Easyjet to close Madrid
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ROBMEDIUM, Yuk, you just made me feel quite ill 
didn't realise the failed pilot was still employed & still unable to cure the chip on his shoulder against those still doing the job he can't.
Basic Service, very lucid & eloquent post about the country I still count as home. If you look at the massive amounts of money & destruction/delays/over-budget caused by the AVE (high speed train) to the centre of Girona , or the new Metro system in Malaga, you can see the absolutely blatant disregard for any common sense in public spending.
Oh, and there is also that lovely airport in Castellon , with it's lovely Bronze statue of the Top Mutt, shame no-one has ever operated a commercial flight there yet. . . . but, what the hell, imagine which percentage was "skimmed" off to enrich the accounts of some worthy politicians.
I heard just the other day that Norwegian are planning to bring forward their expansion, for Capts it seems 1000hr on the B737 with 500 Command is a must, but for FO's 500 on type ,"may" be replaced by "extensive experience on a similar type", maybe worth a go for those of you with good A319 hrs (if anyone under threat this Winter has actually managed to accumulate anything amouting to extensive experience.) & they have 100 A320NEOS on order if you really want to go back on the Bus later.
The only thing that works (most of the time) as intended in Spain , is the Sun.
Next big project is gas exploration just offshore from Malaga, it will be a miracle if they find anything worthwhile, and a miracle is what this country needs. . . .or perhaps a free Winter cruise to the Antartic on the new (Chinese
) Titanic 2 for their politicians . . . . . .now there's an idea 
Maybe they could persuade the King there are elephants to hunt up there, and send him along with them for good measure .
didn't realise the failed pilot was still employed & still unable to cure the chip on his shoulder against those still doing the job he can't.Basic Service, very lucid & eloquent post about the country I still count as home. If you look at the massive amounts of money & destruction/delays/over-budget caused by the AVE (high speed train) to the centre of Girona , or the new Metro system in Malaga, you can see the absolutely blatant disregard for any common sense in public spending.
Oh, and there is also that lovely airport in Castellon , with it's lovely Bronze statue of the Top Mutt, shame no-one has ever operated a commercial flight there yet. . . . but, what the hell, imagine which percentage was "skimmed" off to enrich the accounts of some worthy politicians.
I heard just the other day that Norwegian are planning to bring forward their expansion, for Capts it seems 1000hr on the B737 with 500 Command is a must, but for FO's 500 on type ,"may" be replaced by "extensive experience on a similar type", maybe worth a go for those of you with good A319 hrs (if anyone under threat this Winter has actually managed to accumulate anything amouting to extensive experience.) & they have 100 A320NEOS on order if you really want to go back on the Bus later.
The only thing that works (most of the time) as intended in Spain , is the Sun.
Next big project is gas exploration just offshore from Malaga, it will be a miracle if they find anything worthwhile, and a miracle is what this country needs. . . .or perhaps a free Winter cruise to the Antartic on the new (Chinese
) Titanic 2 for their politicians . . . . . .now there's an idea Maybe they could persuade the King there are elephants to hunt up there, and send him along with them for good measure .
Last edited by captplaystation; 23rd Jun 2012 at 14:01.
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ROBMEDIUM - something of an irrational rant and a bit short on facts for a first couple of posts. Still, always best to start as you mean to go on.
Basic Service - a very good and moving post. I believe our CEO has done her very best in very difficult circumstances. I truly hope we have a base back in Spain soon, but if we do the contracts will look very different indeed to what we had up until now. EasyJet have been snookered by a combination of insane airport management, market over-capacity, Spanish government bureaucracy and unsupportable labour costs. For us to return to Spanish basing, every one of those issues would have to be addressed. The bottom line is that, just like any of our own households, money-in has to exceed money-out over a period of time - that was clearly not the case here.
I am particularly moved by the plight of our Cabin Crew but know the pilots will have massive upheaval too. If a highly-profitable company like easyJet cannot make a Barajas base work, then I do not expect many other companies can. As others have said, the great consolation is the offering of other jobs to all pilots and cabin crew affected.
Basic Service - a very good and moving post. I believe our CEO has done her very best in very difficult circumstances. I truly hope we have a base back in Spain soon, but if we do the contracts will look very different indeed to what we had up until now. EasyJet have been snookered by a combination of insane airport management, market over-capacity, Spanish government bureaucracy and unsupportable labour costs. For us to return to Spanish basing, every one of those issues would have to be addressed. The bottom line is that, just like any of our own households, money-in has to exceed money-out over a period of time - that was clearly not the case here.
I am particularly moved by the plight of our Cabin Crew but know the pilots will have massive upheaval too. If a highly-profitable company like easyJet cannot make a Barajas base work, then I do not expect many other companies can. As others have said, the great consolation is the offering of other jobs to all pilots and cabin crew affected.
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Student 88 - where were you mid 2007..?
