Let's make our Profession prestigious again
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Let's make our Profession prestigious again
In order to save our profession, I suggest that we start with increasing the difficulty of the ATPL schooling. First thing to do is the elimination of the Question Bank. Any fool can nowadays learn the answers by heart and get a licence. Increase the difficulty level of several subjects, eg. Principles of flight, Performance, Meteorology and Aircraft General Knowledge. Put an Aerobatics course back in the flight-syllabus.
We also need to start to better assess potential ATPL students on their coordination, mathematics, physics etc. Just as happened 15 years ago.
The profession of an Airline pilot has always been seen as highly skilled and was regarded as prestigeous. over the last few years we have let this devellop into being glorified bus drivers. I say NO MORE.
In Spain, pilots with 1500h (unfrozen ATPL) are considered Engineers with a University Degree. This is our aim.
We also need to start to better assess potential ATPL students on their coordination, mathematics, physics etc. Just as happened 15 years ago.
The profession of an Airline pilot has always been seen as highly skilled and was regarded as prestigeous. over the last few years we have let this devellop into being glorified bus drivers. I say NO MORE.
In Spain, pilots with 1500h (unfrozen ATPL) are considered Engineers with a University Degree. This is our aim.
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It's the free market, muchacho.
Make it a well paid profession again and you'll get good talent again.
My father made $400,000 a year (in today's dollars) to fly 747's. He had classmates with PhD's and JD's, and former astronauts.
Now , paywise, this job is one step above Walmart manager. With worse hours....
Make it a well paid profession again and you'll get good talent again.
My father made $400,000 a year (in today's dollars) to fly 747's. He had classmates with PhD's and JD's, and former astronauts.
Now , paywise, this job is one step above Walmart manager. With worse hours....
!
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The way management see it is that pilots DONT fly the aircraft no more just monitor it, so why should they get paid $400,000 a year to "fly" it if a monkey can do it.
I think with technology getting better the skill of flying is dying out slowly,
the idea of an aerobatics course in the syllabus is a good idea and increases safety with unusaul attitude awareness.
When I was obtaining my ATPL my ground instructor was in a meeting with the CAA about the use of question banks. The question banks are not official there just questions people remember and they talk about it in the class room and some one has decided to make money out of it, so you cant stop it in a way, but instead have 10 different versions of the same question so people cant jsut remember A,B or C
I think with technology getting better the skill of flying is dying out slowly,
the idea of an aerobatics course in the syllabus is a good idea and increases safety with unusaul attitude awareness.
When I was obtaining my ATPL my ground instructor was in a meeting with the CAA about the use of question banks. The question banks are not official there just questions people remember and they talk about it in the class room and some one has decided to make money out of it, so you cant stop it in a way, but instead have 10 different versions of the same question so people cant jsut remember A,B or C
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Well written. Im also captain for some years and never experienced RTO or OEI. But I know some problems which happened. It doesnt matter if someone is engineeur or something else. It is in man, what to do. You have to decide. No tests will prepare for that. I think that all pilots are captains or copilots. There can be only one thing that select this two categories: you have judgement or not.
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Sorry, there is no "again". It has left the station. It is leaving every day as gray haired Captains get the Hose. It isn't the Industry, in case you haven't looked, it is the way we live, and the culture we tolerate. As we look to others to serve us, to make us wealthy, scold us, and pamper us, our decay as a living society marches on. Looking to an answers booklet explains without explaining. We, as a people, get what we want, as a group, and when the group loses its anchorage, we may as well sit and watch.
It is an inside job, asking for stricter rules after we allow a "C" grade to pass for an "A" is only demanding a continuation of average.
We must demand more of ourselves and our children from within, not look to others to design our journey. The left seat for me was an accomplishment in my top two or three. Mine.The "Group" feeds the hungry, it mustn't live our lives.
Prestige is a Lie. Look around at all the idiot "famous". That is notoriety, not prestige. One cannot fit a team into the left seat.
It is an inside job, asking for stricter rules after we allow a "C" grade to pass for an "A" is only demanding a continuation of average.
