A320 or B747-400?
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A320 or B747-400?
Hello guys and girls
I was wondering if you would be offered job on either A320
or B747-4, what would you choose.
The big disadvantage is that you would have to pay for the TR. So my question is what would you choose?
I was wondering if you would be offered job on either A320
or B747-4, what would you choose. The big disadvantage is that you would have to pay for the TR. So my question is what would you choose?
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In short, if you haven't flown wide-body/heavy, & fancy a bit of Long Haul, 744.
If being awake at funny times of the day, unable to figure out what day it is, never mind what time of day it is, never mind which part of the world your hotel is located in, "doesn't "do it for you, Airbus family is a good guarantee of a future job opportunity. And, if you change your mind about the insomnia stuff later
, a 330 conversion is fairly short.
If being awake at funny times of the day, unable to figure out what day it is, never mind what time of day it is, never mind which part of the world your hotel is located in, "doesn't "do it for you, Airbus family is a good guarantee of a future job opportunity. And, if you change your mind about the insomnia stuff later
, a 330 conversion is fairly short.
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Do NOT pay for your own type rating ! That is for the company to do...IF it is a reputable company. People paying for type ratings is one of the issues that is ruining terms & conditions for you future pilots. 
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Scallywag, I agree with you. . . But ! depends what he is typed on /what other opportunities he has identified , or been offered.
If the answer is a big fat ZERO. . . . . .he can stay home & enjoy his principals, or take some action to (unwillingly) spend some cash. "Speculate to accumulate"
I am as opposed to P2F as the next guy, paying to line train in particular is just unbelievable, paying for a rating ? well, it sucks, but, if he doesn't someone else sure will, & meanwhile he sits home in Cindirellaesque fashion.
To the O.P. do what is best for you, & ignore the rest of us. . it is only an internet forum .
If the answer is a big fat ZERO. . . . . .he can stay home & enjoy his principals, or take some action to (unwillingly) spend some cash. "Speculate to accumulate"
I am as opposed to P2F as the next guy, paying to line train in particular is just unbelievable, paying for a rating ? well, it sucks, but, if he doesn't someone else sure will, & meanwhile he sits home in Cindirellaesque fashion.
To the O.P. do what is best for you, & ignore the rest of us. . it is only an internet forum .
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Airbus family is a good guarantee of a future job opportunity.
B744 is a beauty to fly. A320 are much more jobs to find...
I have flown >2000 hours on orange A319's but if I now had to go and look for a A320 family job again it would very difficult! Most airlines in Europe that fly A320's are either sh!t (Vueling-Click/Wizzair) or they are sh!t and will not hire people with experience, like sleazyJet. These companies only look for the green 200 hour TT type of pilots that they can scam for some kind of sh!tty "flexicrew" P4T deal.
Having experience on a A320 is actually a disadvantage!
Perhaps the only exceptions are some Middle Eastern carriers that fly the Airbus like EK, EY and QF, but my guess is that these carriers will also happily take you with 744 wide body experience and put you on the 777!
If it's a decent outfit and if you think you will like the long haul lifestyle, go for the 744 especially if the type rating is paid by the employer!
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Don Corleoni
I take it you are somewhere at the early stage of your carrier. One thing you should learn - never listen to dinosaurs. At the end of the day we all know what happen to dinosaurs. It is very comfortable to give advises like "never pay TR" when you are in upper half of seniority list with a legacy carrier however the real world is different. You can ignore it and endup doing nothing while there will be other takers anyway.
Particularly on the subject, all real 744 EU carriers are a sort of legacy i.e. you have little to no chance to become direct entry FO on 744. The rest are so shaky that it not worth to consider and actually if I remember right there are almost none anyway (Pullmantur / Corsair / who else?). If you have a 744 job offer you are looking at being expat for a foreseeable future and 744 as a type is fading down. Also a large part of 744 ops are hard to get with JAR FCL license (US/Japan/Russia). And last time I've seen, any 744 vacancies are attracting lots of type experienced people, i.e. with little hours you will be pretty much at the bottom.
With 320 you have a much better chance to secure a job at home or next to your home without any validations, there are literally thousands of 320s in operation, 320neo is sounds to be just a minor differences training and there is a quick and open door to 330/350 in the future. True many 320s operators are very shaky as well however we still talking about a dozen(s) who hiring at any time and you can opt for sandpit at some stage to enter legacy world (and by the way there are NONE 744 in that area except Saudi).
Sure there is much more to see when flying 744, however be careful - sometimes Lagos, Port Harkout and Jeddah are not that attractive as spending your weekend with family.
This is probably my longest post in a years but once I've seen this I can't just stand of some earlier replies to your post.
I take it you are somewhere at the early stage of your carrier. One thing you should learn - never listen to dinosaurs. At the end of the day we all know what happen to dinosaurs. It is very comfortable to give advises like "never pay TR" when you are in upper half of seniority list with a legacy carrier however the real world is different. You can ignore it and endup doing nothing while there will be other takers anyway.
Particularly on the subject, all real 744 EU carriers are a sort of legacy i.e. you have little to no chance to become direct entry FO on 744. The rest are so shaky that it not worth to consider and actually if I remember right there are almost none anyway (Pullmantur / Corsair / who else?). If you have a 744 job offer you are looking at being expat for a foreseeable future and 744 as a type is fading down. Also a large part of 744 ops are hard to get with JAR FCL license (US/Japan/Russia). And last time I've seen, any 744 vacancies are attracting lots of type experienced people, i.e. with little hours you will be pretty much at the bottom.
