Virgin Recruiting
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 10
Likes: 2
From: n
Joined post-Covid. Don't recognise much of what's been said but will give a little story to explain what I think is going on. Flying with quite young, brand new joiner FO who's telling me how he almost failed his initial LST.
"They can't expect me to read the whole of the FCOM. It's far too long and I've got a life, you know?"
Unfortunately I think management have had to cast the net a little too wide to get warm bums on flight deck seats (I mean, they recruited me after all). Whilst I'm no fan of management here, I think there are almost certainly a few characters amongst the recent recruitment who need to have a bit of a think about their behaviours, both professionally and downroute. There are plenty of stories going round about why a few particular characters have been let go, at least one of which I could confirm personally.
"They can't expect me to read the whole of the FCOM. It's far too long and I've got a life, you know?"
Unfortunately I think management have had to cast the net a little too wide to get warm bums on flight deck seats (I mean, they recruited me after all). Whilst I'm no fan of management here, I think there are almost certainly a few characters amongst the recent recruitment who need to have a bit of a think about their behaviours, both professionally and downroute. There are plenty of stories going round about why a few particular characters have been let go, at least one of which I could confirm personally.
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 39
Likes: 1
From: Lounge
Newhairdo,
In a short period of time you've prefixed your reflections on 787's post with "If true....", then referred to "valid and concerning issues" before accusing someone who disagrees with your passionate, seemingly informed view on the matter as a "management stooge".
To be so sure of their validity, where did you manage to corroborate the initial claims as fact?
Also curious regarding your comment "Is everyone else wrong, while you are right? Unlikely." There are clearly numerous contributors refuting 787's allegations while you are the only one going all in on them.
In a short period of time you've prefixed your reflections on 787's post with "If true....", then referred to "valid and concerning issues" before accusing someone who disagrees with your passionate, seemingly informed view on the matter as a "management stooge".
To be so sure of their validity, where did you manage to corroborate the initial claims as fact?
Also curious regarding your comment "Is everyone else wrong, while you are right? Unlikely." There are clearly numerous contributors refuting 787's allegations while you are the only one going all in on them.
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 575
Likes: 431
From: Outbush
Newhairdo,
In a short period of time you've prefixed your reflections on 787's post with "If true....", then referred to "valid and concerning issues" before accusing someone who disagrees with your passionate, seemingly informed view on the matter as a "management stooge".
To be so sure of their validity, where did you manage to corroborate the initial claims as fact?
Also curious regarding your comment "Is everyone else wrong, while you are right? Unlikely." There are clearly numerous contributors refuting 787's allegations while you are the only one going all in on them.
In a short period of time you've prefixed your reflections on 787's post with "If true....", then referred to "valid and concerning issues" before accusing someone who disagrees with your passionate, seemingly informed view on the matter as a "management stooge".
To be so sure of their validity, where did you manage to corroborate the initial claims as fact?
Also curious regarding your comment "Is everyone else wrong, while you are right? Unlikely." There are clearly numerous contributors refuting 787's allegations while you are the only one going all in on them.
Have you, or the other deniers been able to corroborate the initial claims as false? None of us actually know, because, wait for it, this is a rumour site. I will leave you to look up the meaning.
equally, has anyone corroborated the claims made against the 10 pilots on this site? Or are we to take these at face value because they support one side of the discussion. You might want to look up discussion too.
My point is that if the allegations are true, they are reprehensible and need proper investigation. Do we at least agree on this? Hopefully BALPA will assist with any investigation.
Because, unlike you, I don’t have time to trawl through pages of posts, perhaps you could bring into context the quotes. Or at least expand on short 3 or 4 word clips.
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 39
Likes: 1
From: Lounge
Apologies if my grammar is not up to your standards. Maybe English is not my first language, but that isn’t relevant.
Have you, or the other deniers been able to corroborate the initial claims as false? None of us actually know, because, wait for it, this is a rumour site. I will leave you to look up the meaning.
equally, has anyone corroborated the claims made against the 10 pilots on this site? Or are we to take these at face value because they support one side of the discussion. You might want to look up discussion too.
