Ryanair
 

Can anybody help me out please?
1.Is it true 5on 4off?
2.Is it true bonded typerating for FO 1500 hrs.JAR 25?
3.Fast track command, 6 month is it serious?
4.Can you choose a base or do they put you were they like?
5.Base availibility top down? (looking Bergamo or Pisa)
6.Where do i pay taxes?
7.No more pension contribution for new joiners?

Sorry I am asking a lot, because i need to make a decision.And FR is not as clear as Easy in their advertisements.

Thanks
Thin Albert:suspect:

Ryanair pilots have rejected this scam by a very substantial majority. Not least of the many reasons is that the 5:4 claim is so qualified by "get out" claused that it is meaningless. By the dound of things you really need to read the following (see post #7):

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=214074

Thanks Aloue for replying quickly.So 5 on 4 off is not true,that changes things a lot for me.
Anyway i ll go to Cologne tomorrow and talk to them directly and will see what they say.
Anybody else some news on this thread please.
Cheerio
Thin Albert

Thin Albert, Be carefull they will just promise you a load of stuff thats not true or half truths. You'll know when they lie to you, the telltale sign is when their lips move.

Given that the company has unilaterally degraded the terms and conditions in the last two years I'm not sure if what you are promised is worth anything. This is probably the worst thing the company has inflicted on itself in recent times. It used to be that whatever you were promised, however bad, was honoured. Now whatever they promise to attract new recruits has to be treated with some amount of scepticism.
Many people joined and have written contracts that speak of Loss of Licence, payment for medicals, rostered days for medicals, increment payments, uniform allowance, tea, coffee and water etc. All these things are no more. This is why the recent offer of a 5 -4 roster was treated with suspicion and ultimately rejected.

Go, see what you are offered but always consider what your move will be when the terms are altered without consultation or consent.

No Ryanair promise is worth the paper that it’s not even written on. They will promise you everything and deliver nothing. 5 on 4 off is for new joiners but, as it states in the agreement that you probably wont see, they can change it to 5 on 3 off or 5 on 2 off as and when they please. Oh and your annual leave is used to supplement the extra days. Oh and you have to go to the sim on your days off. New guys are on a “temporary” training contract. Some have been on the “temporary” training contract, without pay, for over a year. That’s right no pay for over a year waiting to finish training.

They treat their most loyal employees like dog muck why would they treat new guys any better. The house of cards is beginning to buckle under the weight of the management egos. Pilots are leaving in their droves. Their need for new EXPERIENCED pilots is so huge now that the problem is unrecoverable. Too many aeroplanes coming not enough pilots. The FOs that are there are so inexperienced that they will not make captain in time to help.

Ryanair is a monster that would rather eat its own flesh than pay for nourishment.

At the moment this company is ******, best stay away until / if it is / can be, fixed.

OK thanks for info.
Can someone tell me how much income tax in Ireland I would pay for an income of 65300 Euro (married two kids) not living in Ireland.
How much percent is deducted for unemployment and for health insurance.What other social insurances will be deducted, and how much.
dear colleagues I really appreciate your help.
Cheerio
Thin Albert:D

Thin Albert you are a glutton for punishment, but you do ask good questions. I can't do your tax for you, but the tax rates in Ireland are lower than in mainland Europe. So too are social payments. HOWEVER, if you are then based at one of the continental bases and you or your family get ill - some important questions and issues begin to arise.

For example, did anyone tell you that Ryanair just cancelled, with a few days notice, Loss of Licence insurance? That's it. Just gone. You pay now (so now most probably will forget about LOL).

Bottom line: all of this is designed to get cash into your hands, to make your earnings look high and make you feel well off. The problems arise later. This is all smoke and mirrors - just like the "5 on 4 off". Now you have no insurance from your company, low welfare payments and problems if your real payment rate becomes known in one of the countries that provides REAL health care. And that is not to even get into the taxation "arrangements" that you might be responsible for sorting out should the tax authorities in another country come after you.

In any case, as has been repeatedly said above, what Ryanair say / promise and what they actually do is different. They are taking money from their staff all the time, with new "arrangements" or new "interpretations" of contracts. So far there is no sign that they will stop.