We must demand more of ourselves and our children from within, not look to others to design our journey. The left seat for me was an accomplishment in my top two or three. Mine.The "Group" feeds the hungry, it mustn't live our lives.
Prestige is a Lie. Look around at all the idiot "famous". That is notoriety, not prestige. One cannot fit a team into the left seat.
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????!!!
What difference would it make if I could explain the Einsteins theory of relativity and all the knowledge that is below of it or at Wikipedia in full? I have been flying for 29 years already and I have never had to divert or perform a RTO just because I don't know math and so many other things. Don't pretend we are Gods like people used to believe we were. Get a license and then become a real pilot. Study your stuff, be disciplined, work hard , be smart, etc. I know many doctors that "study a lot" to get where they are. However, medical staff and institutions kill more people than a lousy ATPL holder. It is not what you know but how you use your knowledge.
The next text will help to explain my point. Im not a smart guy and with any degree under my belt
WHAT MAKES A PILOT "STREET SMART"
ABOUT FLYING ?
Original idea from United Airlines (Safetyliner)
What makes a pilot "street smart" about flying? By "street smart" we mean:
awareness of the essential aspects of flying; ability to know where and when to find
critical information; ability to detect and compensate for the mistakes of others;
ability to avoid the subtle traps and pitfalls found in the flying environment; and ability to
complete a 30-year career without any accidents or serious incidents. Thousands of
pilots do this each year - complete a very successful 30-year career without a single
incident or accident. Is this just luck, or are there specific identifiable reasons for these
superb records?
To find the answer to this question, Safetyliner conducted some years ago a telephone survey with selected pilots in the industry. Each pilot had at least 25 years of
experience. Our group included pilots from six countries and from airframe manufacturers, NASA test pilots, military pilots, UAL line pilots, Chief Pilots, Fleet Captains and instructors. In each case they posed the following
questions, and then let the interviewee respond as he or she saw fit.
1) What, in your opinion, makes a pilot "street smart" about flying?
2) To what do you attribute the fact that you have never had an accident?
3) Will you share with Safetyliner's readers your thoughts, techniques or strategies which
have helped you achieve this excellent safety record?
4) Are there any systems or factors which you consider more important than others?
5) Do you consciously monitor any particular areas to increase your awareness of critical
safety items?
6) If you were to advise a new, minimal experience Captain about how to avoid the pitfalls
of flying, what would you tell him or her? Safetyliner was surprised that the answers covered a very wide spectrum of topics; therefore, they grouped the responses into three categories :
· Attitude or Mind Set - a predisposition to do things in a certain way.
· Teamwork, Crew Coordination, and Crew Interaction.
· Awareness - individual techniques and strategies, specific items to monitor.
The responses are not ranked or put into any particular order and are presented as close to the original comment as possible. Many of the responses were very similar, in which case Safetyliner selected the most comprehensive comment.
ATTITUDE - MIND SET
• There's almost nothing that needs to be done in a hurry in an aircraft.
• Plan ahead for normal events and be prepared for unexpected contingencies.
• Pay attention to your sixth sense. If something feels wrong, it probably is.
• Develop an assertive attitude and openly communicate concerns to other crewmembers.
• Keep your options open -never become committed to a single course of action with a high degree of risk.
• The way to be safe is never to be comfortable.
• If you are getting rushed or overloaded, slow down even if it means delaying pushback, delaying takeoff or even holding.
• Flying must be the focus of your interest; you must want to do a good job. Stick to Standard Operating Procedures unless they are obviously inadequate.
• Return to basics if you become confused.
• Maintain a healthy level of suspicion.
• Even though pilots sometimes like to give the opposite impression, a true professional is
responsible, diligent and studious.
• Eliminate distractions and maintain an alert, vigilant mental state.
• Avoid complacency; the minute you think something won't hurt you - it will!
• Never go on a flight with a head full of problems; leave them on the ground or stay on the ground yourself.
• Be especially vigilant when everything is going well. For example, the difficult approaches like CRW, SAN, MDW, HKG, or poor students (if you instruct) won't hurt you since you are already alert and aware of the risk. You must resist the tendency to become complacent when everything looks normal.
• Be open minded to constructive criticism.
