Wizzair
I understand what you are saying. What you did not know is that I am already a Captain on an intercontinental jet so not looking for any special treatment here, just trying to maintain my rank. It was Wizz Air that suggested the fast track scheme not I, should I join as FO. It is they that also said about paying the 15% up front and no mention of any money returned after the bond period. Perhaps this is a new scheme they are trying now. Are you with them still?
Apparently yes. Taking advantage. The basic is indeed very low but there is an increase incentive if you work hard(fly more than 70hrs/ month as I reckon it, to make the money or you could end up making only 45% of basic salary if you stick to what was rostered..and on the other hand if you say yes to every extra flight they assign you whether on your off days or leave days you could end up making 150% of basic which by the end your health and certainly family might suffer too. This stick and carrot system in my suspicion has more stick and less carrot. For a beginner hungry to fly and build a foundation it may well be a great chance, but for those already experienced to have to make such sacrifices and on top get paid much lower than say previous premium Airline/Aviation jobs that may not be an easy bridge to cross unless you have long term career development goals on Airbus and you have the age advantage to pursue them.I.magine having to leave a €12000/month with accommodations and crew transport provided for flying a meagre 25-30 hrs/month with oervdiems paid if off base to interesting destinations and finding time to tour them then suddenly immerse yourself in this low basic pay(60% lower) low cost high productivity stick or carrot system punitive system can take a brave heart indeed, especially if you have a family to support. At the end it is a personal choice...unless you have no choice in which case any job becomes attractive in itself for security's sake.
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Why consider Wizz?
My friend, if you have a family to support and out of work you would know why. Try suffering this kind of hardship for two years with sparse freelance work to support you. I do not intend to finance my current type recurrent training when rating expires with little job offerings on the freelance market for my type. So when an airline offers this , despite its herrings, I still consider it an opportunity worth taking and building on and progressing forward even if joining as a Senior FO for 6 months, which is the minima for upgrade in the company. It wouldnt take me much more than a year to convince them to upgrade me. There is also the added advantage am getting essentially a cheap type rating with an assured job (I had paid for the same rating through my nose in 2010 with employment not honoured by a rogue Low Cost Airline and has long expired now) Even by paying upfront that small percentage Wizz Air asks despite under the circumstances of Covid let downs is still attractive. My lenses are not not focused as negatively as yours perhaps. I see a future progressing to wide bodied Airbuses elsewhere if experience at Wizz does not turn out a happy one. If I join them and hold that job at least I gain security's sake.My family lives in AbuDhabi so it is all advantageous for me. Have you been even furloughed before? Any spell on unemployment whilst you had to pay for your recurrent training to be marketable? Look...any company you might join might have stuff you might not like or people you might loathe to work with. Just swallow the red pill and move on living the dream rather than dreaming with empty pockets to fly again. That is my take. The glass might be a 1/4 full..bit a sip os better than a dry glass wouldnt you say?
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My friend, if you have a family to support and out of work you would know why. Try suffering this kind of hardship for two years with sparse freelance work to support you. I do not intend to finance my current type recurrent training when rating expires with little job offerings on the freelance market for my type. So when an airline offers this , despite its herrings, I still consider it an opportunity worth taking and building on and progressing forward even if joining as a Senior FO for 6 months, which is the minima for upgrade in the company. It wouldnt take me much more than a year to convince them to upgrade me. There is also the added advantage am getting essentially a cheap type rating with an assured job (I had paid for the same rating through my nose in 2010 with employment not honoured by a rogue Low Cost Airline and has long expired now) Even by paying upfront that small percentage Wizz Air asks despite under the circumstances of Covid let downs is still attractive. My lenses are not not focused as negatively as yours perhaps. I see a future progressing to wide bodied Airbuses elsewhere if experience at Wizz does not turn out a happy one. If I join them and hold that job at least I gain security's sake.My family lives in AbuDhabi so it is all advantageous for me. Have you been even furloughed before? Any spell on unemployment whilst you had to pay for your recurrent training to be marketable? Look...any company you might join might have stuff you might not like or people you might loathe to work with. Just swallow the red pill and move on living the dream rather than dreaming with empty pockets to fly again. That is my take. The glass might be a 1/4 full..bit a sip os better than a dry glass wouldnt you say?
I am wondering why you haven't applied as DEC rather than applying as FO? Not enough hours on the left seat?
Good luck!
Only half a speed-brake
Different strokes for different players. If A320 LHS is the stepping stone for an easier QOL of an already experienced pilot, WZZ might just be it.
Judging by the performance of their cadets for initial TR LPC, the training is sincere and constantly delivers appropriate results.
Judging by the performance of their cadets for initial TR LPC, the training is sincere and constantly delivers appropriate results.
Last edited by FlightDetent; 27th Apr 2022 at 20:41.
