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RYR - Roster patterns

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RYR - Roster patterns

Old 24th Jan 2023, 20:15
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Originally Posted by AIMINGHIGH123
Here we are. Same here. As FO I didnít get any of the leave I wanted. Not many did from those I have spoken to.
Every company has its negatives. BA when youíre junior itís a bit crap. Probably working every weekend. 5 years in on SH from my previous colleagues they are getting more of the days they want off. Jumping to LHS yes you go to bottom of seniority but everyone joining BA knows this.

So you say BA Euro is poor. They need to up it for sure. Not by much. I compared my roster to my mates at LGW. Yes I had more days off but he hasnít done any 4 sectors out of LGW. 2 sector days no more than about 10hrs duty time was his max. That was a ďlongĒ day.
Easy to swap days plus on master seniority plus staff travel, private medical, uniform, etc.

Heres RYR:
Captain Basic £105,000 1st upgrade £91,500

2nd £98,250

Allowance £6,000

Annual Leave £2,897

Sector Pay £14,714

Pension £8000

Total Annual Pay (850hrs) £136,611 after 3rd year



Schedule Block Hour Rate (SBH)£17.31



FO After 1500hrs

Basic £50,000

Allowance £5,500

Annual Leave £2,897

Sector Pay £8,662

Pension £3,000

Total Annual Pay (850hrs) £70,058



Schedule Block Hour Rate (SBH)£10.19

RYR Allowances: Loss of Licence, Health Insurance, Sim Allowance, Car Parking, Medical, Uniform/ID, Water, Phone.

So if you going to compare like for like.

Take allowances and pension off RYR as they are not included in BA.

BA LHR FO £65k basic without extras. Extras £15k say. Will be more than that.
A very close mate of mine hasnít been below £4200 in his pocket since he started last year. £3k pay rise every year guaranteed. Negotiations on top of that. SoÖÖ..
£125k basic as FO after 20 years. Plus around £15k. £140k as FO.

Plus you would have a lot of say over your roster.
Plus staff travel world wide.
ect etc.
whilst others I have
One day you might wake up and realise time wasted you can never get back, I've watched my kids grow up, never missed their birthdays or Christmas no money in the world can replace that, but I'm older than you i guess,
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Old 25th Jan 2023, 22:52
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Originally Posted by Steve1968
In my own bed every night with my own wife and spending my spare time in my workshop and where I want to be, 40 years in BA would never pay me enough to swap companys.20 years ago applied to Virgin got accepted and turned it down , best decision I ever made ,money motivated not at all, just life.
This guy hits the nail. Yeah, BA FO in year 20 earns same as a RYR skipper, but it takes them 15 more years to get to that pay, while the RYR has hit it 5 years after starting. By the time the BA FO is going for the upgrade, the RYR is way ahead financially (and possibly in life AND professionally). Living out of a suitcase is not for everyone, likewise having management breathing in your neck. Intimiation works until a certain extent and some people are better than others ignoring the noise.

Horses for courses.
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Old 25th Jan 2023, 23:48
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Originally Posted by Steve1968
whilst others I have
One day you might wake up and realise time wasted you can never get back, I've watched my kids grow up, never missed their birthdays or Christmas no money in the world can replace that, but I'm older than you i guess,
You would be having that at BA. I know a few who joined BA around 5 years ago. As FOs they have better say over their roster. Been offered command but most of them said no.
Maybe 1 trip away a month. Hardly a way a lot. If you want the day trips you can bid for them. SH no late flying due to restrictions at LHR. Last summer I lost count of how many times I landed past 1am. 4 days off, the first day I was ruined. Days on in summer I barely see the family. Kids birthdays easy. Swap to
have it off. With RYR I get maybe 50% of swaps. If that. Mrs bday missed it. Kids same. Xmas I had Xmas day off. Finished late on Xmas Eve then had Boxing Day ďlateĒ starting at 9am. Hhmmmmm
Yes LH obviously going to be away more. Donít bid for it. Simples.


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Old 25th Jan 2023, 23:59
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Originally Posted by plikee
This guy hits the nail. Yeah, BA FO in year 20 earns same as a RYR skipper, but it takes them 15 more years to get to that pay, while the RYR has hit it 5 years after starting. By the time the BA FO is going for the upgrade, the RYR is way ahead financially (and possibly in life AND professionally). Living out of a suitcase is not for everyone, likewise having management breathing in your neck. Intimiation works until a certain extent and some people are better than others ignoring the noise.

Horses for courses.
You can go for command earlier at BA. It was just an example. RYR quite £136k. Take £14k off of that for pensions and allowance (technically should be more as you pay tax before paying. Eg medical cost say £150, you pay that after you paid tax so itís costing you nearly £300 from your salary.) Youíre down to £122k already. Not sure what BA LHR Captain is. I think 15% more than what ever FO pay point is.
Euroflyer we know they say is £105k. Add pension youíre at £115k at least. Donít forget first 2 years upgrade at RYR is less. What would 20 year pay be at Euroflyer?

And yes Euroflyer are home every night. Staff travel, private medical, no paying to park, for your pass, to eat, get coffee etc etc etc. Go to work hungry and you will get fed.