• Always fly in the same standard way regardless of whether it is a normal line flight, an enroute check, or a proficiency check.
• The common thread among all survivors is common sense.
• The things that get pilots in trouble are incorrect premises and fixation.
• Don't become complacent; sit on the edge of your seat; never take anything for granted; never become relaxed; question everything; stay alert.
• Never assume anything, but verify and cross-check all critical information.
• A pilot must be able to adapt; no two situations are the same.
TEAMWORK - CREW COORDINATION - CREW INTERACTION
• Share information with your crew. To the extent that you share information with them, they will share information with you and tell you if you have made a mistake.
• Don't try to do everything yourself.
• Use SOP's so everyone knows what to expect.
• Surprises are nice on birthdays and Christmas, but have no place in aviation. Let everyone know what you are thinking, planning, and doing.
• Always question; don't assume.
• The first thing the Captain should do is to mold the crew into a team.
• Briefings are very important; talk through what you are going to do; everyone should participate.
• Use your crew; frequently I have found another crewmember has just the information I need.
• Evaluate the people you fly with -to understand and compensate for their strengths and
weaknesses.
• Maintain redundancy in the cockpit. The pilot not flying must cross-check the actions of the pilot flying and bring discrepancies to his attention.
• Communication among the crew, and especially with ATC, is critical in today's saturated ATC system.
AWARENESS - TECHNIQUES - STRATEGIES
• It is important to have mentally prepared strategies to deal with critical operational situations. For example, if you lost an engine in a B-767 at 30 degrees West, where would you go? What if you were in a B-747?
• Flying safely is effectively managing change. The items which I monitor vary with whatever is changing. For example, before beginning to taxi, I think about the risks and problems associated with taxiing. Items like - receipt and dispatch procedures, maximum breakaway thrust, taxi route, wingtip clearances, avoiding runway incursions, etc. Before takeoff, I review the performancedata, RTO procedures, engine-out procedures, the departure route and terrain proximity. Any time something changes - and it can be a small item like a 4,000 ft altitude change or cross-feeding fuel -there are new risks which must be monitored and managed. My briefings also focus on whatever is changing so there will be total crew awareness.
• Pilots should give equal priority to landing or going around. Never assume that any approach will end in a landing.
• Know what data is driving the flight director bars and always monitor and believe the raw data.
• Awareness is the sum total of a lot of little things which vary with the phase of flight. For example, prior to taxiing, I review the taxi route in relation to the active runways; prior to taxiingonto the takeoff runway, I clear the approach path (one time in 38 years of flying there was an aircraft on a 1/4 mile final); prior to beginning descent, I review my fuel options; prior to landing I calculate where the glide slope intersects the runway and the length of remaining runway. These things are not taught in training - you must figure them out yourself.
• Detailed knowledge of the Flight Management System (FMS) is essential in all glass-cockpit aircraft.
• Develop a rule of thumb for validating V2 and VREF on every takeoff and landing.
• During overwater operations, fuel, or lack of it, can quickly limit your options and should thereforebe considered a critical system.
• Trouble can begin when the wheels touch the runway; yet everybody seems to relax then.
• Pay special attention to memorizing all of the FMS applications. It is important during critical phases of flight to be able to quickly get the information you need without thinking about how to do it.
• Controlled Flight Into Terrain (CFIT), runway excursions, runway incursions, and high speed RTO's are the greatest safety risks in aviation today.
• Before each flight, I typically spend about one hour at home reviewing the route and airport information. If it is my first flight into an international airport, the time required will be 2-4 hours.
• During international operations, pay particular attention to the meticulous details of navigational procedures.
• Maintain a terrain awareness and a general knowledge of the topography over which you are flying.
• Commit SOP'S, limitations and emergency procedures to memory, to free up mental capacity to deal with unforeseen events - the more you know, the more time you will have.
• After each flight or proficiency check, I debrief myself and record items I want to change in a
notebook. The act of writing it down causes me to memorize the change.
• Know where you want to be, where you are, and where you are going.
• The Captain must always be able to recognize the onset of inattention in himself or his crew.
• You don't know what you don't know. The secret of a long, safe flying career is to reduce the "don't know" category as much as possible.