My point is that if the allegations are true, they are reprehensible and need proper investigation. Do we at least agree on this? Hopefully BALPA will assist with any investigation.
Because, unlike you, I don’t have time to trawl through pages of posts, perhaps you could bring into context the quotes. Or at least expand on short 3 or 4 word clips.
Have you, or the other deniers been able to corroborate the initial claims as false? None of us actually know, because, wait for it, this is a rumour site. I will leave you to look up the meaning.
equally, has anyone corroborated the claims made against the 10 pilots on this site? Or are we to take these at face value because they support one side of the discussion. You might want to look up discussion too.
My point is that if the allegations are true, they are reprehensible and need proper investigation. Do we at least agree on this? Hopefully BALPA will assist with any investigation.
Because, unlike you, I don’t have time to trawl through pages of posts, perhaps you could bring into context the quotes. Or at least expand on short 3 or 4 word clips.
By telling me to look up discussion, I assume you're a subject expert. Illustrated perfectly when you immediately resort to name calling someone happens to disagree with an unfounded point you're arguing on a matter you have no qualification to comment on.
Do you work at Virgin? No.
Do you know anyone at Virgin? No.
Are you a troll? Yes.
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 575
Likes: 431
From: Outbush
Nothing to do with grammar, your sentiments supporting the entirely unverified claims were perfectly clear. Took 787's post at face value perhaps?
By telling me to look up discussion, I assume you're a subject expert. Illustrated perfectly when you immediately resort to name calling someone happens to disagree with an unfounded point you're arguing on a matter you have no qualification to comment on.
Do you work at Virgin? No.
Do you know anyone at Virgin? No.
Are you a troll? Yes.
By telling me to look up discussion, I assume you're a subject expert. Illustrated perfectly when you immediately resort to name calling someone happens to disagree with an unfounded point you're arguing on a matter you have no qualification to comment on.
Do you work at Virgin? No.
Do you know anyone at Virgin? No.
Are you a troll? Yes.
I did ask you a direct question, one which you have rather conveniently ignored.
In summary, if the allegations are true, do you support an investigation?
Regarding your first 2 questions, what makes you think you are correct? Are the answers you pose just there to suit your argument?
And as for your third, now who’s name calling?😂🤣
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 39
Likes: 1
From: Lounge
Name calling? Where, exactly do I call you any names.
I did ask you a direct question, one which you have rather conveniently ignored.
In summary, if the allegations are true, do you support an investigation?
Regarding your first 2 questions, what makes you think you are correct? Are the answers you pose just there to suit your argument?
And as for your third, now who’s name calling?😂🤣
I did ask you a direct question, one which you have rather conveniently ignored.
In summary, if the allegations are true, do you support an investigation?
Regarding your first 2 questions, what makes you think you are correct? Are the answers you pose just there to suit your argument?
And as for your third, now who’s name calling?😂🤣
No food for the troll.
Joined: Jun 2021
Posts: 6
Likes: 3
From: Rome
For what purpose exactly?
Was your VS rejection so ruthless?
Maybe convert this motivation for fallacies to something more useful like improving your career or working on your frustrations or something. Good luck mate.
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 575
Likes: 431
From: Outbush
Dude, first of all you’re lying and your spreading misinformation and second of all BALPA won’t confirm anything because that’s not how the union works. I’m trying to understand how some individual, pure out of frustration or sheer ignorance, decides to enter a perfectly useful thread for recruitment and spread misinformation.
For what purpose exactly?
Was your VS rejection so ruthless?
Maybe convert this motivation for fallacies to something more useful like improving your career or working on your frustrations or something. Good luck mate.
For what purpose exactly?
Was your VS rejection so ruthless?
Maybe convert this motivation for fallacies to something more useful like improving your career or working on your frustrations or something. Good luck mate.
If OP is correct, then a BALPA investigation will support the alleged 10. If it’s untrue, ditto.
maybe you should stop the childish name calling. What are you trying to hide mate ?
