Rumour: Norwegian vs Ryanair
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Rumour: Norwegian vs Ryanair
Norwegian have received 1500 CV from Ryanair pilots.
What do you think that means and what could be the consequences for pilots? Good news you think?
What do you think that means and what could be the consequences for pilots? Good news you think?
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Don't feed the troll.
NAS only has a small requirement compared to those numbers quoted over the next year atleast and those places where being filled several months ago with candidates being interviewed in June for January courses.
I don't know what their plans are for the Airbus which arrives in 2015.
NAS only has a small requirement compared to those numbers quoted over the next year atleast and those places where being filled several months ago with candidates being interviewed in June for January courses.
I don't know what their plans are for the Airbus which arrives in 2015.
Last edited by McBruce; 15th Oct 2013 at 14:19.
The rumour goes that at one point one of the senior Norwegian recruiters was ex-FR training department and was taking FR crew without sim checks as he knew the standards at FR.
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The fact is I was giving an example of what should happen to improve condition's for pilots everywhere.
Of course they wont have their CVs torn up. 1500 yes-men lowering themselves trying to squeeze in the door, DY Mangement will be throwing a party to celebrate!
Say good bye to sick pay and pensions guys!
In other words a demonstrated ability to sign Brookfield contracts without complaining.
Of course they wont have their CVs torn up. 1500 yes-men lowering themselves trying to squeeze in the door, DY Mangement will be throwing a party to celebrate!
Say good bye to sick pay and pensions guys!
was taking FR crew without sim checks as he knew the standards at FR.
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Todays news (with a "little" help by Google Translate )
The carrier Norwegian many Danish customers at risk in a few weeks having to find another airline to travel with.
Norwegian hundreds of pilots threaten to stop work for 14 days after bargaining with management Monday collapsed .
The pilots' union has announced mass resignations of all its 620 members. If the parties do not agree within two weeks, strike a reality.
Communications in Norwegian, Anne- Sissel Skånvik , confirms to news agency NTB that negotiations have stalled, and that now must be mediation to try to reach an agreement .
The same thing happened last year.
- We always hope to agree, saying Skånevik and stresses that the company does not want to dramatize the situation .
The pilots fear that they will lose rights they have secured through a variety of reckoning if Norwegian management completes a major reorganization.
The pilots include afraid that Norwegian want to create separate companies in the countries it operates in - like the newly established Norwegian Air Norway and long distance carrier Norwegian Long Haul .
If this happens , the pilots' current agreements canceled and pilots must negotiate new agreements on working conditions in the different countries.
- The Company will crush the deal structure, we have previously negotiated , and which forms the basis for our rights , says Halvor Vatnar , leader of Norwegian Pilot Union.
In practice, what is a group of employees across the countries where Norwegian is active , be split and isolate Swedish , Danish and Norwegian pilots in single groups , says the union.
The carrier Norwegian many Danish customers at risk in a few weeks having to find another airline to travel with.
Norwegian hundreds of pilots threaten to stop work for 14 days after bargaining with management Monday collapsed .
The pilots' union has announced mass resignations of all its 620 members. If the parties do not agree within two weeks, strike a reality.
Communications in Norwegian, Anne- Sissel Skånvik , confirms to news agency NTB that negotiations have stalled, and that now must be mediation to try to reach an agreement .
The same thing happened last year.
- We always hope to agree, saying Skånevik and stresses that the company does not want to dramatize the situation .
The pilots fear that they will lose rights they have secured through a variety of reckoning if Norwegian management completes a major reorganization.
The pilots include afraid that Norwegian want to create separate companies in the countries it operates in - like the newly established Norwegian Air Norway and long distance carrier Norwegian Long Haul .
If this happens , the pilots' current agreements canceled and pilots must negotiate new agreements on working conditions in the different countries.
- The Company will crush the deal structure, we have previously negotiated , and which forms the basis for our rights , says Halvor Vatnar , leader of Norwegian Pilot Union.