• Don't touch a switch without looking and knowing what, when, and why you want to move it.
• Be totally aware of what is around you, particularly during takeoff and landings.
• The very best pilots I have checked out have consistently demonstrated the ability to see the big picture and not become fixated on anything. Even during approaches in minimum weather conditions, they don't become "locked" on the gauges until inside the outer marker.
• It seems to me there are three levels of awareness: The first is the awareness which comes from completing a typical transition course - systems knowledge, SOP'S, normal, irregular, emergency procedures, and initial operating experience. Next is the awareness which comes from information from others - asking questions, inquiry, crew coordination, CLR, etc. Finally comes the awareness which comes from continually reading the books and manuals; figuring out the traps of flying; and developing personal strategies, techniques and habit patterns to deal with them. This third area is the most difficult and requires considerable personal commitment and discipline.
• You don't have time to make all of the mistakes, so you have to learn from others. I review all accidents and ask myself what would I have done? How could I have avoided the accident?
• If anything is out of the ordinary or if the aircraft is not performing the way you think it should, check it out.
• Develop effective listening skills including the ability to filter out lower priority information and return to it later.
• Listen to others and find out how they do things - then re-evaluate your own habit patterns.
• Always have both a plan and a contingency plan. For example, I review destination and
alternate airport weather an hour before landing and then calculate the required fuel from the primary holding fix to the runway and then to the alternate airport.
• If there is any doubt about an ATC clearance, I ask for confirmation from ATC.
CONCLUSIONS
We hope the above comments collectively present some insight into how a selected group of pilots have completed over 1,000 years of accident-free flying. We are not suggesting that everyone accomplish each of these techniques. The comments should be regarded as items which some pilots find useful.
It is very interesting to note that none of the responses involved the "stick and rudder" aspects of flying. From a safety perspective, this is right on target since it is hard to think of an accident in which the pilot couldn't fly the aircraft. While the engine-out on takeoff, engine-out approach to Category 11 minimums, engine-out missed approach and non-precision approach maneuvers may be the causes of most repeated items in proficiency checks, they are not the causes of most accidents. When accidents are classified as "pilot error," it is almost never because of a 11 stick-and-rudder" deficiency, but rather because of some event that perhaps could have been overcome with one or more of the techniques noted above.
Now is my turn to help and support those "stupid cadettes" Mhhhh sounds familiar. Oh ! I once was one of those. However, I have never forgotten the fact.
"We should take care not to make the intellect our god. It has , of course, powerful muscles, but no personality"
"Imagination is more important than knowledge."
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler"
A Einstein.
Make your conclusions.
The next text will help to explain my point. Im not a smart guy and with any degree under my belt
WHAT MAKES A PILOT "STREET SMART"
ABOUT FLYING ?
Original idea from United Airlines (Safetyliner)
What makes a pilot "street smart" about flying? By "street smart" we mean:
awareness of the essential aspects of flying; ability to know where and when to find
critical information; ability to detect and compensate for the mistakes of others;
ability to avoid the subtle traps and pitfalls found in the flying environment; and ability to
complete a 30-year career without any accidents or serious incidents. Thousands of
pilots do this each year - complete a very successful 30-year career without a single
incident or accident. Is this just luck, or are there specific identifiable reasons for these
superb records?
To find the answer to this question, Safetyliner conducted some years ago a telephone survey with selected pilots in the industry. Each pilot had at least 25 years of
experience. Our group included pilots from six countries and from airframe manufacturers, NASA test pilots, military pilots, UAL line pilots, Chief Pilots, Fleet Captains and instructors. In each case they posed the following
questions, and then let the interviewee respond as he or she saw fit.
1) What, in your opinion, makes a pilot "street smart" about flying?
2) To what do you attribute the fact that you have never had an accident?
3) Will you share with Safetyliner's readers your thoughts, techniques or strategies which
have helped you achieve this excellent safety record?
4) Are there any systems or factors which you consider more important than others?
5) Do you consciously monitor any particular areas to increase your awareness of critical
safety items?