Were you spending months on end, out of base, doing the hard graft and helping set up the Madrid base which eventually turned into the cash-cow that it became for the expats. Everyone bar NONE, from all 19 bases back then that I flew with went there only for the extra leave, money and performance bonus that no other base received. Why fly 900 hours for £50k when you can fly 700 hours for 110 Euro..?
These same people will say good-bye and will return to the bases that they came from - REMEMBER, no pilot is losing their job over this closure. (Cabin Crew, please use the CC forum to discus.)
kick the tires - got the contract - 3 versions of it......but the best version was Captain GB's spreadsheet that made you fill in the blanks to see how much you made over a UK contract.
Were you spending months on end, out of base, doing the hard graft and helping set up the Madrid base which eventually turned into the cash-cow that it became for the expats. Everyone bar NONE, from all 19 bases back then that I flew with went there only for the extra leave, money and performance bonus that no other base received. Why fly 900 hours for £50k when you can fly 700 hours for 110 Euro..?
These same people will say good-bye and will return to the bases that they came from - REMEMBER, no pilot is losing their job over this closure. (Cabin Crew, please use the CC forum to discus.)
kick the tires - got the contract - 3 versions of it......but the best version was Captain GB's spreadsheet that made you fill in the blanks to see how much you made over a UK contract.
Last edited by Craggenmore; 24th Jun 2012 at 03:06.
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Alexander and Cptplay
Easy to jump to conclusions , faild pilot , sitting on the left so not so badly failed.
Irritated , yes I am seeing all those new guys getting into the hole they can not possibly get out of for the next x years.
My point was that the flexi will be bumped off as a result , courtesy of easy, it has happened as before it will happen again. Quite a nasty scheme IMHO.
Proposal of £25000 plus peanuts for new joiners ( although rejected)etc , quite loughable really.
Well it is a bit of a rant I admit.
What makes you so disgusted with my post.
Regards
Have been here before, didn't quite match your number of posts
Irritated , yes I am seeing all those new guys getting into the hole they can not possibly get out of for the next x years.
My point was that the flexi will be bumped off as a result , courtesy of easy, it has happened as before it will happen again. Quite a nasty scheme IMHO.
Proposal of £25000 plus peanuts for new joiners ( although rejected)etc , quite loughable really.
Well it is a bit of a rant I admit.
What makes you so disgusted with my post.
Regards
Have been here before, didn't quite match your number of posts
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That said, and controversially, the standard of ATC has improved immeasurably in the past six months.
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Svhar, MAD is not the real world buddy. It's a bad third world joke about complete incompetency!
Oh and I'm not British, and you are right that the taxi routes are simple. And you are right again that nothing has changed about that. It's just ATC that don't have a mental picture of their own airport/ airspace and are completely unable to provide a flow of traffic. In fact if they would just stop controlling all together, it would become safer, more efficient and easier.
Oh and Nightstop, I know about the 20 minute EAT rule. however the idiots in MAD think that is 20 minute holding and seem to think that being vectored all the way to Malaga and back does not constitute a delay in that respect.
And in low-vis it is just the biggest chaos you could ever imasending collegua was sent into a go-around at 6NM from the threshold because the previous has not yet reported clear of runway
to be subsequently vectored for another 15 minutes.
**** ATC down from the highest FL to the gate and vice versa!
I don't care they get paid a lot of money, I wish them all the best with it!
Oh and I'm not British, and you are right that the taxi routes are simple. And you are right again that nothing has changed about that. It's just ATC that don't have a mental picture of their own airport/ airspace and are completely unable to provide a flow of traffic. In fact if they would just stop controlling all together, it would become safer, more efficient and easier.
Oh and Nightstop, I know about the 20 minute EAT rule. however the idiots in MAD think that is 20 minute holding and seem to think that being vectored all the way to Malaga and back does not constitute a delay in that respect.
And in low-vis it is just the biggest chaos you could ever imasending collegua was sent into a go-around at 6NM from the threshold because the previous has not yet reported clear of runway
to be subsequently vectored for another 15 minutes.**** ATC down from the highest FL to the gate and vice versa!
I don't care they get paid a lot of money, I wish them all the best with it!
Last edited by 737Jock; 24th Jun 2012 at 10:09.
WB , not YOU Duh ! ! ! Guest
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If they leave Europe even better. It is a rubbish company together with Ryan. I think sometimes they compete each other to see who can be the best flying rubbish. No comment about the crew... Dogs are more intelligent.
Last edited by silvercare; 24th Jun 2012 at 10:02.
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I think sometimes they compete each other to see who can be the best flying rubbish. No comment about the crew... Dogs are more intelligent.
Last edited by CaptainProp; 24th Jun 2012 at 10:29.
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If they leave Europe even better. It is a rubbish company together with Ryan. I think sometimes they compete each other to see who can be the best flying rubbish. No comment about the crew... Dogs are more intelligent.
A deserving reply to your bullsh1t silvercare!
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An Italian pilot slagging off EZY and FR crews? Both sets of crews slogging out 4 sectors days to some very marginal places 365 days a year and mostly without incident. And you say dogs are more intelligent?
