British Airways DEP Selection - THE lowdown Part 2
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It's a whole months work. The scheduling department publish all the different work patterns for the month roughly 6 weeks before and you bid for the ones that you like the look of/ think you can get depending on your seniority . All bids are processed in seniority order and after a second stage of bidding to make your line up to the required hours (called cap) for the month (defined by the company depending work available and pilots available) you have your roster. And not a stupid question . I had no idea what It was before I joined either !
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Apologies if this doesn't quite fit into the DEP discussion, but is there any word on the vine (from those in the know), with respect to whether the FPP is likely to run again this year?
Realise with all the external factors BMI, economy etc. it may be difficult to say.
Rgds
Realise with all the external factors BMI, economy etc. it may be difficult to say.
Rgds
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- DEP recruitment suspended from the end of March;
- Existing DEP hold pool tenure extended from 12 to 18 months;
- Discussion from BA Company Council of potential bmi mainline job loses post merger - if it gets approved on Friday;
- economic stagnation, APD taxation increase, oil price hike and turbulence in the Middle East.
Make your own assumptions, but my guess is no.
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Its all going through!?
(Reuters) - British Airways owner IAG is set to be given the go-ahead by the EU to buy German group Lufthansa's British airline bmi after offering to give up additional airport slots, a person familiar with the matter said on Thursday.
IAG (ICAG.L) has reached a deal worth 172.5 million pounds to buy its smaller rival and had initially proposed to relinquish 10 slots. It increased the number to 14 slots after rivals complained the concessions were not sufficient. It was not clear at which airports the 14 slots are located.
Antoine Colombani, a spokesman for the competition unit at the European Commission, declined to comment on the case. IAG and Lufthansa also declined to comment.
The European Union executive was due to decide by Friday whether to give the deal regulatory clearance.
IAG trumped rival bidder Virgin late last year in the race to acquire loss-making bmi, which has coveted slots at London's Heathrow airport, Europe's busiest.
IAG currently has a 43.1 percent share of the take-off and landing slots at Heathrow. Together, IAG and bmi have a combined share of 53 percent of the airport's slots.
Virgin has again urged EU regulators to block the deal, saying it would leave competition in British aviation distorted.
"BA's proposed competition remedies to get this purchase cleared are woefully inadequate and will ensure that BA continues to control all of the key domestic and some international routes," Virgin founder Richard Branson wrote in a letter to the EU's commissioner of competition, Joaquin Almunia.
"I am really battling to understand why the commission seems to be bending over backwards to clear this deal at phase one rather than submitting it to the proper scrutiny intended in phase two of the clearance process."
Branson added that Virgin was prepared to re-open discussions with Lufthansa if the deal was not cleared.
IAG's next deal may be made further afield after it said on Thursday it was looking at investing in Japan Airlines' JAL.L planned initial public offering later this year.
IAG shares in London were flat at 178.2 pence, while Lufthansa shares in Frankfurt were 1.3 percent down at 10.46 euros.
I wonder if this is good news??? Any thoughts?
IAG (ICAG.L) has reached a deal worth 172.5 million pounds to buy its smaller rival and had initially proposed to relinquish 10 slots. It increased the number to 14 slots after rivals complained the concessions were not sufficient. It was not clear at which airports the 14 slots are located.
Antoine Colombani, a spokesman for the competition unit at the European Commission, declined to comment on the case. IAG and Lufthansa also declined to comment.
The European Union executive was due to decide by Friday whether to give the deal regulatory clearance.
IAG trumped rival bidder Virgin late last year in the race to acquire loss-making bmi, which has coveted slots at London's Heathrow airport, Europe's busiest.
IAG currently has a 43.1 percent share of the take-off and landing slots at Heathrow. Together, IAG and bmi have a combined share of 53 percent of the airport's slots.
Virgin has again urged EU regulators to block the deal, saying it would leave competition in British aviation distorted.
"BA's proposed competition remedies to get this purchase cleared are woefully inadequate and will ensure that BA continues to control all of the key domestic and some international routes," Virgin founder Richard Branson wrote in a letter to the EU's commissioner of competition, Joaquin Almunia.
"I am really battling to understand why the commission seems to be bending over backwards to clear this deal at phase one rather than submitting it to the proper scrutiny intended in phase two of the clearance process."
Branson added that Virgin was prepared to re-open discussions with Lufthansa if the deal was not cleared.
IAG's next deal may be made further afield after it said on Thursday it was looking at investing in Japan Airlines' JAL.L planned initial public offering later this year.