This is exactly why whistleblowers have protection.
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6
Likes: 1
From: Wherever the skies takes me
Hairdo and 787diver, I’m not suggesting your experiences are invalid, but as a current VAA pilot with two years at the company, I haven’t encountered the issues you’ve described. Is Virgin Atlantic perfect? Of course not—but my experience so far has been overwhelmingly positive.
The training is of a high standard, and while the airline doesn’t spoon-feed its pilots, it reflects a mature, professional environment that many of my colleagues—and I—genuinely appreciate. There’s an expectation of professionalism, which is appropriate for an airline of this calibre.
In my time here, I’ve had the pleasure of flying with some of the most competent and professional individuals I’ve met in the industry. That said, it’s true that a small number of recent hires have fallen short of the standards expected—both in terms of behaviour downroute and performance on the flight deck. Like most reputable carriers, Virgin does not tolerate that kind of conduct.
They pay fairly, treat their staff well, and expect high standards in return. Let’s not allow isolated incidents or personal grievances to distort the reputation of what is, for many of us, a very good company to work for.
The training is of a high standard, and while the airline doesn’t spoon-feed its pilots, it reflects a mature, professional environment that many of my colleagues—and I—genuinely appreciate. There’s an expectation of professionalism, which is appropriate for an airline of this calibre.
In my time here, I’ve had the pleasure of flying with some of the most competent and professional individuals I’ve met in the industry. That said, it’s true that a small number of recent hires have fallen short of the standards expected—both in terms of behaviour downroute and performance on the flight deck. Like most reputable carriers, Virgin does not tolerate that kind of conduct.
They pay fairly, treat their staff well, and expect high standards in return. Let’s not allow isolated incidents or personal grievances to distort the reputation of what is, for many of us, a very good company to work for.
Joined: Nov 2024
Posts: 17
Likes: 6
From: London
Dude, first of all you’re lying and your spreading misinformation and second of all BALPA won’t confirm anything because that’s not how the union works. I’m trying to understand how some individual, pure out of frustration or sheer ignorance, decides to enter a perfectly useful thread for recruitment and spread misinformation.
For what purpose exactly?
Was your VS rejection so ruthless?
Maybe convert this motivation for fallacies to something more useful like improving your career or working on your frustrations or something. Good luck mate.
For what purpose exactly?
Was your VS rejection so ruthless?
Maybe convert this motivation for fallacies to something more useful like improving your career or working on your frustrations or something. Good luck mate.
Before you jump in with your baseless accusations and condescending nonsense, maybe take a moment to think. Dismissing something outright just because it doesn’t fit your narrative is ignorant at best. So next time, engage with some actual reasoning instead of ranting like this.
Oh, don’t worry about me, mate—my career is doing just fine, thriving even! But it’s adorable that you think a little online tantrum is career advice. Maybe take your own suggestion and channel all that energy into something more productive—like critical thinking. Best of luck, champ! 😘
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 156
Likes: 42
From: UK
This really is very tedious.
Hairdo and 787driver sound like the kind of people that turn up at a pizza restaurant looking for a peadophile ring and won't leave until authorities have proven there isn't one in the basement.
If you're a prospective new joiner you can choose to go with their conspiracy theory that they're "heard about", "if true" or you can chose to listen to the myriad of actual VS pilots who have said that out of all the issues that exist at Virgin, the training department isn't one of them.
Suggest this gets parked and looked at by the mods until there some actual evidence rather than hearsay
Hairdo and 787driver sound like the kind of people that turn up at a pizza restaurant looking for a peadophile ring and won't leave until authorities have proven there isn't one in the basement.
If you're a prospective new joiner you can choose to go with their conspiracy theory that they're "heard about", "if true" or you can chose to listen to the myriad of actual VS pilots who have said that out of all the issues that exist at Virgin, the training department isn't one of them.