Equally, so far there is no sign that quite a large number of pilots will ever learn .... and so we keep meeting pilots complaining about months without pay, or contracts ignored. You can feel sorry for them as individuals, but as a group it is harder to be sympathetic. It must be said that there have been more than enough warnings here for the last year for anyone with a bit of wit to realise that something is not right. Get everything in writing - and in advance - though they will still tell you that certain things in the contract were "a mistake" and do not apply to you. When that happens, are you going to accept it? Most people do. And Ryanair know that. Which is why it will go on happening.

Sorry but they are among the highest in Europe, in the region of 45%.

I underwent a Ryanair interview/selection for a DEC position. The person who interviewed me was a shifty, devious little O'Leary clone who couldn't look me in the eye and wouldn't give me a direct answer to any of the pertinent questions I posed. My suggestion that I'd like answers and I'd like to see them in writing almost gave him a heart attack.

They didn't offer me a job - it didn't matter, I eventually had four options from which to choose, all from much more ethical companies.

Do not go there unless you have absolutely no other choice. If you must, seek to leave at the earliest opportunity.

20% on first 32k and 40% on the balance. So your net pay after tax from 63,500euro would be 44,500euro.

Doesnt sound too bad, however as previous posts have said, think of the things you dont get and dont believe a word they say until you see it in black and white, and even then be sceptical!

Thanks guys for your contribution, especially ALOUE.No worries i take everything into consideration, when I have to take the decision.
With my calculation I end up with 40000 Euro after taxes, plus sector pay, that must be between 18000 and 48000 Euro (min to max).
Health care i can keep in Switzerland aswell as LOL (70,-Euro p month).

1.Can anybody please tell me wether you can say OUT OF EXPERIENCE, that you get Irish tax back, because you dont live there, or spend more than 183 days out of country.

2.Really no taxes from my side on sector Pay?
3.Average sector pay in Bergamo Pisa Rom Frankfurt?
4.Do you get the 29 days of holidays in 6 blocks of five, or do they give you everything like in January ( low production)?

Appreciate your help
Cheerio
Thin Albert;)

Hi TA,
Actually the tax situation here in ireland is slightly better than has been outlined.
For a married person the first €41,000 of taxable income is charged @ 20%.
The remainder is charged @ 42%. However you would also be entitled to basic tax credits of €4750.
Social insurance (PRSI) is also payable @ 6% up to €46,000 and 2% on the remainder.
However, if you live outside the country for more than 183 days then you are not liable to Irish income tax.
For details of tax rates and allowences in Ireland see the following Govenment information site : www.revenue.ie
Check out the " Moving to Ireland tax guide" page for non resident info.
Regards
Willby

TA can you tell us what Ryanair told you about all of this? I mean, did they not explain all of this to you in Cologne? By the way, there is a big row running at the moment over taking leave.... turns out that the way in which the pilots think they can take leave and Ryanair think about it are very different. Guess who is losing out? Again, what did Ryanair tell you?

Willby,thank you very much that helps a lot, and it doesnt sound to bad if i get back taxes!!
Aloue, well they told us basically 65300 basic plus 48000 sector which is quite high calculated, isnt it? FR is paying taxes on our sector pay. In Stanstead the salary is little higher due to higher costs of living.
29 days leave you can take them in blocks or single, max twice 5 day blocks together once a year.
expect to be within 12-24 month at the base you wish.
No food no drinks you pay 200 Pound for uniform LPC and OPC and Medical in Off days.
you get basic salary during training sector pay after beeing released on the line.
cheerio TA:hmm:

TA,
RBA can't be as bad as Ryan ...surely....

Thin albert have you read the guide for prospective ryanair pilots on pprune.Maybe someone with more savvy than me can drag it up here for you.

Hi Propaganda
whats RBA?:confused:

Ryanair
 

I am thinking about working for Ryanair this year. Does any one have any useful information about working at Ryan? I read their Q&A but I would like to heard from some one.
Thank you.

There is a search function: type in Ryanair and you get more than you bargained for :\

Junior
Just a thought, grow up before you play with the big boy, you will get eaten alive.

Take a brookfield contract
They just got all of them 5 ON 4 OFF based and 10 % increase salary the goooooood boys
Don't believe the figures given in the ads for the ryanair contracts
But the most important thing, don't join with too many expectations or requests in your mind like a certain base e.g. except to get a good type rating and rapid experience to sell yourself somewhere else
Good luck

I cant´t believe people still think it´s a great idea to join Ryanair as a stepping stone towards one of the more respected carriers.