IAG shares in London were flat at 178.2 pence, while Lufthansa shares in Frankfurt were 1.3 percent down at 10.46 euros.
I wonder if this is good news??? Any thoughts?
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787 A380 delivery
guys bit of tangent,
But does anybody know when BA are expecting there first 787 and A380 aircraft to be delivered- on the internet there are various dates but doesn't seem accurate- was wondering if anyone could help me out(for a university presentation)
thanks in advance
regards
But does anybody know when BA are expecting there first 787 and A380 aircraft to be delivered- on the internet there are various dates but doesn't seem accurate- was wondering if anyone could help me out(for a university presentation)
thanks in advance
regards
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From IAG:
REGULATORY APPROVAL FOR BMI DEAL
The European Commission (EC) has today given regulatory approval for International Airlines Group's purchase of bmi from Lufthansa.
Some technical conditions need to be finalised before completion, which is anticipated to take place around April 20, 2012. Following completion, it is intended that bmi mainline will be integrated into British Airways during the coming months.
IAG has offered the following commitments to the EC as part of the regulatory process:
· Seven daily slot pairs to be used between Heathrow and either Edinburgh and/or Aberdeen.
· Five daily slot pairs to be used between Heathrow and the following destinations - Nice, Cairo, Riyadh, Moscow, Edinburgh and/or Aberdeen.
· Two Heathrow daily slot pairs will be leased to Transaero for use on flights to Moscow.
· Other airlines can apply for seats on the integrated BA/bmi short and midhaul network for their transfer passengers, on normal commercial terms.
IAG chief executive Willie Walsh said: "We're delighted the EC has given competition approval for our acquisition of bmi. Their decision follows a thorough review during which the views of key stakeholders have been taken into account.
"This is great news for Britain. Over time we will launch new longhaul routes to key trading nations that are currently not served from Heathrow while supporting our shorthaul network. This is good for UK business and UK consumers. We have already announced that British Airways will re-start flights from Belfast to Heathrow, maintaining important economic links.
"Expanding our longhaul network also helps Heathrow grow as an international hub airport despite its infrastructure constraints.
"This deal will maintain high quality jobs at bmi and create similar jobs when we expand. More British jobs will be saved than if bmi had closed. British Airways will consult with bmi staff and their unions as soon as possible.
"We plan to operate bmi's summer schedule and will update their customers once the transaction has been completed".
The acquisition cost of bmi is unchanged at £172.5m in cash, on a debt-free, cash-free basis, but is subject to significant price reductions if Lufthansa does not opt to sell bmi baby.
IAG's Heathrow slot portfolio, excluding the commitments made to the EC, will increase by at least an average of 42 daily slot pairs. The transaction is still expected to be earnings accretive by 2014 at the latest. The commitments do not affect IAG's plans to increase its 2015 operating profit target of €1.5 billion by €100 million and its target of delivering a 12 per cent return on capital employed. IAG estimates that restructuring costs related to the integration of bmi will be around £100 million spread over three years with the majority in year one.
REGULATORY APPROVAL FOR BMI DEAL
The European Commission (EC) has today given regulatory approval for International Airlines Group's purchase of bmi from Lufthansa.
Some technical conditions need to be finalised before completion, which is anticipated to take place around April 20, 2012. Following completion, it is intended that bmi mainline will be integrated into British Airways during the coming months.
IAG has offered the following commitments to the EC as part of the regulatory process:
· Seven daily slot pairs to be used between Heathrow and either Edinburgh and/or Aberdeen.
· Five daily slot pairs to be used between Heathrow and the following destinations - Nice, Cairo, Riyadh, Moscow, Edinburgh and/or Aberdeen.
· Two Heathrow daily slot pairs will be leased to Transaero for use on flights to Moscow.
· Other airlines can apply for seats on the integrated BA/bmi short and midhaul network for their transfer passengers, on normal commercial terms.
IAG chief executive Willie Walsh said: "We're delighted the EC has given competition approval for our acquisition of bmi. Their decision follows a thorough review during which the views of key stakeholders have been taken into account.
"This is great news for Britain. Over time we will launch new longhaul routes to key trading nations that are currently not served from Heathrow while supporting our shorthaul network. This is good for UK business and UK consumers. We have already announced that British Airways will re-start flights from Belfast to Heathrow, maintaining important economic links.
"Expanding our longhaul network also helps Heathrow grow as an international hub airport despite its infrastructure constraints.