Suggest this gets parked and looked at by the mods until there some actual evidence rather than hearsay
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 575
Likes: 431
From: Outbush
Hairdo and 787diver, I’m not suggesting your experiences are invalid, but as a current VAA pilot with two years at the company, I haven’t encountered the issues you’ve described. Is Virgin Atlantic perfect? Of course not—but my experience so far has been overwhelmingly positive.
The training is of a high standard, and while the airline doesn’t spoon-feed its pilots, it reflects a mature, professional environment that many of my colleagues—and I—genuinely appreciate. There’s an expectation of professionalism, which is appropriate for an airline of this calibre.
In my time here, I’ve had the pleasure of flying with some of the most competent and professional individuals I’ve met in the industry. That said, it’s true that a small number of recent hires have fallen short of the standards expected—both in terms of behaviour downroute and performance on the flight deck. Like most reputable carriers, Virgin does not tolerate that kind of conduct.
They pay fairly, treat their staff well, and expect high standards in return. Let’s not allow isolated incidents or personal grievances to distort the reputation of what is, for many of us, a very good company to work for.
The training is of a high standard, and while the airline doesn’t spoon-feed its pilots, it reflects a mature, professional environment that many of my colleagues—and I—genuinely appreciate. There’s an expectation of professionalism, which is appropriate for an airline of this calibre.
In my time here, I’ve had the pleasure of flying with some of the most competent and professional individuals I’ve met in the industry. That said, it’s true that a small number of recent hires have fallen short of the standards expected—both in terms of behaviour downroute and performance on the flight deck. Like most reputable carriers, Virgin does not tolerate that kind of conduct.
They pay fairly, treat their staff well, and expect high standards in return. Let’s not allow isolated incidents or personal grievances to distort the reputation of what is, for many of us, a very good company to work for.
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 575
Likes: 431
From: Outbush
This really is very tedious.
Hairdo and 787driver sound like the kind of people that turn up at a pizza restaurant looking for a peadophile ring and won't leave until authorities have proven there isn't one in the basement.
If you're a prospective new joiner you can choose to go with their conspiracy theory that they're "heard about", "if true" or you can chose to listen to the myriad of actual VS pilots who have said that out of all the issues that exist at Virgin, the training department isn't one of them.
Suggest this gets parked and looked at by the mods until there some actual evidence rather than hearsay
Hairdo and 787driver sound like the kind of people that turn up at a pizza restaurant looking for a peadophile ring and won't leave until authorities have proven there isn't one in the basement.
If you're a prospective new joiner you can choose to go with their conspiracy theory that they're "heard about", "if true" or you can chose to listen to the myriad of actual VS pilots who have said that out of all the issues that exist at Virgin, the training department isn't one of them.
Suggest this gets parked and looked at by the mods until there some actual evidence rather than hearsay
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 43
Likes: 24
From: United Kingdom
I completely agree with the points mentioned above. However, they are unrelated to my original post regarding Virgin’s training practices.
Regarding the sexual assault incident, it was Virgin's management pilots who supported the individual in question, disregarding HR’s recommendation for dismissal.
This raises serious concerns about the company’s culture and leadership standards.
Regarding the sexual assault incident, it was Virgin's management pilots who supported the individual in question, disregarding HR’s recommendation for dismissal.
This raises serious concerns about the company’s culture and leadership standards.
I know of at least one female SFO who left the company last year who is in the process of legal action against Virgin for covering up the sexual harassment and bullying she received from a number of virgin pilots.
Apparently it was covered up and excused by Virgin Flight operations management and including the chief pilot and pilot management team and higher, and what shocked me more when I heard her speak of it was that HR at Virgin were complicit and active in the cover up. The documents she showed me were pretty damming as even Virgin’s internal investigation found she had suffered the harassment.
So I very much believe that this kind of behaviour is
unfortunately much more prevalent at VAA than any other organisation I’ve worked for.
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 43
Likes: 24
From: United Kingdom
Dude, just because you haven’t personally heard about this happening in your company or experienced it yourself doesn’t mean it’s a lie or misinformation. BALPA won’t give you the details of any specific issue, but they can confirm if something is happening—because that’s exactly how unions work.
