight crew can also contribute by helping to instil and maintain motivation as well as a pro company attitude among the entire crew and as ambassadors of the company project the image of trustworthiness at all times.

TBH your understanding is probably as good as mine.

I suspect that if JSS is adopted it will be a case of keeping preferences simple and not trying to combine too much, especially whilst junior...I suspect asking for SIN trips only and being home Sat and Sun might not be the best tactic to employ initially....whereas bidding for "any trip, any day" might just work...:bored:

Like most things bidding wise I suspect you'll get what you want as long as somebody senior to you doesn't want it........and that ultimately the company will re-jig work and ignore preferences in order to cover the work........

I anticipate being junior on my fleet for quite some time, and as such don't expect to have a huge amount of control over what I do. I was/am hoping to have a chance at influencing my days off though, and in the future, what I do when I do work.

I'm currently a longstanding balpa member at my employer, and likely to stay a member when I move (at least my subs will go down due pay cut), but BA balpa is very much on trial for me. I need to see them benefitting me, and working on my behalf. This feels like a backward step on the face of it.

POtt3r

In the interest of managing expectations I'll be brutally honest and say that IMHO even if we stick with Bidline you'll struggle as a Blindline holder to do much influencing of days off, other than perhaps being able to swop after roster publication, if EASA regs allow it. It's been a standing joke for years that pre-ops ("rostering") put Blindline holders preferences forms unread straight into the bin. Might be unfair but it often appears that way.

If you're destined for the 744 they do at least have a seeded trip on their Blindline's so after Stage 1 publication you'll have a trip and associated days off on the line prior to the rest of the line build.... but you have to have the senority in the first place to get the Blindline that gives you the days off you want. The only other option is to bid for a reserve line - that has a block of fixed days off at the start that might be a "fit" with something you need to do...other than that :confused:

I have no idea whether there will be any real improvement in control of days off for the junior pilots if we go to JSS....

Swaps were probably my main hope for controlling days off.
Maybe the new system will be more transparent, and give junior guys a slightly better shot at some form of preference. Who knows.

I'm going on the 380, so the 744 thing you mentioned wouldn't benefit me.

Wiggy.

Re blindline pref forms going straight in the bin.

I needed to fill one in myself the other month and followed it up with a phone call to pre-ops. I did this to reinforce how important the day off I wanted was (Ellen's birthday). During the conversation I said something slightly disparaging re pref forms and how little sway they seem to have.

The lady on the end took the time to list my last 5 forms submitted (over the course of several years) and read the succinct notes on the screen next to each entry citing why I hadn't got my preference.

I'd go along with that but then Feb was published and all 4 of my preferences were honoured. :eek: Buses all coming at once springs to mind.

OpenTime is a fantastic tool, a potential life saver when you're junior on Blind Lines.

Is OpenTime a tool for swaps?

It's actually called eMaestro but yes, it's a live trip swap/overtime system. There are some restrictions but broadly it's pretty good.

Yeah it's a very handy little feature that enables us to view uncovered work and either add it as overtime or swap existing work around. It's brilliant if you're on Blind Lines as it gives you some control over your roster. I use it every month.

Out of interest, does anybody know if JSS (if implemented) will retain this feature?

The 380 is a bit different as the vast majority of trips are 4-5 days with many large time zone changes. This makes blind line holders fairly inefficient so you hopefully won't work too hard.

If you're in the first batch you will rise up the list reasonably quickly as they have released some SFOs to the 320, which wasn't in the original plan. With no more aircraft (yet) planned the fleet has a lot of trainers and not much training come the end of the year.

Emaestro or whatever it gets called stays with either system.

I have a feeling I'm mid-batch. Certainly 1-2 courses before mine. Maybe more.
I've got a decent idea of what the fleet is like from a mate on it, but hadn't heard re SFO's going to the 320.

FPA to Variable
 

Such a shame they are changing the lifestyle that really sold BA to my wife and I at the Middle East road shows.

Im destined to join a quieter fleet, and the move to variable flight pay is now quite a concern. How much difference in pay will this make to junior bods on quieter fleets such as the 380/787/767? Before the change to fixed flight pay, was there any pay protection for those on blind lines with only 1 or 2 trips? Is a reserve month now going to result to a month of eating pot noodles to pay the mortgage?

Thanks again for the info!!

You're going to get a shock if you think you'll be doing 1 or 2 trips a month on a blindline on whichever fleet! :eek:

Last time we had variable pay it was around £10 an hour, so even on 900hrs a year it could only be 9k before tax. The money is being kept, just redistributed, so in a normal month take home will increase but will go down in a quiet reserve month/leave/really quiet blind lines. There's no certainty at this stage it will be voted through anyway.

What will be a shock is the amount of money deducted in taxes/NI/pension for those coming in from the desert. Coupled with the £100 tank of petrol may have some newcomers heading back East after a couple of years.

I'm not coming from the desert, and will pay less tax than I currently pay, but I'd rather know what I'm taking home. I'd opt for fixed pay over variable pay every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

Here Here!

Variable pay also has an impact when applying for a mortgage. Some banks take an average, some will ask to see your payslips for x number of months and take the lowest figure, some will just take a fraction of it.

Giving up the fixed flying pay is a big step in the wrong direction and will certainly affect those of us at the bottom of the pile IMHO. But hey ho, lets see what comes out in the wash when the votes have been cast.

Hi All,

I am applying to BA, but haven't lived in the UK for 17 years! Hoping someone can shed a little light on what the norm is for a CV these days?

My current CV is a succinct 1 page, but I seem to recall having a 3 pager right out of high school in the UK.

Thanks for all your help!

Dupre.

Chief Brody - Thanks for posting those essay answers, gives me an aiming point for what to achieve in them!

So with what now appears like an inevitable 'self generated by the financial markets', global economic downturn, who thinks BA will actually continue to recruit hundreds of pilots this year? The share price is certainly being hammered!

The non rated guys in the pool without the LH requirements won't like you for pointing that one out, GS-Alpha! Right now though it remains to be seen, unless it filters through to the real economy then really it's all on paper. Current Oil prices, depending on hedging, give the airline a lot of leeway to entice passengers and don't forget that Oil is making the cost of living much cheaper for the consumer right now. All in all, I think it's going to take a lot more economic pain to scupper plans just yet.

In my experience, a BA/IAG share price fall of this magnitude has always resulted in a serious economic downturn a couple of months later.