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IAG: BA restructuring may cost 12,000 jobs

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IAG: BA restructuring may cost 12,000 jobs

Old 22nd Aug 2020, 14:43
  #1641 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: London UK
Posts: 54

That is far too sensible when the people at the top of the business want to cut costs now for two layers of jam tomorrow.
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Old 22nd Aug 2020, 14:56
  #1642 (permalink)  
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Short answer is - No it couldn't be agreed...

That's basically the sort of thing I think the reasonable Unions, cognisant of the world situation, suggested to BA management right at the start of all this and I think would have been prepared to sign off on.

For the reason richardwpprn stated those at the top wanted much more.
wiggy is online now  
Old 23rd Aug 2020, 08:38
  #1643 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 147

Perhaps you might like to inform readers here of exactly what the BA pilots strike was all about in September last year, which caused the company to issue a profit warning? Seemed rather bolshy and petulant behaviour not even worthy of Len McCluskey.

Even more mysterious is what settled the dispute? Nobody seems to know. Hardly covered yourselves in glory.

So I wouldn’t be too critical of other employees in BA who do a have genuine reason for industrial action, rather than simply tossing their toys out of the pram.
Count Niemantznarr is offline  
Old 23rd Aug 2020, 10:13
  #1644 (permalink)  
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Not a very helpful comment considering you clearly know the answer. In defence the actual existence of the company along with all jobs was not an issue then, following a record profit year following which most of it was chucked at shareholders and top management.
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 10:32
  #1645 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2011
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No not very “helpful”, and about as helpful as many BA flight crew were during the cabin crew dispute who acted as strikebreakers.......feeding the crocodile in the hope it would eat them last.

Some BA pilots were highly critical of BALPA last year and the handling of their dispute. Although there was a settlement of sorts, many BA Flight Crew considered it “unfinished business”.

I was just wondering when this industrial action is likely to start up again?
Count Niemantznarr is offline  
Old 23rd Aug 2020, 11:27
  #1646 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Whatever the rights and wrongs of numerous strikes in the past (don’t forget the mixed fleet strike a couple of years ago) now is just not the time to be threatening a strike.

This is very very real, I suggest driving around to TBA / TBC and just seeing the sheer number of aircraft sitting idle, 747 fleet has gone just like that, the word on the street is only 8 380s are coming back and a significant proportion of the 777s are to be stood down for a while. There are 16 A321s sitting in the ground at Glasgow, the list is endless. All airlines are scrambling about for any fares to reduce the enormous losses and any threats from UNITE with regards strikes will undermine what little confidence remains, no passengers = no money = no jobs.

BA have behaved outrageously, Walsh and Cruz have twisted this situation to achieve what they have wanted for years and for that they should hang their heads in shame but UNITE have been no better, burying their heads in the sand and not talking to the company, a political campaign to remove slots (and therefore even more jobs) and now threatening a strike, akin to shooting your sled in the foot.

i have survived round 1, but there will be a round 2, will I survive that? What about a round 3 or round 4? UNITE are playing a dangerous game and need to tone it down for all our sakes or there may just be no jobs at all.
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 13:15
  #1647 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 122

You forgot about the future pensions of many staff.
To avoid going into the PPF, BA/IAG has to remain solvent.
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 13:28
  #1648 (permalink)  
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Count Niemantznarr

Some were indeed critical but even so there's absolutely zero appetite for that particular industrial action starting up again.
wiggy is online now  
Old 23rd Aug 2020, 14:24
  #1649 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2006
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Posts: 1,686
777 has a very good point.
NAPS alone has a fund value of about UKP 20 Billion.

The whole of IAG is only worth UKP 3.8 billion. BA is still a pension fund with a little airline attached.

The deficit is about UKP 3 Billion.

BA were supposed to pay in 450m per annum for at least 3 years. Where is that coming from??

Most investments by Pension funds are not in a good place right now.