With 320 you have a much better chance to secure a job at home or next to your home without any validations, there are literally thousands of 320s in operation, 320neo is sounds to be just a minor differences training and there is a quick and open door to 330/350 in the future. True many 320s operators are very shaky as well however we still talking about a dozen(s) who hiring at any time and you can opt for sandpit at some stage to enter legacy world (and by the way there are NONE 744 in that area except Saudi).
Sure there is much more to see when flying 744, however be careful - sometimes Lagos, Port Harkout and Jeddah are not that attractive as spending your weekend with family.
This is probably my longest post in a years but once I've seen this I can't just stand of some earlier replies to your post.
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Hi Don....you haven't let us know what sort of experience you have..either jet or total flying hours. If you are contemplating paying for a rating yourself, then I really wouldn't advise the 744...a 744 type rating with no jet hours let alone total hours is about as much use as a chocolate teapot....no-one the world over will hire on the 744 as an FO without over 1000 hours medium jet (or military ) I wouldn't have thought.
With he 320 however in times of plenty, the story is totally different...it is after all the sort of aeroplane that larger carriers will put their sponsored cadets on straight after CPL issue, so even with no hours and a freshly issued licence, with a 320 rating you are definitely employable
With he 320 however in times of plenty, the story is totally different...it is after all the sort of aeroplane that larger carriers will put their sponsored cadets on straight after CPL issue, so even with no hours and a freshly issued licence, with a 320 rating you are definitely employable
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320!!! No questions asked, keep the ego thinggy for later
"Sellect" sums it up perfectly:
Dont go after type go after working conditions & terms
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As stated before: go for T&C and not for type and DO NOT PAY for TR. Please, do a favor to yourself and to our profession and do not contribute to this pay to fly nonsense.
CIAO!
CIAO!
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Please, do a favor to yourself and to our profession and do not contribute to this pay to fly nonsense.
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Speculate and the airline accumulates!
"With he 320 however in times of plenty, the story is totally different...it is after all the sort of aeroplane that larger carriers will put their sponsored cadets on straight after CPL issue, so even with no hours and a freshly issued licence, with a 320 rating you are definitely employable"
Sadly this is only half true - they will put low houred cadets (approved from Integrated/MPL school) or they take P2F for 100h or so through another scheme but they do not employ these guys after that time.
I know of 5 A320 pilots with time from 1h (base training) to 500h on type. One SSTR alone, One P2F, and one is an approved cadet who was told goodbye after Line Check - all are without a jet job.
Sadly this is only half true - they will put low houred cadets (approved from Integrated/MPL school) or they take P2F for 100h or so through another scheme but they do not employ these guys after that time.
I know of 5 A320 pilots with time from 1h (base training) to 500h on type. One SSTR alone, One P2F, and one is an approved cadet who was told goodbye after Line Check - all are without a jet job.
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A320 or B744
It depends on whether you want long haul flights to far away places, or short haul regional flights to not so far away places. It depends on whether you want to fly for 12 hours or fly for 6 hours. It depends on which aircraft you like and love and want to get to grips with.
You`ve got your freedom, so make your choice - the wonga will work out about the same in the long run - and yes as Skallywag said - any airline worth its salt will do your type training for you, having said that, perhaps having a type rating already MAY give you an advantage when applying for a position which asks for type rated pilots on a specific type.
You may find it prudent to choose one type say Airbus A320 for example and then upgrade as you go along in your career, or, start on the 73 and work your way up to the 74 via the 75 and 76 - sort of keep it in the family.
You`ve got your freedom, so make your choice - the wonga will work out about the same in the long run - and yes as Skallywag said - any airline worth its salt will do your type training for you, having said that, perhaps having a type rating already MAY give you an advantage when applying for a position which asks for type rated pilots on a specific type.
You may find it prudent to choose one type say Airbus A320 for example and then upgrade as you go along in your career, or, start on the 73 and work your way up to the 74 via the 75 and 76 - sort of keep it in the family.
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If I may just interject for a moment.
Mr. Corleone did not say "I have been offered a job on either A320 or B747-4", he said "If you would be offered".
So, Ms. Power, with respect, he is not asking "whether to go for the A320 or 747 rating based upon a job offer.", but rather which job offer you would find more enticing.
Those of you who are going on about Pay-to-Train and Pay-to-Fly are missing the point. We could be seeing an attempt at the logical extension of these practices: someone forming a company whose business model consists in Pay-to-Train revenue.
Cargo/Charter startup, hire 50 pilots, require them to "self-sponsor", for say $20k/pop, take half of that in kickbacks. When it's time to start flying, cite the "soft market" as causing problems when the leasing, and terminate the lot of them right there. Heck, you could even make a "good faith" trip to the bank or two.
A $500k payout isn't bad for a few months' work.
Forgive me if my numbers are off.
So, which would you prefer, B747-4 or A320?
Mr. Corleone did not say "I have been offered a job on either A320 or B747-4", he said "If you would be offered".
So, Ms. Power, with respect, he is not asking "whether to go for the A320 or 747 rating based upon a job offer.", but rather which job offer you would find more enticing.
Those of you who are going on about Pay-to-Train and Pay-to-Fly are missing the point. We could be seeing an attempt at the logical extension of these practices: someone forming a company whose business model consists in Pay-to-Train revenue.
Cargo/Charter startup, hire 50 pilots, require them to "self-sponsor", for say $20k/pop, take half of that in kickbacks. When it's time to start flying, cite the "soft market" as causing problems when the leasing, and terminate the lot of them right there. Heck, you could even make a "good faith" trip to the bank or two.
A $500k payout isn't bad for a few months' work.
Forgive me if my numbers are off.
So, which would you prefer, B747-4 or A320?