6) If you were to advise a new, minimal experience Captain about how to avoid the pitfalls
of flying, what would you tell him or her? Safetyliner was surprised that the answers covered a very wide spectrum of topics; therefore, they grouped the responses into three categories :
· Attitude or Mind Set - a predisposition to do things in a certain way.
· Teamwork, Crew Coordination, and Crew Interaction.
· Awareness - individual techniques and strategies, specific items to monitor.
The responses are not ranked or put into any particular order and are presented as close to the original comment as possible. Many of the responses were very similar, in which case Safetyliner selected the most comprehensive comment.
ATTITUDE - MIND SET
• There's almost nothing that needs to be done in a hurry in an aircraft.
• Plan ahead for normal events and be prepared for unexpected contingencies.
• Pay attention to your sixth sense. If something feels wrong, it probably is.
• Develop an assertive attitude and openly communicate concerns to other crewmembers.
• Keep your options open -never become committed to a single course of action with a high degree of risk.
• The way to be safe is never to be comfortable.
• If you are getting rushed or overloaded, slow down even if it means delaying pushback, delaying takeoff or even holding.
• Flying must be the focus of your interest; you must want to do a good job. Stick to Standard Operating Procedures unless they are obviously inadequate.
• Return to basics if you become confused.
• Maintain a healthy level of suspicion.
• Even though pilots sometimes like to give the opposite impression, a true professional is
responsible, diligent and studious.
• Eliminate distractions and maintain an alert, vigilant mental state.
• Avoid complacency; the minute you think something won't hurt you - it will!
• Never go on a flight with a head full of problems; leave them on the ground or stay on the ground yourself.
• Be especially vigilant when everything is going well. For example, the difficult approaches like CRW, SAN, MDW, HKG, or poor students (if you instruct) won't hurt you since you are already alert and aware of the risk. You must resist the tendency to become complacent when everything looks normal.
• Be open minded to constructive criticism.
• Always fly in the same standard way regardless of whether it is a normal line flight, an enroute check, or a proficiency check.
• The common thread among all survivors is common sense.
• The things that get pilots in trouble are incorrect premises and fixation.
• Don't become complacent; sit on the edge of your seat; never take anything for granted; never become relaxed; question everything; stay alert.
• Never assume anything, but verify and cross-check all critical information.
• A pilot must be able to adapt; no two situations are the same.
TEAMWORK - CREW COORDINATION - CREW INTERACTION
• Share information with your crew. To the extent that you share information with them, they will share information with you and tell you if you have made a mistake.
• Don't try to do everything yourself.
• Use SOP's so everyone knows what to expect.
• Surprises are nice on birthdays and Christmas, but have no place in aviation. Let everyone know what you are thinking, planning, and doing.
• Always question; don't assume.
• The first thing the Captain should do is to mold the crew into a team.
• Briefings are very important; talk through what you are going to do; everyone should participate.
• Use your crew; frequently I have found another crewmember has just the information I need.
• Evaluate the people you fly with -to understand and compensate for their strengths and
weaknesses.
• Maintain redundancy in the cockpit. The pilot not flying must cross-check the actions of the pilot flying and bring discrepancies to his attention.
• Communication among the crew, and especially with ATC, is critical in today's saturated ATC system.
AWARENESS - TECHNIQUES - STRATEGIES
• It is important to have mentally prepared strategies to deal with critical operational situations. For example, if you lost an engine in a B-767 at 30 degrees West, where would you go? What if you were in a B-747?
• Flying safely is effectively managing change. The items which I monitor vary with whatever is changing. For example, before beginning to taxi, I think about the risks and problems associated with taxiing. Items like - receipt and dispatch procedures, maximum breakaway thrust, taxi route, wingtip clearances, avoiding runway incursions, etc. Before takeoff, I review the performancedata, RTO procedures, engine-out procedures, the departure route and terrain proximity. Any time something changes - and it can be a small item like a 4,000 ft altitude change or cross-feeding fuel -there are new risks which must be monitored and managed. My briefings also focus on whatever is changing so there will be total crew awareness.
• Pilots should give equal priority to landing or going around. Never assume that any approach will end in a landing.