Silvercare you are dog. Makes my blood run cold to think you could be operating an aircraft after reading ****e like that.
Silvercare you are dog. Makes my blood run cold to think you could be operating an aircraft after reading ****e like that.
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Easyjet strategy to worsen conditions ?
Not claiming that I know much about the situation.
You close the base and then reopen it with cheaper conditions for pilots and other employees, saving a lot of money, then give yourself a nice fat bonus later. Nice way to get the pilots to accept a cheaper contract and collective agreement, to save the base.
What AENA is doing is unacceptable.
The increase in taxes shows AENA“s corrupt mismanagement ruining Spanish aviation.
A petition should be done as AENA“s management is pathetic and inept, they want to hurt airlines in Spain or is there a master plan at work here regarding Ryanair in Spain ?
You close the base and then reopen it with cheaper conditions for pilots and other employees, saving a lot of money, then give yourself a nice fat bonus later. Nice way to get the pilots to accept a cheaper contract and collective agreement, to save the base.
What AENA is doing is unacceptable.
The increase in taxes shows AENA“s corrupt mismanagement ruining Spanish aviation.
A petition should be done as AENA“s management is pathetic and inept, they want to hurt airlines in Spain or is there a master plan at work here regarding Ryanair in Spain ?
Last edited by Jimmy Hoffa Rocks; 29th Jun 2012 at 08:07.
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Robertodo1234 - So let's get this straight - the Madrid base was making money, labour costs, airport charges, Spanish taxation and over-capacity were not issues to our management, and they just decided to close down Madrid because they could. If you feel better for believing that then you go ahead.
Sadly, every single one of these were issues which, when taken together, have made the Madrid operation uneconomical. The capitalisation involved in running 8 shiny new aircraft plus engineering and operational support costs are enormous and the margins are wafer-thin. For some reason you have chosen to believe that out of all these factors, labour costs were irrelevant and have taken deep offense at such a suggestion. Clearly they were not the only factor, but they were an added and unsupportable part of the many problems. Undoubtedly, historical exchange rates were a significant factor in labour costs, but the result was still the same - eroded margins when there was no fat in the system to absorb the pressures. On one level, the economics are complex - on another level they are frighteningly simple. Money-in must exceed money-out - that was not happening and that is why we are where we are.
Sadly, every single one of these were issues which, when taken together, have made the Madrid operation uneconomical. The capitalisation involved in running 8 shiny new aircraft plus engineering and operational support costs are enormous and the margins are wafer-thin. For some reason you have chosen to believe that out of all these factors, labour costs were irrelevant and have taken deep offense at such a suggestion. Clearly they were not the only factor, but they were an added and unsupportable part of the many problems. Undoubtedly, historical exchange rates were a significant factor in labour costs, but the result was still the same - eroded margins when there was no fat in the system to absorb the pressures. On one level, the economics are complex - on another level they are frighteningly simple. Money-in must exceed money-out - that was not happening and that is why we are where we are.
ADM, having just had a long conversation with one of our colleagues in MAD I am truly shocked by what is happening in Spain and it is apparent (although not perhaps to Roberto1234) that the numbers just don't add up anymore.
As painful as it is for all involved, I can't help thinking that in a year or so's time they'll all be thankful they are no longer working there, great country though it is to visit - for now. God help them in 3 years' time, when property prices will have halved again.
As painful as it is for all involved, I can't help thinking that in a year or so's time they'll all be thankful they are no longer working there, great country though it is to visit - for now. God help them in 3 years' time, when property prices will have halved again.
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AdM, fact is that even on say 50% salaries they would still close the base!
IT'S THE ECONOMY STUPID!
Salaries are a drop In an ocean of inefficient airport operations, general laziness (yes, you heard that right!!!), ever increasing airport fees/fuel costs, terrible ATC.
You just can't get over your own trainers salary being lower under the current exchange rate. You would protect trainers as this is supposedly the great career path you see in easyJet and our future jobs. (where most people just want to call it a day as normal line captain)
Unfortunately easyJet earns over 50% of its revenue in euro, it is no longer a UK airline per se. And with that the bottle line of easyJet has improved cause those euro's became more valuable as the exchange rate provided more pounds for the euro.
IT'S THE ECONOMY STUPID!
Salaries are a drop In an ocean of inefficient airport operations, general laziness (yes, you heard that right!!!), ever increasing airport fees/fuel costs, terrible ATC.
You just can't get over your own trainers salary being lower under the current exchange rate. You would protect trainers as this is supposedly the great career path you see in easyJet and our future jobs. (where most people just want to call it a day as normal line captain)
Unfortunately easyJet earns over 50% of its revenue in euro, it is no longer a UK airline per se. And with that the bottle line of easyJet has improved cause those euro's became more valuable as the exchange rate provided more pounds for the euro.
Last edited by 737Jock; 30th Jun 2012 at 12:50.