"This deal will maintain high quality jobs at bmi and create similar jobs when we expand. More British jobs will be saved than if bmi had closed. British Airways will consult with bmi staff and their unions as soon as possible.
"We plan to operate bmi's summer schedule and will update their customers once the transaction has been completed".
The acquisition cost of bmi is unchanged at £172.5m in cash, on a debt-free, cash-free basis, but is subject to significant price reductions if Lufthansa does not opt to sell bmi baby.
IAG's Heathrow slot portfolio, excluding the commitments made to the EC, will increase by at least an average of 42 daily slot pairs. The transaction is still expected to be earnings accretive by 2014 at the latest. The commitments do not affect IAG's plans to increase its 2015 operating profit target of €1.5 billion by €100 million and its target of delivering a 12 per cent return on capital employed. IAG estimates that restructuring costs related to the integration of bmi will be around £100 million spread over three years with the majority in year one.
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@ LHRbound
no offense - but this is not directly relevant to DEP selection - besides wild speculation what it could mean for DEP. (i know previous contributions were not spot on either but with these news, this will start all over again).
Please start a new thread if you want to dicuss the BMI acquisition.
/edit: i do think it is interesting but it will bloat this thread, making it impossible to later go through and pick out actually relevant points with regards to DEP selection.
no offense - but this is not directly relevant to DEP selection - besides wild speculation what it could mean for DEP. (i know previous contributions were not spot on either but with these news, this will start all over again).
Please start a new thread if you want to dicuss the BMI acquisition.
/edit: i do think it is interesting but it will bloat this thread, making it impossible to later go through and pick out actually relevant points with regards to DEP selection.
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No you are right let's keep it to the 'give us an example of a time where you built a school for a load of third worlders questions' and the 'hi mate I was on the 14th of whatever selection and I didn't get in but I'm really pleased for you that you did because BA selectors might be here on pprune and be able to decipher my 'name' ' comments because they are really useful.
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Another, IAG's approval to acquire bmi is directly relevant to DEP selection. In order to give a slightly less cynical reaction than the one supplied by BlackandBrown, the reason for its relevance is that existing hold pool members or those applicants awaiting to attend their Day 2 assessments are now staring into an abyss of uncertainty.
IAG have had to agree to surrender 14 slot pairs once belonging to bmi in order to secure the EU's approval of the deal. If you are interested in what this potentially means, direct your eyes to another thread running alongside this one in the T&E section - "Virgin and Balpa - bmi next?" From reading this thread you will probably note that there is some reasonably convincing arguements relating to a letter published by the BA Company Council on the BALPA forum. This letter I believe suggested that if any requirement was made for IAG to surrender slots aquired through the bmi merger then the potential for flight crew job loses at bmi was not to be underestimated.
I'm not sure where you sit in the BA DEP process at the present time, Another? However if you are one of the guys keeping his fingers crossed that BA DEP recruitment will reopen in the not so distant future then I might take a rain check. If you are unaware, not so long ago, the existing and limited number remaining in the pool had their tenures extended to a maximum of 18 months and any future recruitment was suspended from the end of this month. I apologise if you are already aware of this and if this has affected you directly then I feel your pain. However you cannot suggest that today's decision by the regulator has no bearing on DEP recruitment at BA. It may even possibly do so for a lengthy period of time.
IAG have had to agree to surrender 14 slot pairs once belonging to bmi in order to secure the EU's approval of the deal. If you are interested in what this potentially means, direct your eyes to another thread running alongside this one in the T&E section - "Virgin and Balpa - bmi next?" From reading this thread you will probably note that there is some reasonably convincing arguements relating to a letter published by the BA Company Council on the BALPA forum. This letter I believe suggested that if any requirement was made for IAG to surrender slots aquired through the bmi merger then the potential for flight crew job loses at bmi was not to be underestimated.
I'm not sure where you sit in the BA DEP process at the present time, Another? However if you are one of the guys keeping his fingers crossed that BA DEP recruitment will reopen in the not so distant future then I might take a rain check. If you are unaware, not so long ago, the existing and limited number remaining in the pool had their tenures extended to a maximum of 18 months and any future recruitment was suspended from the end of this month. I apologise if you are already aware of this and if this has affected you directly then I feel your pain. However you cannot suggest that today's decision by the regulator has no bearing on DEP recruitment at BA. It may even possibly do so for a lengthy period of time.
Last edited by Callsign Kilo; 30th Mar 2012 at 19:18.