Wake up guys: There are already hundreds of Ryanair pilots looking for jobs with better airlines. There is not gonna be room for all of you. Be prepared to be stuck there for a while if you join.

Just a point. A few years ago a BRK contract pilot had 5/5 roster. They received allowances for all flying days to cover expenses. There was then a change to 5/3 and an allocated base. (didn't matter if you lived there or not and still incurred expecnses.) This resulted, based on 900hrs pa, in a loss of net income (allowances) of 9000euros pa. It would seem that they been given a 5/4 roster, which is worse than their original 5/5 and the 10% pay rise will give them back 10260 (based on 900 hrs). Thus the pay rise is really 1260euros. As the 10260 is salary and taxable it is much less than the non-taxable 9000euros which was taken away, and the days off are less than original. So is this such a good deal relative to the T's & C's of 3 years ago?

5/4 is now based

Ryanair SXF Road Show
 

Well it looks like quite a few of the local B737 pilots have started getting email invitations for screening etc, already just one day after the end of ILA.:ugh: :=


One rumour about is that Ryanair are examining the potential of a Berlin base, (I have heard it from two places before and after the show).????? :rolleyes: Is the truth out there? Anyone on the islands heard anything as well? If they did open a base I am sure there would be several local operators very rapidly in the brown stuff. T&C’s are one thing basing’s are another:E


If BBI ever comes there will not be the cost base for the likes of Ryan/Easy/Germanwings/HLX…… does this mean the Finow may become Ryan’s Berlin North?:E :E :ok:

Why not? Getting 2 Aircraft per month as a average then you need to fill the seats quickly as the expansion is on full throttle. Better then sitting on the street or working for a outfit where you have to fear if you get your money at the end of the month and if all checks are done properly.

Fly safe land happy

NG

Fala sério! Vai pra Gol...

hello whats RBA???:ugh:

Either it's "Right Bl@#$y Atrocious" or Royal Bunei Airlines; or both.

TA I met a pilot yesterday who joined Ryanair after reading various warnings here on pprune. Because of the warnings he asked several times about sector pay and even got the terms in writing BEFORE joining. He has now discovered that "what he was told was a mistake" - that he is not entitled to what he was told and they are not willing to do any more for him. As he says, this means going to court, or accepting it. He knows that most people accept it and does not know what to do.

So, what decision did you make? If you joined Ryanair maybe you could tell us if anything like this has happened to you?

Why is anyone with any experience whatsoever contemplating working for Ryanair? When I read posts like the one from delwy, it just staggers me that such unscrupulous employers exist. The culture of lies and confrontation comes straight from the top and runs through every level of the company. Even reading Ryanair's hard-nosed attitude to mistakes in this week's Flight International confirmed my thoughts about the company. I understand that for a first job you have to take what you can get, but if you have any sort of a choice why would you go there? When so many other companies are recruiting there can surely be no choice.

NSF the reality is that they do join. Another reality is that some join knowing about the manipuation but thinking that it is exaggerated, while others think that any job is worth it - whatever may happen. Others have no idea. Ryanair knows and exploits this. It is called "the market" and Ryanair consider it has its own morality, driven by the greed or desperation of those who wish to apply. The reality is that there is nothing much that can be done about it, is there?

Hi Delwy
can you be more precise on the things your colleague is not entitled to??
I have a couple of former colleagues who are working for Ryan at different bases, no complaints so far, I just notice that some have 5/4 and some 5/3.But this must have something to do with the base that pilots rejected the 5/4 thing because they would have to go on their simchecks on their off days.
If you ask me why i am interested in Ryan is, the salary sounds ok to me, at least 30% more than at swiss european.
There is options for upgrades, at Swiss there is 60 downgrades.
5/4/5/4 sounds fantastic to me plus 29 days holidays.At Swiss we work 6/2 or 3/1. 30 days holidays but you almost dont get them.
900 hrs same same.
The options of 16 diff. bases in europe, at least on long term is great.:hmm:
So please let me know more facts,I havent started working for them.
regards
TA

delwy - there is something that can be done about it. This is a classic case of the need for union representation. At the end of the day you must decide as individuals whether you want the situation to continue indefinitely. Are you willing to fight or do you just want to submit yourselves to liars, cheats and yobs? You are 'looked after' by one of the weakest regulatory bodies in the western world, the IAA, and you therefore cannot rely on them for any support whatsoever. The pressing need here is for organisations such as BALPA to represent your interests. I am aware of the valiant efforts of REPA but ultimately you need to gather sufficient over support to form an overt trade union. I hope you are successful.

