Sorry, but that is nonsense. TOM will take up capable FO's onto FT contracts as and when they need, just like TCX does and many other airlines for that matter. While I would agree that its not a perfect situation, there is not much that is better in the UK now or for ever into the future.

Will any preference be given to those who were made redundant a couple of years ago?

I understand the only promise the company made was that they would let those who left know when they were recruiting, which they have now done I believe?

Or would the company prefer low houred second officers?

I have a mate at Thomson and from his mouth, if time to command is a big factor for deciding on this job then don't bother. If its not then this is as good a deal as you are going to see in the UK for a long time, unless you think Monarch's plans will result in a safe and secure job.

Time to command is a piece of string fluttering in a gale force wind at the moment, ANY number mentioned is a guesstimate and MUST not form the basis for a decision to join Thomson.

Having looked again at the full package on offer, I agree it is probably one of the best on offer in the UK with one big caveat. The current Thomson management have previous history in downsizing and redundancies. Yes, if you get in and can avoid the chop for 10 years or so as Blue Baron has, then you're probably safe and have a job for life. But don't forget there was significant downsizing 3 years ago resulting in about 100 pilots being made compulsorily redundant - some of these had been in the company for 5 years so may have considered themselves relatively safe from such events.

Just a little warning for those considering leaving other jobs for the bottom of a long seniority list run by a ruthless management. It may work out and you've got a great job for life in a great company - just be aware of the background behind this recruitment, ie. the fact that there were significant redundancies 2 years ago.

Fly,

the company won't take low houred second officers this time. They have around 100 type changes to manage over this coming winter (Airbus to 737NG, 757 to 737NG and the 787 ratings as well, which arrive in febuary 2013).

This is a big strain for the TOM TRTO, and there will be no capacity to do full type ratings and the OCC as well. Hence, on this occasion they need 737, preferably NG and with some time.

There is a new TOM cadet pilot scheme being developed (which would be open to anybody with a frozen ATPL, not just CTC etc) but that isn't for this winter.

Ezy is right. Can't see time to command being less than 10 years, and could see it being more.

Penworth, is spot on. Good job with good Ts and Cs, but please apply with your eye's open to what has happened, and the tought sector that is tour operating in the UK.

Hopefully this thread will help people with that.

Hi all I have about 1k hours 737 1200TT , what are my chances of getting in....? Ie how many pilots do they need and will there be an absolout mass of applications from ryan guys even jet 2 etc....?

Apparently the number required is not fixed. It depends on how many current (expensive I guess) people at the top take the redundancy package on offer or career breaks. It could be 10 to 25 apparently.

This is third hand information though so make of it what you will.

I dont think you can offer redundancy whilst at the same time hire in an effort to reduce costs. I don't believe TOM are making positions redundant; they'd be opening up a can of worms. Part time work I can see, early retirement possibly but not redundancy. Might be wrong.

Thomson Airways is obviously one of the few companies left that offer industry leading Ts & Cs to the pilots, but for how long they can keep this up in the face of competition from EZY and FR has to be an issue.

Penworth is spot on imho

and more worryingly, dashead says

How long the company can sustain these comparatively generous rates of pay in the face of relentless attacks on pay and conditions by the likes of FR and the inevitable "benchmarking" by the rest would surely be a question a new joiner would need to ask.

Surely there must be painful times ahead if TUI are to remain financially sound.

The issue here in my mind is whether the IT business model is resilient enough to adjust to the changing face of leisure air travel. I feel personally that longhaul package holiday is less attractive to families than a few days in the timeshare and the flexibility offered by the low fares brigade, so in my view, the purchase of the 787 is a courageous decision.

Thomson tried low cost with Tfly in 2004, then quietly dropped it and laid off a lot of good pilots which would seem to confirm that they could not compete with FR/EZY in a low cost capacity and are now going to great lengths to differentiate themselves from the low cost airlines.

Good luck to all at TUI, if they've got it right this time, then they truly are one of the few remaining companies worth joining, hopefully the leisure travel market is not too crowded and can support both IT and low fare business models. Let's hope they know what they're doing this time round.

Imho, is it really fair to compare Thomson with the likes of FR & EZY?

By this I mean that TOM is a Charter Tour Operator that provides package holidays which EZY and FR (Thank God) do not.

Surely as long as people want a package holiday, which I'm willing to bet would be a massive percentage of the UK population, TOM would be safe(ish) gamble.

Or have I got the wrong end of the stick?

Kilo

I may have used the wrong term, but basically I think they are offering early retirment or vountary redundancy (same thing maybe? I dont know) to make room for people joining at the bottom. I would have thought if it isnt compulsory it isnt a problem.

I guess you can employ 2 first officers for the cost of one high seniority captain?

whatever, its good that companies seem to be recruiting again :) Even if the T's & C's arent what they used to be :(

I concur with Penworth. Good company and some fabulous crew, but help yourself to rose tinted specs on the way in. I was one of the unfortunate 100 three years back and am now at easyJet. With the benefit of hindsight, fate has actually been kind to me and therefore I shan't be applying to come back. I wish well to those that do, it really is a good airline, but don't believe airlines are that different these days. It's all about screwing costs and pilots are a cost.

wooly

You are absolutely right, Thomson tried the cheap and nasty low cost operation and decided it was not the image that their customers wanted and that it was cheapening the brand.