• Know what data is driving the flight director bars and always monitor and believe the raw data.
• Awareness is the sum total of a lot of little things which vary with the phase of flight. For example, prior to taxiing, I review the taxi route in relation to the active runways; prior to taxiingonto the takeoff runway, I clear the approach path (one time in 38 years of flying there was an aircraft on a 1/4 mile final); prior to beginning descent, I review my fuel options; prior to landing I calculate where the glide slope intersects the runway and the length of remaining runway. These things are not taught in training - you must figure them out yourself.
• Detailed knowledge of the Flight Management System (FMS) is essential in all glass-cockpit aircraft.
• Develop a rule of thumb for validating V2 and VREF on every takeoff and landing.
• During overwater operations, fuel, or lack of it, can quickly limit your options and should thereforebe considered a critical system.
• Trouble can begin when the wheels touch the runway; yet everybody seems to relax then.
• Pay special attention to memorizing all of the FMS applications. It is important during critical phases of flight to be able to quickly get the information you need without thinking about how to do it.
• Controlled Flight Into Terrain (CFIT), runway excursions, runway incursions, and high speed RTO's are the greatest safety risks in aviation today.
• Before each flight, I typically spend about one hour at home reviewing the route and airport information. If it is my first flight into an international airport, the time required will be 2-4 hours.
• During international operations, pay particular attention to the meticulous details of navigational procedures.
• Maintain a terrain awareness and a general knowledge of the topography over which you are flying.
• Commit SOP'S, limitations and emergency procedures to memory, to free up mental capacity to deal with unforeseen events - the more you know, the more time you will have.
• After each flight or proficiency check, I debrief myself and record items I want to change in a
notebook. The act of writing it down causes me to memorize the change.
• Know where you want to be, where you are, and where you are going.
• The Captain must always be able to recognize the onset of inattention in himself or his crew.
• You don't know what you don't know. The secret of a long, safe flying career is to reduce the "don't know" category as much as possible.
• Don't touch a switch without looking and knowing what, when, and why you want to move it.
• Be totally aware of what is around you, particularly during takeoff and landings.
• The very best pilots I have checked out have consistently demonstrated the ability to see the big picture and not become fixated on anything. Even during approaches in minimum weather conditions, they don't become "locked" on the gauges until inside the outer marker.
• It seems to me there are three levels of awareness: The first is the awareness which comes from completing a typical transition course - systems knowledge, SOP'S, normal, irregular, emergency procedures, and initial operating experience. Next is the awareness which comes from information from others - asking questions, inquiry, crew coordination, CLR, etc. Finally comes the awareness which comes from continually reading the books and manuals; figuring out the traps of flying; and developing personal strategies, techniques and habit patterns to deal with them. This third area is the most difficult and requires considerable personal commitment and discipline.
• You don't have time to make all of the mistakes, so you have to learn from others. I review all accidents and ask myself what would I have done? How could I have avoided the accident?
• If anything is out of the ordinary or if the aircraft is not performing the way you think it should, check it out.
• Develop effective listening skills including the ability to filter out lower priority information and return to it later.
• Listen to others and find out how they do things - then re-evaluate your own habit patterns.
• Always have both a plan and a contingency plan. For example, I review destination and
alternate airport weather an hour before landing and then calculate the required fuel from the primary holding fix to the runway and then to the alternate airport.
• If there is any doubt about an ATC clearance, I ask for confirmation from ATC.
CONCLUSIONS
We hope the above comments collectively present some insight into how a selected group of pilots have completed over 1,000 years of accident-free flying. We are not suggesting that everyone accomplish each of these techniques. The comments should be regarded as items which some pilots find useful.
It is very interesting to note that none of the responses involved the "stick and rudder" aspects of flying. From a safety perspective, this is right on target since it is hard to think of an accident in which the pilot couldn't fly the aircraft. While the engine-out on takeoff, engine-out approach to Category 11 minimums, engine-out missed approach and non-precision approach maneuvers may be the causes of most repeated items in proficiency checks, they are not the causes of most accidents. When accidents are classified as "pilot error," it is almost never because of a 11 stick-and-rudder" deficiency, but rather because of some event that perhaps could have been overcome with one or more of the techniques noted above.