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dear BlackandBrown, and Callsign Kilo,
i am happy to start posting the daily oil price.
based on it going up or going down, we can speculate how many people BA will hire next year ;-)
fair enough - more "tell me about a time" is not useful
i do care about news from people within the pool getting classes, or emails going out to those in the application process.
and yes, the bmi approval has some kind of implication. lets see if we are any smarter regarding the DEP process and actual chances 10 posts further down the line :-)
on the other hand, as no news are to be expected any time soon about DEP, may as well keep going for now instead of letting the thread get pulled into the dead corners of pprune...
i am happy to start posting the daily oil price.
based on it going up or going down, we can speculate how many people BA will hire next year ;-)
fair enough - more "tell me about a time" is not useful
i do care about news from people within the pool getting classes, or emails going out to those in the application process.
and yes, the bmi approval has some kind of implication. lets see if we are any smarter regarding the DEP process and actual chances 10 posts further down the line :-)
on the other hand, as no news are to be expected any time soon about DEP, may as well keep going for now instead of letting the thread get pulled into the dead corners of pprune...
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See also BALPA Statement especially:
In summary, the bmi acquisition may include the other 2 bmi elements, including their employees - which include 290 pilots.
Depending on how BALPA succeed in their aims, one could find some (all?) of these 290 pilots retained in IAG/BA, or fast-tracked into the entry process etc.
No idea of the direct implications for the DEP process, but I hardly think it would improve the chances of it re-opening
‘BA’s parent company IAG has so far made it clear that they only intend to run the bmi Mainline operation and that although they must take over the bmi Baby and bmi Regional businesses as part of the transaction, these businesses do not figure in their plans. BALPA will be looking to protect those jobs whether in IAG or with any other potential buyer.
Depending on how BALPA succeed in their aims, one could find some (all?) of these 290 pilots retained in IAG/BA, or fast-tracked into the entry process etc.
No idea of the direct implications for the DEP process, but I hardly think it would improve the chances of it re-opening
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As an interested outsider, I cannot help noticing that recent posts seem to be ignoring the stated intention of BA to use their newly-acquired slots for long-haul services rather than short-haul.
Rather than requiring one two-person crew per day for a short-haul slot pair, the head count is likely to go up two three-person crews, with probably at least one more crew night stopping somewhere interesting like Seoul or Rangoon. So the numbers going through the DEP process may even increase substantially as a result of the merger.
Rather than requiring one two-person crew per day for a short-haul slot pair, the head count is likely to go up two three-person crews, with probably at least one more crew night stopping somewhere interesting like Seoul or Rangoon. So the numbers going through the DEP process may even increase substantially as a result of the merger.
Last edited by Dairyground; 31st Mar 2012 at 00:44. Reason: Correction of typo in the original
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Trouble is to make use of the new long haul slots will require the use of new long haul aircraft. So yes the headcount will eventually go up but it's going to be 3-4 years before the hulls are in place creating a medium term pilot surplus.
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DEP guys or anyone in the holdpool, be patient. The training department is maxed on bmi crew (very welcome crew) joining us from May onwards. Once bmi guys (I'm ex bmi) are SOP integrated to discuss Threats and Big Picture during their briefs are integrated, then hold pool recruitment will resume and therefore assessment. Best wishes to everyone joining.
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bmi baby and regional pilots being integrated is never going to happen. Sorry.
Also CR is very unlikely, I'm sure 3800 pilots can absorb a surplus easily with voluntary measures, esp with a lot of over 55s and 60s in both airlines.
The only downside for DEPs waiting is that you've just lost 300 seniority places overnight. The good news is these extra slot pairs means you actually haven't lost anything as the airline is expanding, and as someone said in the long term there will be even more expansion as these slots are converted to LH.
Also CR is very unlikely, I'm sure 3800 pilots can absorb a surplus easily with voluntary measures, esp with a lot of over 55s and 60s in both airlines.
The only downside for DEPs waiting is that you've just lost 300 seniority places overnight. The good news is these extra slot pairs means you actually haven't lost anything as the airline is expanding, and as someone said in the long term there will be even more expansion as these slots are converted to LH.
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Cityflyer, as somebody in BA what is your estimate for the duration of the recruitment freeze? I know there are quite a few anxious people reading this thread, some having been placed in the hold pool and the likes of me, waiting for the sim.
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I think some people should bear that in mind when they post on here, as some tone suggests personalities that don't fit into those categories.
Keep calm and carry on and all that. Worse things happen at sea!