PPRuNe Forums

PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)
-   Terms and Endearment (https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment-38/)
-   -   IAG: BA restructuring may cost 12,000 jobs (https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment/631988-iag-ba-restructuring-may-cost-12-000-jobs.html)

Timmy Tomkins 29th Apr 2020 17:17


I fear there may be some substance to this assessment. After 9/11 opportunism ruled big time in negotiations. No crisis is too big or small to be lost as an opportunity to cut costs.

RexBanner 29th Apr 2020 21:09

We’ve had the company proposal through from Balpa, utterly opportunistic smash and grab raid on Ts and Cs which has very little (read nothing) to do with Covid-19 (in much the same fashion as easyJet).

Redundancies split evenly between Captains and FOs. Won’t spill the requested figure precisely suffice to say it’s in four figures.

Riskybis 29th Apr 2020 21:14

around 1200

judge11 29th Apr 2020 21:17

Cast your minds back to post 9/11 and then 2008 - BA claim the end of the aviation world is nigh, take pay cuts and decimate T&Cs to 'save the company' - you know what happened thereafter. The 'best' became just another airline on 900hrs per annum, the most coveted roster system trashed, pension scheme destroyed - all in the name of 'saving the company'. The problem for management is, they have pared you to the bone (with your full and naive support) that there's little left to cut.

TheAirMission 29th Apr 2020 21:19

You can all read it here: https://gofile.io/?c=LZkPqV

Jwscud 29th Apr 2020 21:27

It’s a complete land grab - using the crisis as an opportunity to tear up everything that made BA worth working for.

If they get their way, seniority is dead as is any kind of stable rostering system. The “efficiencies” I’m sure mean working long haul to EASA limits, and what on earth do absence management and grievance procedures have to do with redundancy.

At least when I worked for O’Leary he had the good grace to tell you his mission was to ^@%! you!

RHS 29th Apr 2020 22:07


Why don’t you crawl back in the hole you came from? 1200 pilot colleagues are staring down the hole and you’re gloating about their naivety?

RexBanner 29th Apr 2020 22:11


Don't forget Scope agreement thrown in the bin too.

JPJP 29th Apr 2020 22:24

Originally Posted by TheAirMission (Post 10767651)
You can all read it here: https://gofile.io/?c=LZkPqV

The document above contains one of the most reprehensible, cynical, and amoral management strategies that Iíve ever had the misfortune to read. The list of glaringly mercenary attempts to rewrite agreements permanently is long.

One wonders how forcing a new policy on performance and absence management will save British Airways ? Even Frank Lorenzo would be raising an appreciative eyebrow at that detail.

Unfortunately that Sky News article above seems to be prescient. Iím sorry to see the pain that British Airways pilots and employees are facing. Hopefully BALPA is up to the task.

I wish you all the best, and a hearty C you next time to BA management.

RexBanner 29th Apr 2020 22:35

And remember this document contains the signature of AB. Will the last person in the room who was still labouring under the illusion that he’s one of the “good guys” please turn out the lights?

Buter 29th Apr 2020 22:40

Was logging on to say this very thing.

I'm not sure where we go from here. At this point, it seems unlikely that I'll ever see the pointy end of a jet again. Good luck to us all, in BA and across the industry.

ShotOne 29th Apr 2020 22:42

Reads like a wish list of everything BA management has been itching to do for years. Never waste a good crisis!

vlieger 29th Apr 2020 23:00

That letter is disgusting. I hope BALPA can offer a strategy, though the bargaining position, unfortunately, is weak.

Baldeep Inminj 29th Apr 2020 23:09

The attitude of BA management is so reprehensible that I imagine virtually all of their pilots would love nothing more than to take VR and move to a better one which actually has a modicum of humanity.
Oh hang on, nobody is hiring.

This is a hard call. Do you live by your principles or put food on the table?

I have wife and 3 kids relying on me. If I worked for such a callous and cut-throat company I would rant and rave...then swallow my pride, crack on, and pay the bills.

I have many friends at BA (and also Virgin) and every single one is a top guy, great pilot and deserves so much more than management are prepared to give.

At least BA management have been openly exposed for what they are. I would love to see the unions gave a field-day with this letter, but I bet BA have already got their guns loaded and aimed.

judge11 29th Apr 2020 23:22

Originally Posted by RHS (Post 10767685)
Why donít you crawl back in the hole you came from? 1200 pilot colleagues are staring down the hole and youíre gloating about their naivety?

Not at all - I've got several 'been there, been made redundant' T-shirts.

Their naivety was in swallowing hook, line and sinker, BA management's sob-stories over the past almost 2 decades, sob-stories that have been proven to be completely groundless and yet they were believed leading to the erosion of what, at the time, were some of the most envied T&C's in the industry. There's a massive crunch coming but if you don't learn from past mistakes..............you know the rest.

Oh,and don't be so rude.

sidtheesexist 29th Apr 2020 23:23

Originally Posted by RHS (Post 10767685)
Why donít you crawl back in the hole you came from? 1200 pilot colleagues are staring down the hole and youíre gloating about their naivety?

You may not like the way his pov is expressed, but I agree with him/her. And before you start having a pop at me as well, Iím looking down the barrel too, as Iím a Nigel.....for the moment! We, as a working group( pilots) and Union (BA BALPA), have consistently ceded ground (in my 15 yrs or so in BA) to our increasingly aggressive management. By expressing this view, Iím not for one moment blaming previous CCs alone, for the position we find ourselves in. Collectively, we havenít found the will or the way to fight back effectively enough and thus find ourselves in a pretty weak position, at a time when the mgmt are as usual, trying to hammer us down again. Since I joined BA, I believe BALPA have managed to avoid compulsory redundancies when the dips have come along. I sincerely hope, for all our sakes, that this record can be maintained. If Iím wrong factually, unreserved apologies. Good luck everyone, my BA colleagues in ALL depts, our friends in VAA, and everyone else who is affected.

Out Of Trim 29th Apr 2020 23:32

Originally Posted by Gypsy (Post 10767069)
So what are IAG doing at Iberia and Vuelling?

Indeed, IAG seemed to have singled out BA only thus far! Why?

Are Iberia, Iberia Express, Vueling, Level, Air Europa, Aer Lingus seemingly immune from similar action? :hmm:

judge11 29th Apr 2020 23:33

Originally Posted by RexBanner (Post 10767706)
And remember this document contains the signature of AB. Will the last person in the room who was still labouring under the illusion that heís one of the ďgood guysĒ please turn out the lights?

I used to know a AB - Hawk QFI - not the same one?

RHS 29th Apr 2020 23:35

I have apologised to judge privately. I was out of line, emotions are running a little high tonight as Iím sure they are for many of us.

stay safe all, and best of luck to everyone.

LGW Vulture 29th Apr 2020 23:46

I cannot see Vueling escaping the same sword. Spain is financially on its knees and tourism won't come back soon. Iberia have already been pared to the bone in the recent past but even they won't survive the same sword in their current status.

I believe it only a matter of time for similar announcements from the Iberian Peninsula.

All times are GMT. The time now is 04:32.

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.