Stormin' Norman goes off piste.
 

Well hello, Norman. Not like you to wet your beak in Ryanair affairs. Must be feeling a bit perky after your little pay rise. Now for all those pesky "lifestyle issues", eh? Do let me know how you get on, won't you, turning your loss making Orange Airline into a career one?

Meanwhile, a few salient points for you to reflect upon. Much as I know how disinclined you are to absorb tales of success in the market we share, and much as I know you're a dyed-in-the-wool union apologist, it really doesn't do, Norman, to rattle the cage with untruths and bluster. Engaging the likes of Delwy, our Callow Aloue and Didimus in a rousing chorus of "we shall not be moved" does you no credit and is naught more than preaching to the choir in any case. Misery loves company, after all, which is why unions exist in the first place, no? And all this from an Captain of Easyjet, an airline with a market cap of a piddling 1.36 billion quid, trading at an eye-watering multiple of 32.5 times, facing unhedged fuel north of 70 bucks a barrel for God knows how much longer and losing money at least six months of the year! Wow, Norman. Now that's truly courageous solidarity for ya!

Naughty of you not to mention in your BALPA recruiting campaign that your Orange Trolley Dollies are warming up for a summer of discontent because they want what the pilots got. July, isn't it? Naughtier still not to mention that BALPA are, to put it mildly, selective champions, Norman, and will drop you faster than an Arab's used condom when the mood suits or a more pressing cause presents. Just ask those long suffering F/O's at GSS how they feel about BALPA when a direct conflict with their masters at Willy Walsh Airlines raises its ugly head. The truth is always such an inconvenience, Norman, when doctrine and dogma collide, isn't it.

Thin Albert, as you've probably gathered so far, there are a number of folks hereabouts who like nothing more than to cast aspersions on Ryanair in an attempt to denigrate it as an employer. They have what you might call a vested interest in trying to make sure people stay away from Ryanair, and they do this by telling fibs. They also like to suggest that Ryanair is somehow responsible for everything from third world debt to athlete's foot, and that all the Ryanair pilots are very unhappy and hate their jobs. They aren't, and we're not.

Nothing could be further from the truth. I'm a Ryanair captain and I can tell you life is good. I earn a mountain of dough for doing what I love and the 5 on 4 off deal is tremendous. Its on the table for all new entrants, and yes, you'll have to do your 4 days annual recurrence training on your days off, but perhaps you, like I, will decide that its a small price to pay for 4 days off in a row. Feels more like a part time job, actually. Ultimately, Albert, make your own decision, but do make sure its a fully informed one, and not unduly flavoured by a vinegar-titted vocal minority who wouldn't know happiness if it drove up their arse in a truck.

Norman Stanley Fletcher
Simple. Most people with experience want decent rosters and decent money and generally that's what Ryanair offer.

I've said it before but it beggars belief that anyone from easyjet could look down their nose at Ryanair! Have YOU worked for both?:ugh:

Leo, I don’t agree with your sentiments but I do enjoy your posts and I find your enthusiasm for the company inspirational. 5 years ago when I joined Ryanair this enthusiasm ran right through the pilot community and everyone you spoke to was excited about the future. It is a great pity that this feeling wasn’t nurtured. We would be turning away direct entry captains by now instead of trawling the gin dens of the former communist back-streets dropping the Kings shilling into the pints of those too p1ssed to realize what they have signed up for and exploiting the street kids who have hocked the family silver and dare not go home without a job.

Leo and Stan
From a simple read of these pages and many others on PPrune, not many of your work colleagues seem to share your views. News from REPA also suggests more than a little unrest and dissatisfaction.
Most importantly though, you are happy in your job and no-one can take that away from you.
EZY isn't a happy place right now sure enough, but I wouldn't consider crossing to the Harp for a minute.
(btw. Having specific knowledge of both companies your 'mountain of dough' comment is somewhat over-stated!).