In practice, what is a group of employees across the countries where Norwegian is active , be split and isolate Swedish , Danish and Norwegian pilots in single groups , says the union.
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A slightly more lucid version
14.10.2013
*Pilot Association of Norwegian broke Monday talks with the leadership of English , which may mean that the company is on strike for 14 days. The reason for the breakup is that it will weaken the pilots' bargaining rights by moving them out of the parent company and into newly created companies.
Head of Norwegian Pilot Union , Halvor Vatnar , finding that the company he has worked for a number of years now trying to isolate the Swedish , Danish and Norwegian pilots in various subsidiaries where they are deprived of the rights we have .
- That we could not accept and therefore was a break in the proceedings, saying she explains .
Confidence in the company's management , according Vatnar frayed because of repeated violations of agreements.
- The management has changed our plan in violation of the collective agreement and also broken Statement Bjørn Kjos gave us last time we negotiated. When they now will crush deal structure we have previously negotiated and which forms the basis of our rights was the conflict , he said.
Kav from the pilots according Vatnar can be described easily through the three points where the company must :
· Comply with existing agreements .
· Live the policy statement issued by Bjørn Kjos .
· Provide pilots equal career opportunities in English .
The main collective bargaining for pilots in the Norwegian began Friday. Basically it was set aside three days for negotiations between the parties. Negotiation Leader in Parat , Thore Selstad Halvorsen , said they were met by a management who did not want negotiations but was keen to reorganize the pilots so they could avoid further real collective bargaining .
- With such a basis , we were forced into a fast break to maintain our bargaining . I am surprised that management chooses the conflict line against its own employees . As we have warned failure , it could mean that the employees and the company is plunged into an unnecessary conflict that could end strike in 14 days , says Halvorsen.
Parat negotiator is difficult to understand why not all the pilots of the company shall be treated equally regarding career opportunities.
- Different payment based on the base in Europe they are stationed at different is natural and part of our collective agreement . A Spanish pilot will have Spanish terms , a Finnish pilot Finnish terms and Norwegian pilot Norwegian conditions . In our view, the company will also make sure that all pilots can be used where it is needed, says Halvorsen.
Parat , on behalf of Norwegian Pilot Union announced stoppage of nearly all pilots in English with effect from 31 October. If the parties agree before that time , the company will be on strike .
14.10.2013
*Pilot Association of Norwegian broke Monday talks with the leadership of English , which may mean that the company is on strike for 14 days. The reason for the breakup is that it will weaken the pilots' bargaining rights by moving them out of the parent company and into newly created companies.
Head of Norwegian Pilot Union , Halvor Vatnar , finding that the company he has worked for a number of years now trying to isolate the Swedish , Danish and Norwegian pilots in various subsidiaries where they are deprived of the rights we have .
- That we could not accept and therefore was a break in the proceedings, saying she explains .
Confidence in the company's management , according Vatnar frayed because of repeated violations of agreements.
- The management has changed our plan in violation of the collective agreement and also broken Statement Bjørn Kjos gave us last time we negotiated. When they now will crush deal structure we have previously negotiated and which forms the basis of our rights was the conflict , he said.
Kav from the pilots according Vatnar can be described easily through the three points where the company must :
· Comply with existing agreements .
· Live the policy statement issued by Bjørn Kjos .
· Provide pilots equal career opportunities in English .
The main collective bargaining for pilots in the Norwegian began Friday. Basically it was set aside three days for negotiations between the parties. Negotiation Leader in Parat , Thore Selstad Halvorsen , said they were met by a management who did not want negotiations but was keen to reorganize the pilots so they could avoid further real collective bargaining .
- With such a basis , we were forced into a fast break to maintain our bargaining . I am surprised that management chooses the conflict line against its own employees . As we have warned failure , it could mean that the employees and the company is plunged into an unnecessary conflict that could end strike in 14 days , says Halvorsen.