So let's all have a strike, and pass on Slots to other airlines, and be paid our pensions from the PPF..

Great idea.
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 16:09
  #1650 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2002
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There's a 3 month backlog for a CETV and it currently takes about 8 weeks to get a 'retirement pack' . Makes you wonder why.
There's an awful lot of over 55s looking at taking the money and legging it sharpish just to protect their pension. If the US market doesn't open before Christmas BA are screwed.
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 17:25
  #1651 (permalink)  
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Ancient Observer

Not sure the NAPS figures are even that good.

Mostly because BA took their "pension holiday".

Wait until the 55+ start pulling it out, or crystalizing it. The black hole will become even clearer.
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 19:33
  #1652 (permalink)  
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Count Niemantznarr -

Originally Posted by Lordflasheart

Probably this lot ......
Greetings, Excellency,

Apologies if one caused any offence with those links, posted in the hope they might answer a couple of earlier questions. No criticism implied, intended (or dare one claim evident ?) in one's post, of any individual or group.

If link content should be the issue, one would recommend referring such matters to their respective Editors.

And one is awfully apologetic that one is quite unable to answer any of your direct or implied questions about the pilots' strike you refer to.

Respectful felicitations, Lord Flasheart.

BTW - One thought Your Excellency had retired to the country years ago. Does one detect a teenzy-weenzy residual chip on the noble shoulder ?
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 19:55
  #1653 (permalink)  
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There seems to be a huge appetite by some to bring BA down. In three weeks, 15/9 I believe,. there is to be a rights issue of 2.75B which Qatar have already pledged to take up their 25% share. If things look bad then lots of the remaining 75% will be left with the underwriters. They will unload them and I can easily see 24% of them being bought by Qatar, 49% is the Max shareholdering they can hold.
This stake could have a profound effect on IAGs future
Will they then seek to offload NAPS into the PPS, as I understand it the PPS would require BA to make good the deficit, unless BA declare bankruptcy, unlikely I feel after the rights issue. So great uncertainty I believe.
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Old 23rd Aug 2020, 20:25
  #1654 (permalink)  

Controversial, moi?
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Not sure the NAPS figures are even that good.

Mostly because BA took their "pension holiday".
I suggest you read up on pension law before making incorrect assertions.
M.Mouse is online now  
Old 23rd Aug 2020, 21:35
  #1655 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: sussex
Posts: 607

Great uncertainty but pension funds run over many decades,so although a short term problem a return to profit in a few years should see the NAPS fund back on track.
stormin norman is offline  
Old 24th Aug 2020, 00:13
  #1656 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 132
I am a 'pensioner' in a pension fund that was under BA's wing once. The BRAL Pension Scheme. We have just had our pension payments cut by 35%. Something worth thinking about. Good night. Sleep happily.
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Old 24th Aug 2020, 06:46
  #1657 (permalink)  
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Noel, very sad to hear this situation. Thanks for sharing. I posted recently with concerns of the ill conceived CRS, in particular what happens if there was a further downturn and the view that there are a multitude of more worthy causes to focus on for those fortunate enough to continue working......a poignant example and I am sure more examples of hardship and individual difficulties will surface....as has been said, consciences particularly with regard to self interest in the wider context of hardship need squaring......
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Old 24th Aug 2020, 11:21
  #1658 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2001
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..Noel - Is that the pension fund that's now based in the Isle of Man - outside the jurisdiction of the UK Pension Protection Fund ?

Heart felt commiserations - Sounds like it got a touch of the maxwell.
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Old 24th Aug 2020, 15:11
  #1659 (permalink)  
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Not sure whether this should be here, since BA feature prominently or in UK politics..anyway:

wiggy is online now  
Old 25th Aug 2020, 11:18
  #1660 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Coast to Coast...
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Is civil war brewing for BA pilots and union BALPA?https://www.headforpoints.com/2020/0...ommentsContent
Smooth Airperator is offline  

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