Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Terms and Endearment
Reload this Page >

Norwegian Lack of Pilots

Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

Norwegian Lack of Pilots

Old 26th Jun 2017, 16:10
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: SPAIN
Age: 38
Posts: 397
Norwegian Lack of Pilots

The company has sended a letter to all pilots explaining the reasons why they are short of people and offering double day off payment from today until August.
samca is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2017, 17:18
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 159
Wasn't this the same last summer....holiday chaos??
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
IMG_4427.JPG (420.1 KB, 212 views)
nosmo king is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2017, 18:09
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Mars
Posts: 44
Well maybe if they started giving out real contracts they would not have this mess ?
unb5 is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2017, 18:23
  #4 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: SPAIN
Age: 38
Posts: 397
Norwegian strands passengers again

It is not going to be the only low cost in Europe. Let see...
samca is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2017, 18:25
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 17
Hardly surprising when they sack most their pilots in the winter.
SeaBreeze1 is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2017, 18:51
  #6 (permalink)  
Plumbum Pendular
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Avionics Bay
Age: 50
Posts: 1,100
This seasonal employment trend cannot last for ever. People need to pay to live.
fmgc is offline  
Old 27th Jun 2017, 08:40
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: I wish I knew
Posts: 611
And some pilots are negotiating 5,6, 7 day off payments to do the flights.. read " demanding" airlines may do this to get the bums in the air, but nearly always reap their revenge at the end of the season! on the other hand, make hay while the sun shines as job security is about as long as it takes to read the contract
Avenger is offline  
Old 27th Jun 2017, 20:07
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: The Pointy End
Posts: 32
Well. Well done Norwegian

Last edited by EFISchap; 28th Sep 2017 at 20:03.
EFISchap is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 06:01
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: gate 67 JFK
Posts: 688
Not a single pilot was laid off over the past winter or even offered reduced working.

This summer's shortage is less to do with poor forward planning and more to do with a wider (quality) pilot shortage in the industry, Ryanair are also having to cancel flights.

Its a viscous circle, crews hitting max hours, insufficient training sectors, bottle necks in CRC checks, Licensing, additional sim training for US operations and a lot of new aircraft.
INKJET is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 06:35
  #10 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: SPAIN
Age: 38
Posts: 397
100% agree.

Si Why airlines prefer to cancel flights and stop their expansion instead negociate with pilots their working conditions for this new age in aviation conditions industry?,

Why they pretend to buy constantly our days off and to live in the edge of the limit? They don't care their pax or reputation?
samca is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 06:38
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Europe
Age: 40
Posts: 545
In other words, the incredible short-sightedness of airlines when it comes to training pilots, as in taking a zero hour person and offering training up to and including ATPL, comes back yet again to bite them in the posterior. 'Someone else will solve my training problems' seems to be their operating mantra.
SMT Member is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 07:44
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: World citizen
Posts: 315
@EFISchap ... So many people in these management/HR offices having no clue
of what they're doing

Last edited by dan1165; 28th Jun 2017 at 07:45. Reason: add
dan1165 is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 08:38
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,510
And yet the major LoCo's are still ordering a/c to expand. Some how the equation is not balanced. Pilots think this will cause a significant rise in remuneration packages. The airlines will be scared like heck to do this because once the high salary is on the table to entice more pilots to join them it will be very difficult to remove it later on. As yearly increments are a % of salary their wage bill good be soaring for years. I know there are some imaginative remuneration constructions out there that could be adjusted i years to come, but pilots will not accept a reduction in income in the future. It will be a fine balance.
Many species went into rapid decline due to lack of food supply. Airline expansion, and their rising share price, could go the same way if they cancel flights and/or do not expand. In their medium term planning there is an assumption that the oft feared 'lack of pilots' will never happen. That can only be avoided by either the industry as a whole improving the T's & C's, or there being a jungle war to entice pilots to the highest payer away others. However, for that to succeed the beneficiary has to have enough training capacity to accept such an influx. That will be a huge bottle neck.
Airlines that have a large retirement bulge in 1 year at the same time a having a huge recruitment burst to both replace the retirees and expansion will have the worst problems. You can't pluck simulators & training captains off the trees.
RAT 5 is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 08:47
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London
Posts: 236
Originally Posted by INKJET View Post
Not a single pilot was laid off over the past winter or even offered reduced working.

This summer's shortage is less to do with poor forward planning and more to do with a wider (quality) pilot shortage in the industry, Ryanair are also having to cancel flights.

Its a viscous circle, crews hitting max hours, insufficient training sectors, bottle necks in CRC checks, Licensing, additional sim training for US operations and a lot of new aircraft.
Weirdly though BA are having no such issues, wonder why?
Enzo999 is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 09:00
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Italy
Posts: 118
They still refuse to give out decent contracts and try to run the airline with the minimal amount of people. Well done Norwegian. They are lucky that the fuel prices are still low otherwise it would get very very difficult. Although with their massive debt.......
Scuderia46 is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 09:35
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Wor Yerm
Age: 63
Posts: 0
If there is a REAL shortage of experienced pilots, I just hope those who do accept positions in these companies hold out for a very extortionate package. Just to balance the risible terms offered when the boot is on the other foot. Let's show them how expensive "low cost" is when it comes to people.
Piltdown Man is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 11:04
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: I wouldn't know.
Posts: 3,934
There is no real pilot shortage at all. However, there might be a certain shortage of terms and conditions that appeal to experienced pilots. What some airlines in europe do not realise, that especially on the captains market they actually do compete with chinese airlines which offer european bases, working half a year at twice to three times the pay. And of course they do compete with european airlines that do offer better terms and conditions as well. Although those usually do not hire DECs, they can and do train internally.
Denti is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 11:29
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: On the ground
Posts: 49
In the place I am working at the moment, there is a very noticeable pilot shortage. The wet lease factor is at 19%, the sickness rate is 15% and everybody is flying 900 hours this year. All companies do about it is requiring more and more compromises from the pilots councils and the unions, if such things don't exist, they just do it. FY seems to have lost a considerable amount of pilots this year.

IMHO the airlines are still arrogant enough to employ "the right people". I don't know if authorities or the carriers are to blame, but age discrimination in China is a fact.
Brix is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 11:34
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Germany
Posts: 116
Originally Posted by Enzo999 View Post
Weirdly though BA are having no such issues, wonder why?
Well they have other issues, like fixing broken customer relations and making up for 100s of million GPB in losses due to their IT Desaster a couple weeks back
Parkbremse is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2017, 12:06
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: London
Posts: 236
Agreed, although I think you know the point I was making. Companies that provide their pilots with decent T and Cs are not struggling for pilots. And whilst IAG are making 1.5 billion in profits you will have a hard time convincing the investors BA have "issues".
Enzo999 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.