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Different strokes for different players. If A320 LHS is the stepping stone for an easier QOL of an already experienced pilot, WZZ might just be it.
Judging by the performance of their cadets for initial TR LPC, the training is sincere, delivering constantly appropriate results.
Judging by the performance of their cadets for initial TR LPC, the training is sincere, delivering constantly appropriate results.
Last edited by 380Mrat; 27th Apr 2022 at 16:50.
Indeed so. Aviation is governed by different types of AOC ranging from part 91 ,135, and 121 with an accompanying variation in standards and scope of experience. I gave been away from part 121 ops for many years and so my move is likely to ve efit rather than hinder me . WZZ jets are not only the latest Airbus Neos but are well maintained with Lufthansa Technic being the service provider. The training you mention must be to the notch required if they can keep their game going and at the rate of progress their expansion is making. Having said that, they are sifting through the bad apples which you can not blame them for.If their ATOBis to be approved by GCAA you can bet on their standards approximating Etihad,Emirates or any of the LCC in UAE.
If the work life balance works for you then yes check it out, but believe me, there isnt any life balance in wizz, its just work sleep fatigue repeat, random rosters, lots of calling from off etc.
The money isn't good enough for the strain it will put you under, admittedly having your family in AUH already will make it a little easier for you than the rest of the crew you would work with... But still don't expect to see them much and when you do you will be tired, because they will work you to your legal maximum or until you call fatigued. They are super short of staff in lots of places and even more short in the ops center so everything is a mess and getting even simple things sorted can be a nightmare.
I have heard rumours that guys who were forced to AUH during covid have been just putting their uniforms and ipads in the office and walking out never to be seen by the company again its getting so bad over there at times, but again, as you live in the region already and probably have your own house there etc then it could be doable... Just remember you will be earning less than the FO's next door so perhaps keep an eye out on those opportunities too.
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What you were saying before, I know exactly how it feels, and of course if its the only option its not a bad one, but for someone as experienced as yourself I would assume there are more and better options out there than this company.
If the work life balance works for you then yes check it out, but believe me, there isnt any life balance in wizz, its just work sleep fatigue repeat, random rosters, lots of calling from off etc.
The money isn't good enough for the strain it will put you under, admittedly having your family in AUH already will make it a little easier for you than the rest of the crew you would work with... But still don't expect to see them much and when you do you will be tired, because they will work you to your legal maximum or until you call fatigued. They are super short of staff in lots of places and even more short in the ops center so everything is a mess and getting even simple things sorted can be a nightmare.
I have heard rumours that guys who were forced to AUH during covid have been just putting their uniforms and ipads in the office and walking out never to be seen by the company again its getting so bad over there at times, but again, as you live in the region already and probably have your own house there etc then it could be doable... Just remember you will be earning less than the FO's next door so perhaps keep an eye out on those opportunities too.
If the work life balance works for you then yes check it out, but believe me, there isnt any life balance in wizz, its just work sleep fatigue repeat, random rosters, lots of calling from off etc.
The money isn't good enough for the strain it will put you under, admittedly having your family in AUH already will make it a little easier for you than the rest of the crew you would work with... But still don't expect to see them much and when you do you will be tired, because they will work you to your legal maximum or until you call fatigued. They are super short of staff in lots of places and even more short in the ops center so everything is a mess and getting even simple things sorted can be a nightmare.
I have heard rumours that guys who were forced to AUH during covid have been just putting their uniforms and ipads in the office and walking out never to be seen by the company again its getting so bad over there at times, but again, as you live in the region already and probably have your own house there etc then it could be doable... Just remember you will be earning less than the FO's next door so perhaps keep an eye out on those opportunities too.
Your advise is, however greatly appreciated for it shows empathy for a fellow comrade struggling to keep my wings back aloft! I shall attentively be sifting through these valuable threads for more insider tell tales.