Before you jump in with your baseless accusations and condescending nonsense, maybe take a moment to think. Dismissing something outright just because it doesn’t fit your narrative is ignorant at best. So next time, engage with some actual reasoning instead of ranting like this.
Oh, don’t worry about me, mate—my career is doing just fine, thriving even! But it’s adorable that you think a little online tantrum is career advice. Maybe take your own suggestion and channel all that energy into something more productive—like critical thinking. Best of luck, champ! 😘
Before you jump in with your baseless accusations and condescending nonsense, maybe take a moment to think. Dismissing something outright just because it doesn’t fit your narrative is ignorant at best. So next time, engage with some actual reasoning instead of ranting like this.
Oh, don’t worry about me, mate—my career is doing just fine, thriving even! But it’s adorable that you think a little online tantrum is career advice. Maybe take your own suggestion and channel all that energy into something more productive—like critical thinking. Best of luck, champ! 😘
And it’s common knowledge within Virgin that the training department has been weaponised in the past to assist managers in removing pilots from the company for reasons nothing to do with their performance.
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 43
Likes: 24
From: United Kingdom
Hairdo and 787diver, …….Virgin does not tolerate that kind of conduct.
They pay fairly, treat their staff well, and expect high standards in return. Let’s not allow isolated incidents or personal grievances to distort the reputation of what is, for many of us, a very good company to work for.
They pay fairly, treat their staff well, and expect high standards in return. Let’s not allow isolated incidents or personal grievances to distort the reputation of what is, for many of us, a very good company to work for.
Guess flight crew management didn’t get that memo.
Joined: Jul 2024
Posts: 575
Likes: 431
From: Outbush
Unfortunately in my experience and from first hand reports from individuals on the receiving end of sexual harassment and bullying I have to say it’s far more common and tolerated much more than it ever should be in any company let alone one that marketed itself as inclusive for all.
Guess flight crew management didn’t get that memo.
Guess flight crew management didn’t get that memo.
Am I wrong?
Its 2025, we as an industry should be better than this.
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6
Likes: 1
From: Wherever the skies takes me
I can agree there is a number of what can only be described as problematic people here at VAA in regards to attitudes to women, we all knew they existed.
I know of at least one female SFO who left the company last year who is in the process of legal action against Virgin for covering up the sexual harassment and bullying she received from a number of virgin pilots.
Apparently it was covered up and excused by Virgin Flight operations management and including the chief pilot and pilot management team and higher, and what shocked me more when I heard her speak of it was that HR at Virgin were complicit and active in the cover up. The documents she showed me were pretty damming as even Virgin’s internal investigation found she had suffered the harassment.
So I very much believe that this kind of behaviour is
unfortunately much more prevalent at VAA than any other organisation I’ve worked for.
I know of at least one female SFO who left the company last year who is in the process of legal action against Virgin for covering up the sexual harassment and bullying she received from a number of virgin pilots.
Apparently it was covered up and excused by Virgin Flight operations management and including the chief pilot and pilot management team and higher, and what shocked me more when I heard her speak of it was that HR at Virgin were complicit and active in the cover up. The documents she showed me were pretty damming as even Virgin’s internal investigation found she had suffered the harassment.
So I very much believe that this kind of behaviour is
unfortunately much more prevalent at VAA than any other organisation I’ve worked for.
While I don’t wish to diminish anyone’s personal experience-particularly when it involves something as serious as harassment-it’s important to approach claims like these with a degree of balance and factual scrutiny. Virgin Atlantic is a relatively small airline in terms of pilot community, and word travels fast. If this kind of systemic issue were as widespread as suggested, I believe more of us would be aware of it. As someone actively flying for the airline, I’ve neither witnessed nor heard of anything that supports the notion that this kind of behaviour is common or tolerated.
To describe a “number”of Virgin pilots as being involved in harassment, based on one individual’s serious (but singular) allegation, feels misleading. That there may be isolated incidents-yes, as with any airline or professional environment-but it’s reductive to characterise an entire group of pilots, or the company culture as a whole, on that basis. Every airline has its share of difficult personalities; this is not unique to Virgin, nor does it imply a cultural failing.