Now is my turn to help and support those "stupid cadettes" Mhhhh sounds familiar. Oh ! I once was one of those. However, I have never forgotten the fact.
"We should take care not to make the intellect our god. It has , of course, powerful muscles, but no personality"
"Imagination is more important than knowledge."
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler"
A Einstein.
Make your conclusions.
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Despegue, in the event that you were able to restore the "prestige" (whatever that means ?) of pilots, I'd be interested to know how you would expect that to be manifested among the non-piloting fraternity ?
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Excellent post Vonkluffen! I am going to save that in my pc. This should be shown in flight schools as part of the CRM/Air Safety lessons!
I beg to differ, mon frere. Try to make a monkey ditch an airplane full of people with all engines out due to bird strikes in a river with a virtually intact airframe and no serious injuries whatsoever. Try to make another monkey to land a fuel-exhausted A330 in a couple of islands in the North Atlantic after gliding for quite a significant amount of time and even circling and getting away with merely some blown tires. Or maybe a monkey could fly an hydraulic failed A300 with a wing on fire and land it with absolutely no damage? The list goes on forever...
The airplane may "fly itself" but it can't think for itself; that's when we come in.
The way management see it is that pilots DONT fly the aircraft no more just monitor it, so why should they get paid $400,000 a year to "fly" it if a monkey can do it.
The airplane may "fly itself" but it can't think for itself; that's when we come in.
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Ocampo,
I see your point indeed and I agree 100% and I think us pilots should get paid good money. But this is management we are talking about here!!
I was told that someone at Easyjet suggested that pilots should get pay matching there work..I.e you sit there and do nothing you get paid hardly anything.
In my honest opinion they way it is going, pilots are only there for when the sh*t hits the fan not to fly the plane and thats what they get paid for.
It still amazes me that in the past 100 years we went from discovering powered flight to planes that fly themselfs with 840 pax on board. In another 100 years may be everyone will be flying something what happens then? taxi drivers charging 100 pound a journey! Or may be pilots will control the aircraft from the ground via satellite a bit like the 'predator'.
I see your point indeed and I agree 100% and I think us pilots should get paid good money. But this is management we are talking about here!!
I was told that someone at Easyjet suggested that pilots should get pay matching there work..I.e you sit there and do nothing you get paid hardly anything.
In my honest opinion they way it is going, pilots are only there for when the sh*t hits the fan not to fly the plane and thats what they get paid for.
It still amazes me that in the past 100 years we went from discovering powered flight to planes that fly themselfs with 840 pax on board. In another 100 years may be everyone will be flying something what happens then? taxi drivers charging 100 pound a journey! Or may be pilots will control the aircraft from the ground via satellite a bit like the 'predator'.
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The Real Pros checklist!
• Pay attention to your sixth sense. If something feels wrong, it probably is.
The whole post is all you need to discuss in recurrent CRM training.
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I beg to differ, mon frere. Try to make a monkey ditch an airplane full of people with all engines out due to bird strikes in a river with a virtually intact airframe and no serious injuries whatsoever. Try to make another monkey to land a fuel-exhausted A330 in a couple of islands in the North Atlantic after gliding for quite a significant amount of time and even circling and getting away with merely some blown tires. Or maybe a monkey could fly an hydraulic failed A300 with a wing on fire and land it with absolutely no damage? The list goes on forever...
(Apologies for commenting. I am not a professional pilot, but I am an intelligent, professional, hard working young man who decided not to pursue a career in seat A0 beacuse of all the baggage that now comes with the job- quite relevant to the discussion
).
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In my view Vonkluffen's post warrants a sticky in the crm forum. Read this first before posting..
As for the rest, I suppose it is a sign of the times. Nobody respects anybody anymore; policemen are attacked, doctors are disrespected, it is only natural that the public sees us as expendable and expensive ornaments as that is how many of them view the world as a whole; if it is not there to suit their immediate desires, it is surplus and disposable.
You get what you tolerate. In our world we have become a consumer driven society where everybody knows the price of everything and the value of nothing, as has been aptly stated before.