I absolutely agree with your points Sir, all well scored! I am admittedly still deliberating in the most exhausting manner one could about whether or not to consider WZZ. It all depends on the face to face interview and what comes of it.I have already flown this type of LCC ops with worse conditions in Africa flying on occasion upto 9 sectprs per day with 6-8 being norm, zero crew meals(except for peanuts,biscuits and water,juice) being my staple diet for a couple of months when they were still fledgling and a salary not proud to announce here.I hacked it and managed to pull out after a couple of thousand hours with ATPL and find work in the Mid East even if getting initially involved with an LCC arguably worse than WZZ before I stabilized my jet career growth over a span of 8 years. Even if one does not own a home here it is where all my family relations are based. How many clear days off/month do you know you actually get at WZZ. I was hoping a more copious Crew meal would be provided bit I suppose they want you to buy on board to boost their in flight sales! Regardless what an FO makes next door to where I live or indeed what I was making till last month which is triple what WZZ can pay me; I see it for the sake of my own benefit due to lack of alternatives and sustainable employment time being. I think if I sacrifice a year so and upgrade on to the left seat on A321 I can live with the double increase in pay considering long term job security as WZZ has announced in public it plans to expand phenomenally in the coming decade. Most of my experience at the WWAD base (due to its distant location on its network) will mean long haul flying mostly on 321s.This means faster accumulation of flying hours on type which gives je a closer reach to joining the bigger carriers due to : already basing in UAE and operating with a UAE license. There are options to also consider ACJ jobs locally as well which will also be an improvement in pay from WZZ .So looking on the near horizon I might agree with you whole heartedly and sensibly but after years the the training bond period is over and if am not happy I will be in a more advantageous position to apply for an A380 job than I am now. As I will not financing the whole training, should I be selected, I have more to gain than lose. Whether my body,psyche or soul can cope is another matter and only when I time comes to swim the high seas will i be able to tell. For now better to jump on the bandwagon while optimism is still in the air and flowing in my veins. I have had poorer options to fall back on in the past and managed to cope for the short term goal I wanted to achieve then. My previous employers were not reliable paymasters and WZZ in comparison looks super organized, though with lots of stick in their carrot! This might be a fruit coated with thorns but there are ways to get to the fruit without the thorns getting in the way. They are just necessary obstacles and as I am not privileged to work in EU or USA where most of the decent jobs are, the M.East will do just fine for me, be it WZZ, Corporate, private jets, or indeed mega carriers like Emirates which will all be within reach with a couple of thousand hours and PIC time on the Airbus.
Your advise is, however greatly appreciated for it shows empathy for a fellow comrade struggling to keep my wings back aloft! I shall attentively be sifting through these valuable threads for more insider tell tales.
Your advise is, however greatly appreciated for it shows empathy for a fellow comrade struggling to keep my wings back aloft! I shall attentively be sifting through these valuable threads for more insider tell tales.
rhey spend about €4 on your crew meal and no ovens on board. So you’ll be buying food at the airport or bringing it with you every day
it has all these massive expansion plans but their crew retention levels are so bad that they can barely manage to crew the planes they already have. For every 1 who I know who joins with I know 2 are leaving.
30 this month-45 days have start dates with ba. We will run out of cabin crew soon
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days off will be minimum legal and a random roster probably, if you have more than min legal expect to be called on your off days
rhey spend about €4 on your crew meal and no ovens on board. So you’ll be buying food at the airport or bringing it with you every day
it has all these massive expansion plans but their crew retention levels are so bad that they can barely manage to crew the planes they already have. For every 1 who I know who joins with I know 2 are leaving.
30 this month-45 days have start dates with ba. We will run out of cabin crew soon
rhey spend about €4 on your crew meal and no ovens on board. So you’ll be buying food at the airport or bringing it with you every day
it has all these massive expansion plans but their crew retention levels are so bad that they can barely manage to crew the planes they already have. For every 1 who I know who joins with I know 2 are leaving.
30 this month-45 days have start dates with ba. We will run out of cabin crew soon
What an eye opener. Thanks mate. Yes something has to yield if they are biting more then they can chew.I am a former Airline Corporate Planner and agree if it goes unchecked without the right structures and incentives to contain the workforce it could have disastrous consequences. If I find a better job, especially non low cost or one where upfront payment for training not demanded ofcourse I shall change course. Meantime I shall steer through these treacherous seas and see if there is an escape route should things prove to mirror what you suggest. Frankly based on how long duty hours one would fly from the WWAD base I would expect a better crew meal service option and not having to pay for any training if signing a bond.UAE GCAA is strict on regs and so I hope it shall be policed in favour of maintaining safety standards. Unfortunately from what I know has been happening at all other airlines here Crew Fatigue Management is an ongoing sore subject that has not yet been resolved.
They said WWAD base being far off their network crew wont ve flown as hard but not sure of the mandatory days off per month.If you find out from any pilots that lefy from the WWAD base please share their reality.
Last edited by 380Mrat; 27th Apr 2022 at 22:34.
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What an eye opener. Thanks mate. Yes something has to yield if they are biting more then they can chew.I am a former Airline Corporate Planner and agree if it goes unchecked without the right structures and incentives to contain the workforce it could have disastrous consequences. If I find a better job, especially non low cost or one where upfront payment for training not demanded ofcourse I shall change course. Meantime I shall steer through these treacherous seas and see if there is an escape route should things prove to mirror what you suggest. Frankly based on how long duty hours one would fly from the WWAD base I would expect a better crew meal service option and not having to pay for any training if signing a bond.UAE GCAA is strict on regs and so I hope it shall be policed in favour of maintaining safety standards. Unfortunately from what I know has been happening at all other airlines here Crew Fatigue Management is an ongoing sore subject that has not yet been resolved.
