Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Terms and Endearment
Reload this Page >

Please support easyJet Pilots and Cabin Crew

Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

Please support easyJet Pilots and Cabin Crew

Old 19th Mar 2020, 19:50
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 55
Please support easyJet Pilots and Cabin Crew

https://www.change.org/p/grant-shapp..._share_initial
polkadotwellies is offline  
Old 19th Mar 2020, 20:34
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: this side of the moon
Posts: 38
Originally Posted by polkadotwellies View Post
welcome to the world of low cost
there she blows is offline  
Old 19th Mar 2020, 21:02
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Looking north out to sea
Posts: 2
Err....

As an ex TCX Captain, 2 months unemployed, then a Flybe Captain, again unemployed, how do you think we feel.

Current on the 330, 320 and Q400 and no prospect of a job. A cut is bad, but no job is worse.

Me
ItsonlyMeagain is offline  
Old 19th Mar 2020, 22:15
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Cloud 9
Posts: 2,949
Meanwhile, EasyJet's chief executive Johan Lundgren has defended the payment of £170m in dividends to shareholders, at a time when the company is seeking financial help from the government.
Phileas Fogg is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 16:24
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 132
How can anyone with any common sense support a petition like that when they have read ItsonlyMeagain's post. He has it spot on:
A cut is bad, but no job is worse.
NoelEvans is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 17:00
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Dark side of the Moon
Posts: 67
Originally Posted by ItsonlyMeagain View Post
Err....

As an ex TCX Captain, 2 months unemployed, then a Flybe Captain, again unemployed, how do you think we feel.

Current on the 330, 320 and Q400 and no prospect of a job. A cut is bad, but no job is worse.

Me
Agreed. This whole thread reeks of first world problems. Stinks.
RogueOne is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 17:09
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: London
Posts: 103
Originally Posted by NoelEvans View Post
How can anyone with any common sense support a petition like that when they have read ItsonlyMeagain's post. He has it spot on:
I'm sorry to say, but I think that to be a very naive viewpoint. There is a massive grey area between job loss and nessesary cuts to employee terms and conditons. Trusting the management to do anything but act in their own best interests will only result in one thing. Question everything.

I also do not buy into the arguement that because someone has it worse, no one else is allowed to defend their own conditions. Someone is always worse off. Again, that attitude only sends us in one direction.

Sincerely not looking for a fight; just trying to put over a side of the debate that I think should benefit us all
clvf88 is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 20:35
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: somewhere hot and sticky
Age: 40
Posts: 284
Originally Posted by NoelEvans View Post
How can anyone with any common sense support a petition like that when they have read ItsonlyMeagain's post. He has it spot on:
I've got to disagree with you here. One person's misfortune or mistreatment doesn't justify the mistreatment of someone else just because it's not as bad.

If we think of it like that we are destined to have all T&Cs degrade to the lowest common denominator as no one will be able to defend themselves because "there is someone else worse off"

The loss of a job is horrifying, especially for a family's breadwinner, and itsonlymeagain is clearly in a terrible situation with my full sympathy. But to use that situation to disable another group from standing up for themselves in the face of harsh treatment seems logically incoherent.
Dupre is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 21:44
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Somewhere cold
Posts: 38
Dupre, spot on.
Falling_Penguin is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2020, 00:53
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: N/A
Posts: 1,172
The 'I have it worse than you so consider yourself lucky' argument is only ever going to facilitate a race to the bottom.

easyJet crew deserve your support right now - none of us want to see airlines go bust, but I'd rather not see people being taken advantage of whilst they're in a sticky situation.

It's a great place to work as a pilot, please, let's keep it that way.

Last edited by student88; 21st Mar 2020 at 12:50.
student88 is offline  
Old 21st Mar 2020, 09:10
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Uk
Posts: 0
If you actually read it , it’s a significant land grab of previous TCs, and a convenient excuse to get their way.

I sympathise with those who are redundant ( twice before for me, and maybe again ), but I’m not going to work for peanuts because any “ job is better than no job “, will leave nothing worth coming back to.

Aldi paying £9.50 an hour to stack shelves , go do that , until things improve
Meester proach is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 00:31
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 132
Originally Posted by Dupre View Post
I've got to disagree with you here. One person's misfortune or mistreatment doesn't justify the mistreatment of someone else just because it's not as bad.

If we think of it like that we are destined to have all T&Cs degrade to the lowest common denominator as no one will be able to defend themselves because "there is someone else worse off"

The loss of a job is horrifying, especially for a family's breadwinner, and itsonlymeagain is clearly in a terrible situation with my full sympathy. But to use that situation to disable another group from standing up for themselves in the face of harsh treatment seems logically incoherent.
By all means have your symbolic "stand up for yourselves", but when the money is running out (i.e. customers no longer paying), where does the money come from?

All your grandstanding is worth nowt if there is no money
NoelEvans is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 05:41
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: FLSomething
Posts: 157
Originally Posted by NoelEvans View Post
By all means have your symbolic "stand up for yourselves", but when the money is running out (i.e. customers no longer paying), where does the money come from?