Honestly I was the same and all for RYR and quick command. When you starting going into all the figures BA wins. I went through it with my mate. Pension is 15% at BA. All the extras.
Take Manchester for example. Car parking is something like £800 a year!!! You pay that after tax so really itís around £1400 off your take home.
Just an example. Add everything up in detail plus the options SH/LH part time if you want etc etc.

Last edited by AIMINGHIGH123; 26th Jan 2023 at 00:32.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 00:34
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Originally Posted by AIMINGHIGH123
You can go for command earlier. It was just an example.

Honestly I was the same and all for RYR and quick command. When you starting going into all the figures BA wins. I went through it with my mate. Pension is 15% at BA. All the extras.
Take Manchester for example. Car parking is something like £800 a year!!! You pay that after tax so really itís around £1400 off your take home.
Just an example. Add everything up in detail plus the options SH/LH part time if you want etc etc.
Like I said, money is not everything and BA definitely doesn't tick all the boxes. Your maths don't make any sense, and also Stansted carpark costs £0 as an example. So it really depends on personal circumstances, and what you want now and in the future. BA might be a good outfit for you while RYR/J2/TUI might be better outfits for others.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 05:39
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Originally Posted by Steve1968
Yes if you read the post, Thats after paying £4900 in AVC's which is not a bad take home pay
I hope the avc is per month too
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 08:37
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I donít understand this FR argument of ďin bed every nightĒ

with a 4/5am alarm set 5 days in a row? Or getting into that bed near midnight?

Ryanair pilots think every other airline spends 28 days away in a hotel?

Long haul I was away 2-3 nights max and then about 5-8 days off afterwards. It was approximately 15-20 days off a month depending on the roster. You might need 24 hours to get back to feeling 100% but I surely would need the same after 5 days of repeat earlies/lates and multiple sector days. Short haul ops was great, hardly any nights away and those nights you did spend away included no time zone changes. Enough time for a decent meal and a drink in the evening and a stroll around in the morning.

Horses for courses and what suits you, but I simply donít buy into this ď5/4 in bed every nightĒ as though itís the holy grail of Aviation.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 08:43
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Originally Posted by Steve1968
Yes if you read the post, Thats after paying £4900 in AVC's which is not a bad take home pay
And the months youíre not making a disgustingly high AVC contribution?Ö
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 08:59
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Originally Posted by VariablePitchP
And the months youíre not making a disgustingly high AVC contribution?Ö
That's paid every month on the same date. no reason to not pay it.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 09:00
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Originally Posted by ToCatLady
I donít understand this FR argument of ďin bed every nightĒ

with a 4/5am alarm set 5 days in a row? Or getting into that bed near midnight?

Ryanair pilots think every other airline spends 28 days away in a hotel?

Long haul I was away 2-3 nights max and then about 5-8 days off afterwards. It was approximately 15-20 days off a month depending on the roster. You might need 24 hours to get back to feeling 100% but I surely would need the same after 5 days of repeat earlies/lates and multiple sector days. Short haul ops was great, hardly any nights away and those nights you did spend away included no time zone changes. Enough time for a decent meal and a drink in the evening and a stroll around in the morning.

Horses for courses and what suits you, but I simply donít buy into this ď5/4 in bed every nightĒ as though itís the holy grail of Aviation.
Sure.
Please state the airline/s offering such lifestyle, I'll apply ASAP.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 09:07
  #31 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by VariablePitchP
And the months you’re not making a disgustingly high AVC contribution?…
For a UK-based line captain, you're looking at roughly £6500 net/mo with maximum matched pension contribution. Varies +/- £500 with hours flown.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 09:14
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Originally Posted by Theholdingpoint
Sure.
Please state the airline/s offering such lifestyle, I'll apply ASAP.

Flagship airline in Hong Kong.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 09:38
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Originally Posted by ToCatLady
Flagship airline in Hong Kong.
Oh, ok...thanks, but no thanks.
If that's your experience it seems you were really lucky. Why did you left?
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 10:17
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Having spent my time there, whilst i'm far happier where I am now. Even after 5 days of 4am alarms, I always felt it was worth it to get 4 days off in a row. I cannot state how good knowing you have 4 sequential days off in a row ad infinutum is. (Almost 5 when you transition from early to lates. A 3/4 day mini break possible every single week - and you can plan it months in advance due to the fixed pattern roster. No other airline in Europe offers this.

As I say, I'm happier where I am but I can understand those that won't leave simply due to 5/4.
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 12:05
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Originally Posted by Steve1968
That's paid every month on the same date. no reason to not pay it.
Either thatís the annual AVC, which makes the net similar to a year 5 FO at somewhere like BA, or youíre due a pretty enormous annual allowance bill from HMRC
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Old 26th Jan 2023, 12:07
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Originally Posted by ser
For a UK-based line captain, you're looking at roughly £6500 net/mo with maximum matched pension contribution. Varies +/- £500 with hours flown.
That makes more sense and sounds (much!) better.
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Old 27th Jan 2023, 12:08
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Originally Posted by ToCatLady
Flagship airline in Hong Kong.
It was pre bat flu roster while the Dragon was still flying most of the China and short haul routes. With the Jeppesen rostering system, lots of integrated pattern like China shuttle 3-2-3 or KUL 1-2-2-1 will come to you on 15th every month.

I personally find it easier to operate 4 sectors in Europe than a turn around in China.
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Old 27th Jan 2023, 17:53
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Is that as an F/O?
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