They said WWAD base being far off their network crew wont ve flown as hard but not sure of the mandatory days off per month.If you find out from any pilots that lefy from the WWAD base please share their reality.
They said WWAD base being far off their network crew wont ve flown as hard but not sure of the mandatory days off per month.If you find out from any pilots that lefy from the WWAD base please share their reality.
Already cancelling flights due to lack of flt crew.
Most in my base have 100+ hrs this month.
All the people coming from the desert will leave soon.
Wizz 500 will never happen. Not with the current planning.
Ezy also cancelling due to lack of drivers.
Lauda desperate for pilots.
Its gonna be a fun summer...
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thats exactly how described.
Already cancelling flights due to lack of flt crew.
Most in my base have 100+ hrs this month.
All the people coming from the desert will leave soon.
Wizz 500 will never happen. Not with the current planning.
Ezy also cancelling due to lack of drivers.
Lauda desperate for pilots.
Its gonna be a fun summer...
Already cancelling flights due to lack of flt crew.
Most in my base have 100+ hrs this month.
All the people coming from the desert will leave soon.
Wizz 500 will never happen. Not with the current planning.
Ezy also cancelling due to lack of drivers.
Lauda desperate for pilots.
Its gonna be a fun summer...
I see. By the way it ain't a desert here everywhere🥴 and certainly not in the cities. No wonder they are targeting on recruiting mostly for the "desert" as a result. 100+ hours is illegal crossing 105 in 28 days. That means no off day whole month for them? Were they paid for the extra hours and off days as they claim they pay? Because you jave to pay rent 3-6 months in advance leaving quickly will incur further losses.
Last edited by 380Mrat; 28th Apr 2022 at 14:09.
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In 2015 the employee group asked about the new livery had the idea of addig a belly logo. It was rejected by the management as the aircraft needs to look "clean and crisp". Fast forward seven years and 100 aircraft without the logo you have this:
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/10558606
I bet someone got a bonus for the idea.
https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/10558606
I bet someone got a bonus for the idea.
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Belly logo
I think if they pride themselves on being lean that belly logo painted on 500 planes(as they advertise their growth plan) is gonna cost them a few Euros and carbon footprints. More weight means more fuel burn means more emissions...if we are to get fastidiously mathematical Judging from the complaints laid here-in they ought to get more emotional and empathic with their employees instead to retain workforce perhaps?
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I'm at a base with way less daily average flight time, but would certainly be exceeding my maximum flight hours with the absolute minimum days off. If I'm flying 100 hours a month, i have at least 10 days off.
Admittedly I'm not providing info on AUH as I don't know enough about it, but in other busy bases, its extremely random, Perhaps they will be luckier in AUH these days, but this company will find a way to work you to the bone no matter what bases and flights you have
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Abu Dhabi base will have longest sectors and as the network is mostly east- west-east any number of days off you will be struggling to wear off the jetlag. Even if you do not fly much. I assume you will be doing back to back service to Europe with minimum night stops. It would help a lot to get night stops at least...otherwise burn out and resignations plus crew attrition will happen faster. I have done these Mid East Europe dailies sometimes with 2 or 3 sectors and even if it was not a low cost jet..bloody knackering! And we were served proper meals on board and they all ended with night stops and breakfast on a 4-5star hotel. What is the standard of hotels provided by Wizz? Like ibiz I suppose?
Last edited by 380Mrat; 1st May 2022 at 12:00.
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Not only am I a experienced Airbus Captain, my PC is currently valid and It's been less than 40 days since my last A320 flight.
I now have a job OUTSIDE of A320. The money being offered is a joke; stop accepting these rubbish conditions.
Now I fly a brand new type for 200Kish a year.
Training and type paid by new employer. Why waste efforts with Wizzair?
If you want jokes, go see a stand up show. Your career shouldn't be a joke.
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For a "Captain" you should take care with the language you use. ..it gives you away as immature.
Good for you if you can obtain a free type rating with a salary of 200K(no currency mentioned!) wherever you are. Not everyone gets entitled to free type ratings so stop acting like a brat...and dont tell me what to do. Chances are I have seen Aviation longer than you have.
Perhaps when you feel the pangs of unemployment in the not too distant future you could pull a stand up joke career..and I suspect you might be good at it..after quite a few gaffs!
Good for you if you can obtain a free type rating with a salary of 200K(no currency mentioned!) wherever you are. Not everyone gets entitled to free type ratings so stop acting like a brat...and dont tell me what to do. Chances are I have seen Aviation longer than you have.
Perhaps when you feel the pangs of unemployment in the not too distant future you could pull a stand up joke career..and I suspect you might be good at it..after quite a few gaffs!