Parat negotiator is difficult to understand why not all the pilots of the company shall be treated equally regarding career opportunities.
- Different payment based on the base in Europe they are stationed at different is natural and part of our collective agreement . A Spanish pilot will have Spanish terms , a Finnish pilot Finnish terms and Norwegian pilot Norwegian conditions . In our view, the company will also make sure that all pilots can be used where it is needed, says Halvorsen.
Parat , on behalf of Norwegian Pilot Union announced stoppage of nearly all pilots in English with effect from 31 October. If the parties agree before that time , the company will be on strike .
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NAS company restructures
Looks like NAS are not paying too much attention to the pilot union and forging ahead with restructuring the company.
It would appear that there will be a Norwegian company established in Finland Spain and the UK. The pilot contractors are to be offered permanent employment starting with the Helsinki base in Spring 2014, although no news on the status of the cabin crew.
The core pilots will be employed by Norwegian Companies in their respective Scandinavian countries but will retain their current terms and conditions.
Much gnashing of teeth in Parat I imagine
It would appear that there will be a Norwegian company established in Finland Spain and the UK. The pilot contractors are to be offered permanent employment starting with the Helsinki base in Spring 2014, although no news on the status of the cabin crew.
The core pilots will be employed by Norwegian Companies in their respective Scandinavian countries but will retain their current terms and conditions.
Much gnashing of teeth in Parat I imagine
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I have several colleagues that have joined NAS as " contract pilots" based in Spain and UK, they are all Captains but were told that after 2 years as a " Contractor" they could apply, if positions were available as " core pilots" but only as FOs or remain as contract pilots retaining " seniority". Now, apparently the "block" on DEC after being a contractor is a rule made by the pilot union? if so this is not the level playing field they claim to want, or is this " rule" a Company management smoke screen to preserve Command positions for potential existing core pilot upgrades? By the way, they all pay taxes at their base thus are meeting the local employment regulations. Are the contract pilots actually represented by the Union or just benefiting from the agreements made by the union as this is easier for the management, in other words, would contract pilots also "strike" to support this cause, which on the face of it, may be not in their interests? If NAS want a united workforce they must offer the same T+Cs to all, the Union must support that. Is this new company structure really to " divide and conquer" or simply a commercial decision that is by default dividing the pilot loyalties and weakening the Union position? From what I am told the union does a proper job in improving and preserving working conditions, which is it's purpose, but is it also over protective of the Scandics?
The last thing NAS needs is a high profile blow to customer service levels, any answers to this?
The last thing NAS needs is a high profile blow to customer service levels, any answers to this?
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Avenger
I understand your point, but its a bit more complicated than that, yes "core" pilots have a better package than non core pilots, but generally is ring fenced to base within Denmark, Sweden and Norway, the big problem is the additional employment cost in the above block which the company must pay which is far higher than in Europe.
So in one sense its a win win, the "core" pilots get to keep their Hollywood contract ( need i might add to pay the Hollywood cost of living ) and contractors become permanent employee's in in country resource companies paying tax & NI in accordance with local regulations, thus avoiding the potential political fall out that seems likely from trying set up small groups of pilots in service companies.
The Devil will of course be in the detail
So in one sense its a win win, the "core" pilots get to keep their Hollywood contract ( need i might add to pay the Hollywood cost of living ) and contractors become permanent employee's in in country resource companies paying tax & NI in accordance with local regulations, thus avoiding the potential political fall out that seems likely from trying set up small groups of pilots in service companies.
The Devil will of course be in the detail
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How many NAS 737 pilota jumped over to the 787 operation as FOs? Were many taken?
Also, what's the status of the Virgin Atlantic training agreement on the 787? Are there VS pilots "instructing" on longhaul operations, etc? Has that collaboration started?
Also, what's the status of the Virgin Atlantic training agreement on the 787? Are there VS pilots "instructing" on longhaul operations, etc? Has that collaboration started?
Last edited by Iver; 18th Oct 2013 at 23:03.