The question is however, if FR and EZY are making money out of it, why couldn't Thomson? Why couldn't they see off the low cost market and stop them gaining market share in the Med?

Years ago, the only way to get to the sun cheaply was with the charters and I think it would be fair to say that they never saw competition coming in the form of sheduled operators, eg FR/EZY. The charters have reduced capacity steadily over the years and the low costs have aggressively increased capacity into the corecharter market to the extent now that this core market has moved further east, and further out of the Eurozone.

So no, they are not chasing the same market at the moment, but whether the ability to grow revenue still exists within the IT model is key to any growth, but although the charters were forced to move east to maintain their margins as the Eurozone became more pricey for the tourist, the timeshares and villas remain where they were ten years ago, on the Algarve, the Costas and the South of France.

Thomson moved into longhaul with the aquisition of the right equipment 20 years ago, but the competition from the sheduled carriers, such as BA/Virgin/Emirates in the form of their own in house leisure products should not be underestimated.

I see the families sticking to the Med or southern Europe for their holidays for sheer convenience, and the young well off singles/newlyweds (ie, no kids) using the scheduled longhaul for their citybreaks or luxury resorts. All of these options are a lot cheaper now with the scheduled operators than they were 10 to 20 years ago when the IT market was growing.

Hopefully, TUI being a savvy company with cash in reserve will not want to fall behind.

Really ?
 

@ macdoo

You probably know TOM made many capable and experienced crew redundant at the drop of a hat three years ago. What makes you think it won't happen again ? :ugh:

Interview Structure
 

Morning All,

It's probably still a little premature, however, can anyone in the know share the interview structure?

Can we expect a general chat type affair or the full on verbal/numerical tests, sim rides, technical assessment?

DD

Does anyone have a link to the application?

Search Results

Click on the search result link for pilot and all will become clear, good luck.

I am flying to the canaries for the second year in a row this year with Thomson.

This year I cannot book an inflight meal but they were "pleased" to inform me that I can purchase a wide range of snacks on board.

This year I will not be enjoying inflight entertainment on board but they were "pleased" to tell me that my own portable devices may be used in flight after take off.

This year I paid a premium and went on line to choose my seat.

So, excluding long haul, I do think it is fair to compare EZY RYR and Thomson now as the difference between them is becoming less and less.

Next year I may as well take my family by my own employer, not really seeing much of a difference, except in price of course.

Thomson are ruining their name in shorthaul, if I wanted a low co experience I would have went with my own company.

Ezy driver, as informative as your post was, how is it related to Thomson recruitment?

Anyone else having problems with the recruitment process? As a new applicant, when clicking on "Apply now", I'm consistently getting the message "an error has occurred processing the page you requested"

Overloaded? Or a glitch in the IT? Mac vs PC problem?

There's the Thomson IT system for you!!

:ugh:

Apologies,

WoolyAlan posted the following:


"Imho, is it really fair to compare Thomson with the likes of FR & EZY?

By this I mean that TOM is a Charter Tour Operator that provides package holidays which EZY and FR (Thank God) do not.

Surely as long as people want a package holiday, which I'm willing to bet would be a massive percentage of the UK population, TOM would be safe(ish) gamble.

Or have I got the wrong end of the stick?"


I was merely giving an insight to this opinion as someone who has used Thomson many times in the past as a customer, I see the quality of their shorthaul product in a constant state of decline. Talking to their customer services about it is asking for a cut and paste of their current policy and is nothing but a waste of your efforts these days, much like Loco customer service at times ( I am a realist ).

All that said I agree it does not have much to do with recruitment but does perhaps give an insight to the direction they are going.

Bring back Britannia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm getting the same problem, tried 4 times using a MAC and get the error message each time :ugh:

Type rated only, with 300 hours on type!

Another win for the pay to fly brigade! How ironic that those who have done so much to destroy this industry will leap frog to some of the best terms in the industry! :yuk:

I trust as a responsible employer they will take on those who they made redundant first? Most of whom I assume not 737 rated? :mad:

Ezydriver,

If you are indeed an 'easy-driver' why you flying with Thomson anyway and not using your concessions to fly Easy?

To keep on track with the recruitment theme of the thread and for those wondering about job security....

Thomson's long term strategy is not to compete with the low costs on flights.

You will be applying to 'Thomson Airways' not Tui travel. Thomson airways is the lift provider for our main customer, Tui travel.

Tui Travel are concentrating on providing unique holidays that the likes of easy jet cannot provide. That is why it investing heavily in products like Sensatori resorts.

Yes we have made and still are offering redundancy to pilots that want it. It is voluntary only hence we can recruit as well. Its about losing Top of scale pilots on £200k plus packages and recruiting pilots on 75k.

The package was spelled out very well in an earlier post. If anyone can tell me a better offer in the last 2 years for a UK based airline I'll eat my humble pie!

Because I'm a realist.

I'd rather take my family on a civilised aircraft cabin, which is what Thomson used to offer.