From my own perspective, Virgin’s flight crew management and training department set high standards of professionalism and behaviour. In my experience, they do not hesitate to act when those standards are breached. If the internal investigation referenced in the original statement did indeed find that harassment occurred, I would be surprised if it was genuinely “covered up” without further action or consequences-particularly in the current climate, where corporate accountability is under immense scrutiny.
Allegations of this nature deserve to be taken seriously and investigated thoroughly-but they must also be presented responsibly. Generalising from a single legal dispute risks painting an inaccurate picture of a company that, in my time here, has demonstrated a clear commitment to professionalism, respect, and accountability.
Last edited by rotorwings; 3rd April 2025 at 18:43.
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 43
Likes: 24
From: United Kingdom
Unfortunately our industry still has far too many people that are more than happy to act like that and what is worse people still are happy to excuse toxic behavior.
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 43
Likes: 24
From: United Kingdom
While I don’t wish to diminish anyone’s personal experience-particularly when it involves something as serious as harassment-it’s important to approach claims like these with a degree of balance and factual scrutiny. Virgin Atlantic is a relatively small airline in terms of pilot community, and word travels fast. If this kind of systemic issue were as widespread as suggested, I believe more of us would be aware of it. As someone actively flying for the airline, I’ve neither witnessed nor heard of anything that supports the notion that this kind of behaviour is common or tolerated.
To describe a “number”of Virgin pilots as being involved in harassment, based on one individual’s serious (but singular) allegation, feels misleading. That there may be isolated incidents-yes, as with any airline or professional environment-but it’s reductive to characterise an entire group of pilots, or the company culture as a whole, on that basis. Every airline has its share of difficult personalities; this is not unique to Virgin, nor does it imply a cultural failing.
From my own perspective, Virgin’s flight crew management and training department set high standards of professionalism and behaviour. In my experience, they do not hesitate to act when those standards are breached. If the internal investigation referenced in the original statement did indeed find that harassment occurred, I would be surprised if it was genuinely “covered up” without further action or consequences-particularly in the current climate, where corporate accountability is under immense scrutiny.
Allegations of this nature deserve to be taken seriously and investigated thoroughly-but they must also be presented responsibly. Generalising from a single legal dispute risks painting an inaccurate picture of a company that, in my time here, has demonstrated a clear commitment to professionalism, respect, and accountability.
To describe a “number”of Virgin pilots as being involved in harassment, based on one individual’s serious (but singular) allegation, feels misleading. That there may be isolated incidents-yes, as with any airline or professional environment-but it’s reductive to characterise an entire group of pilots, or the company culture as a whole, on that basis. Every airline has its share of difficult personalities; this is not unique to Virgin, nor does it imply a cultural failing.
From my own perspective, Virgin’s flight crew management and training department set high standards of professionalism and behaviour. In my experience, they do not hesitate to act when those standards are breached. If the internal investigation referenced in the original statement did indeed find that harassment occurred, I would be surprised if it was genuinely “covered up” without further action or consequences-particularly in the current climate, where corporate accountability is under immense scrutiny.
Allegations of this nature deserve to be taken seriously and investigated thoroughly-but they must also be presented responsibly. Generalising from a single legal dispute risks painting an inaccurate picture of a company that, in my time here, has demonstrated a clear commitment to professionalism, respect, and accountability.
The fact she felt so unsafe and fearful to come to work in the end after the action the pilots concerned and the covering up of the actions by management including senior management alone warrants questions as to the extent on the problem at virgin.
The documents I was shown by her that I have seen first hand clearly show multiple pilots were involved in the harassment she faced some of it was beyond disgusting, so yes I will stand by saying multiple pilots..
Until we and I say that as a company and an industry have the maturity and the integrity to admit there is a problem no mater how small where women do not feel safe from sexual harassment when just doing their jobs we canning claim to be an inclusive company where all are safe and free to be themselves..