To reinstate respect for pilots you need to reinstate respect for everybody who works in a professional manner. Sadly, when our own managements regard us as mere "assets", if not liabilities as can be deducted from the phrase "Human Resources" and the short term cost-benefit view of those who nowadays run the companies, it will not happen in my lifetime and I have a fair number of years to go.
The best we can do is ensure we are always professional, so at least among ourselves we recognise professionalism and respect it. That also entails not speaking derogatively about others especially in public, for in dfoing so we confirm the negative image that is out there anyway. That does not mean that we cannot entertain some of those thoughts in private, but every pilot who is seen to act in what the public defines as less than professional conduct, does a disservice to the profession.
So if you want to be treated as the professional you are, be seen to act like the professional you are. And even then there is no guarantee, but at least you have the satisfaction of doing it right.
As for the rest, I suppose it is a sign of the times. Nobody respects anybody anymore; policemen are attacked, doctors are disrespected, it is only natural that the public sees us as expendable and expensive ornaments as that is how many of them view the world as a whole; if it is not there to suit their immediate desires, it is surplus and disposable.
You get what you tolerate. In our world we have become a consumer driven society where everybody knows the price of everything and the value of nothing, as has been aptly stated before.
To reinstate respect for pilots you need to reinstate respect for everybody who works in a professional manner. Sadly, when our own managements regard us as mere "assets", if not liabilities as can be deducted from the phrase "Human Resources" and the short term cost-benefit view of those who nowadays run the companies, it will not happen in my lifetime and I have a fair number of years to go.
The best we can do is ensure we are always professional, so at least among ourselves we recognise professionalism and respect it. That also entails not speaking derogatively about others especially in public, for in dfoing so we confirm the negative image that is out there anyway. That does not mean that we cannot entertain some of those thoughts in private, but every pilot who is seen to act in what the public defines as less than professional conduct, does a disservice to the profession.
So if you want to be treated as the professional you are, be seen to act like the professional you are. And even then there is no guarantee, but at least you have the satisfaction of doing it right.
The mystique of aviation has gone and it won't come back. Everybody travels by air, everybody has Flight Simulator.
And as for being a profession, Doctors, Solicitors, Priests and Company Directors can sign your passport application as a reponsible member of the community, but can airline pilots ?
And as for being a profession, Doctors, Solicitors, Priests and Company Directors can sign your passport application as a reponsible member of the community, but can airline pilots ?
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Lets face the airline business is a victim of it's own success....
If flying has lost its prestige then why are so many people aspiring to become pilots? If these same wannabes have spent even 5 minutes looking at some of the threads on this forum (which I am sure many many of them have), and the terms and conditions are so bad - what attracts them?
Both Airbus and Boeing forecast a doubling in the size of the world's commercial aircraft fleet in the next 20 years. In fact their forecasts have been bullish for the last 10 years. Who did/do you think is going to fly these aircraft? The same physics, science or math graduates who can go to the city of London and be millionaires by the age of 30 robbing their grannies of their pensions? Get real!!
If you have come into this business in the last 10 years thinking you were joining some exclusive club then frankly you are beyond saving.
The fact of the matter is there are still good flying jobs out there that pay a decent crack, you just have to work hard to get them. The fact that people don't trip overthemselves in awe at your god like abilities to is neither here nor there.
If flying has lost its prestige then why are so many people aspiring to become pilots? If these same wannabes have spent even 5 minutes looking at some of the threads on this forum (which I am sure many many of them have), and the terms and conditions are so bad - what attracts them?
Both Airbus and Boeing forecast a doubling in the size of the world's commercial aircraft fleet in the next 20 years. In fact their forecasts have been bullish for the last 10 years. Who did/do you think is going to fly these aircraft? The same physics, science or math graduates who can go to the city of London and be millionaires by the age of 30 robbing their grannies of their pensions? Get real!!
If you have come into this business in the last 10 years thinking you were joining some exclusive club then frankly you are beyond saving.
The fact of the matter is there are still good flying jobs out there that pay a decent crack, you just have to work hard to get them. The fact that people don't trip overthemselves in awe at your god like abilities to is neither here nor there.