All your grandstanding is worth nowt if there is no money
I’ve got a family member that works in a bar and has just lost their job. They were making £9.20 an hour. Does that mean that EasyJet captains shouldn’t be allowed to ask for anything more than £9.20 an hour as, in your words, ‘a cut is better than no job’ and they should be grateful for keeping their job?
VariablePitchP is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 11:55
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Planet no. 3
Posts: 101
Surely drastic measures are needed. The worst is yet to come and this country doesn't seem to realise.

This article sums it up pretty well in my view:

https://www.socialist.net/airline-in...t-planning.htm
We can certainly expect unprecedented government intervention in the coming weeks to stop the airline industry from plummeting. But we cannot trust the current airline bosses to simply accept government money and continue as if nothing happened.

Instead of simply throwing money at failing businesses, we should take them over completely and have them run for needs, not profits.

Air travel is a vital component of the modern global economy. But capitalism has utterly failed to make this crucial infrastructure run properly. Far from being utopian, therefore, bold socialist measures are the only way out of this crisis - for the airline industry, and for wider society.

Nationalisation should be accompanied by workers’ control: giving power to those who actually run the show, and introducing genuine democracy in the workplace. After all, in the last few days, airline workers have seen the utter incompetence of their managers in dealing with this sector-wide catastrophe.

If the shareholders claim poverty, we say: open the books! Let us check what the accounts say exactly. If the bosses cannot provide for our survival in the coming months, the demand must be for the shareholders to pay for workers’ wages out of their dividends and profits.
vlieger is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 15:16
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 132
Originally Posted by VariablePitchP View Post
I’ve got a family member that works in a bar and has just lost their job. They were making £9.20 an hour. Does that mean that EasyJet captains shouldn’t be allowed to ask for anything more than £9.20 an hour as, in your words, ‘a cut is better than no job’ and they should be grateful for keeping their job?
Where is the money coming from? If the customers are gone, so is the money. By all means ask for anything you want, but if the money is not there, then the money is not there and you are unlikely to get it. And I cannot see that the taxpayers, who are under huge strain themselves right now, would be happy to 'bail out' EasyJet captains for their pay. So, Ill ask again: Where is the money coming from?

(And I won't listen to any socialist ramblings, when the origin of this current problem was a communist run country.)
NoelEvans is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 15:27
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: England
Posts: 1,828
Ummmm, logically speaking, perhaps not the best reason to ignore socialist ramblings?

Anyway, some at EZ may take great inspiration from this little gem:


Superpilot is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 17:14
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: England
Posts: 369
Vlieger, you are joking aren’t you! If not, I recommend you transfer to North Korea to enjoy the success of socialism.

Last edited by Capt Scribble; 22nd Mar 2020 at 17:25.
Capt Scribble is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 17:53
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Tottenham
Posts: 10
Originally Posted by vlieger View Post
Surely drastic measures are needed. The worst is yet to come and this country doesn't seem to realise.

This article sums it up pretty well in my view:
I agree entirely. It's time to end the privatisation of profits and socialism of losses. Shareholders can't have it both ways
CurlyB is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 18:21
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: London
Posts: 103
Originally Posted by NoelEvans View Post
Where is the money coming from? If the customers are gone, so is the money. By all means ask for anything you want, but if the money is not there, then the money is not there and you are unlikely to get it. And I cannot see that the taxpayers, who are under huge strain themselves right now, would be happy to 'bail out' EasyJet captains for their pay. So, Ill ask again: Where is the money coming from?

(And I won't listen to any socialist ramblings, when the origin of this current problem was a communist run country.)
You have a very confused and short-termist view of how a business operates. You realise x% doesnt roll off the customers credit cards straight into employees payroll?

The money would most likely come from existing cash positions. In more extreme circumstances it could come from the disposal of assets. If the business is viewed to be viable and profitable in the long term, it could come from some manner of borrowing.
clvf88 is offline  
Old 22nd Mar 2020, 18:43
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 132
Originally Posted by clvf88 View Post
You have a very confused and short-termist view of how a business operates. You realise x% doesnt roll off the customers credit cards straight into employees payroll?

The money would most likely come from existing cash positions. In more extreme circumstances it could come from the disposal of assets. If the business is viewed to be viable and profitable in the long term, it could come from some manner of borrowing.
I'm thinking far more in long term. Little 'blips' can always be ironed out (e.g. a period of winter snow closing airports and sending things out of kilter). It's the long term wind downs or, even worse, shut downs that will cause the money to dry up.

Borrowing? Which bank or institution is going to lend to any airline right now? Banks have pulled the plug on airlines in major crises in the past.

I'm not trying to be unfairly hard on anyone, just trying to correct any "I'm entitled to to my current pay" misconceptions. If the money isn't there you're not 'entitled' to anything.
NoelEvans is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.