Also getting the same message when applying.:confused: also MAC

Looks like I'm out. Can't swim:ugh:

ezydriver,

I was simply trying to suggest that EZY & FR are not Thomson's direct competitors as they cater for a different market, and that, imo it would be a safeish bet for job hunting flight crew because of this.

The thought of quality of service to passengers, be it good, bad or worsening, never entered my mind. Anyway, my fault, I used a poor choice of words when I said 'compare'

My understanding is that there was no agreement to rehire those made redundant over 2 years ago. However I think that most of them would have been 737 rated and so still would be as it is wihin 5 years of their last OPC, unless things changed with the latest change of licences?

All those using SAFARI to try and login - it will not work. Not via iPad nor Mac nor iPhone (I assume). Try using Internet Explorer or the (vastly) superior Google Chrome.

I have a new business plan.

Pay to swim..............:sad:

Burpbot - totally agree with you matey. Victory to the people who destroyed the industry... when will us, who have done it sensibly and not paid for a type rating to poo down the necks of others get a sniff of anything at all??

Fly Better is correct. Those made redundant have all been contacted and invited to apply for these posts which was the deal when originally made redundant. Most were 737 pilots. Many have moved to the Middle East and will be reluctant to give up a full time job for a part time contract, especially with current difference in time to Command between Thomson and the likes of Qatar Airways where many went ( unless unhappy in the Middle East and looking for a return.)

English can be improved but no non type rated top notch self improvers need apply
 

• Type rated and current on B737 300 – 900 (preference given to those with 737 NG experience) and a minimum of 300 hrs on type
• Level 4 English with the ability to upgrade to Level 6



Whilst I appreciate TUI wants to get costs as low as possible so stipulates 300h on B737 300 and up, my condolences to all those excellent Flybe TP and EMB jet operators, Biz jets, Airbus pilots and Bush Pilots - you can have high grade flying and NOTEC skills but this is not what TUI want.

Then even if you have time on type the salary will be reduced at source because you will need re-training............... OK not as bad as RYR, WIZZ or EZY but still not the way to treat aviators.


I only hope unemployed bmi baby pilots and ex TFly get a look in.

I'm on a mac and no problems for me.

It didn't work on my iPhone but no problems on my other devices.

Good luck all!

I am a swim instructor but not have a 737rating....

Current bases that are short of 737 co-pilots are Luton, Cardiff, Doncaster and Newcastle, although this does not mean that this will be the bases recruited for, but I would be surprised if its not!- your not getting Gatwick though!

Been here 7 years and would not want to work anywhere else-including BA. Sure things have been harder the last few years with redundancies etc- but that did just follow a merger at a time of one of the worst economic backdrops for many generations.
All sorts of theories regarding the future look of Tui Travel PLC and Tui AG -look into that for your interview-but increasing profits, for now.
For those modular people upset by the type rating requirements on this occasion, I can sympathise with you, I went the same route, but there are many reasons for this, not least the training requirement for us this winter, you really should not go slagging off a company that you would apply for with different criteria, on a public forum, just because it means you can't apply on this occasion, you should remember you future interviewer may be reading.....

Good luck to all that apply

thank you for the information theflyingbus.:ok:

What is they system for fleet changes? Seniority? Typically does the opportunity arise or can would expect command on the same type?

I see canadian crews and aircraft covering the Dublin summer base, is that set to continue in the longterm?

Some points to consider....
 

Some of the Thomson pilots here have posted very optimistic descriptions of the conditions here but if you are applying based on salary and time to command expectations the following may be of use to you.

The current recruitment at Thomson has come about because of what the management call a 'modernisation program'. The introduction of this is because they have assessed their operating cost to be a certain amount more than what they deem to be our main competitor - an orange coloured operation.

In order to reduce their costs we were asked to accept a change to our industrial agreement. Should we not have accepted this it was made clear that the tour operator would reduce its use of the in-house airline meaning that a fleet reduction and further redundancies would become necessary. Part of this agreement was creating the terms for recruiting pilots and part was change to our operating conditions. Posters above have indicated the amount it may be possible to earn through overtime payments based on the current conditions. Please do not expect to be able to do this. The new agreement will change our working practices so that the amount of overtime achievable will most likely be negligible (ie standby duties introduced where before we were offered pay for working on our days off, the number of days off in peak months is being reduced and the max monthly rostered hours increased).

Posts above also indicate that the time to command could be 10 years. I have been here for over 7 years and estimating from the company’s own internally published numbers of pilots reaching retirement age each year for the next few years it looks like my earliest chance of command is 12 years away. That is if the airline stays the same size. Things could go much better if we expand but as I said above the management has spent much of this year threatening us with further reduction so this time could more likely increase. The threat is all the more plausible as we have been told that a lot of our aircraft leases become due for renewal in 2015 which will mean there is the opportunity to shrink without significant cost to the business.

While I don’t want to be negative I would like anyone thinking of leaving another stable job to consider these things when making the decision. The airline is made up of a lot of great people but there is also a lot of low morale at the moment, especially among the FOs. For those applying good luck and should you be successful I hope you thoroughly enjoy working here.