Is this for real?
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Is this for real?
Having laid down its criteria for redundancies, Atlantic Airlines(Coventry) has bucked the trend somewhat and stipulated that length of service with the company will actually be held AGAINST Pilots!!
Apparently, the reason given is that bonded pilots are less likely to leave and so the company wont have to incur further training costs , resulting in those pilots obtaining a higher score than those with any significant length of service behind them.
Is this not a case of discrimination and do other airlines adopt this seemingly `odd` practice?
Has this system been contrived by people with agendas? Just a thought.
Apparently, the reason given is that bonded pilots are less likely to leave and so the company wont have to incur further training costs , resulting in those pilots obtaining a higher score than those with any significant length of service behind them.
Is this not a case of discrimination and do other airlines adopt this seemingly `odd` practice?
Has this system been contrived by people with agendas? Just a thought.
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The top bods know about this then do they?:
[I]A High Court judge said that the number of years an employee has been with a company is relevant when managers are deciding who to lay off.
Sir Thomas Morison pointed out that length of service shows a worker's loyalty and experience, and added that older workers need job protection as they will find it less easy to find new positions than younger candidates.
His ruling in a dispute involving Rolls-Royce was hailed by Unite, Britain's biggest union, as a victory for older workers at a time when many will be fearing the sack. Figures this week show 1.8 million are now jobless but many more redundancies are expected as turmoil in the financial sector turns into recession.
Derek Simpson, joint general secretary of Unite, said....................
...............However the judge gave Rolls-Royce permission to appeal his ruling, saying it was "clearly an important point for both parties". /I]
More experienced workers safer from redundancy after Rolls-Royce ruling - Telegraph
[I]A High Court judge said that the number of years an employee has been with a company is relevant when managers are deciding who to lay off.
Sir Thomas Morison pointed out that length of service shows a worker's loyalty and experience, and added that older workers need job protection as they will find it less easy to find new positions than younger candidates.
His ruling in a dispute involving Rolls-Royce was hailed by Unite, Britain's biggest union, as a victory for older workers at a time when many will be fearing the sack. Figures this week show 1.8 million are now jobless but many more redundancies are expected as turmoil in the financial sector turns into recession.
Derek Simpson, joint general secretary of Unite, said....................
...............However the judge gave Rolls-Royce permission to appeal his ruling, saying it was "clearly an important point for both parties". /I]
More experienced workers safer from redundancy after Rolls-Royce ruling - Telegraph
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Ouch, could set a hurtful precedent.
Interesting to see that the management cited training costs as the driving factor. Nothing to do with the junior pilots being, possibly, lower paid or more willing to accept lower T's & C's in order to retain their place! Also with many more years at the company to 'give/ be slaved for'!
This will be a very interesting one to watch.
Interesting to see that the management cited training costs as the driving factor. Nothing to do with the junior pilots being, possibly, lower paid or more willing to accept lower T's & C's in order to retain their place! Also with many more years at the company to 'give/ be slaved for'!
This will be a very interesting one to watch.
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Whilst it does seem to be unusual in this industry it's important to add that this is not the only way that the redundancies are going to be decided. There are other criteria that will be 'scored' to decide who are the unlucky guys.
wobble2plank
Are you speculating about training costs and pay? There is no incremantal pay system based on years of service at Atlantic, apart from the senior FO wage which most are not on as promotion to Captain comes quicker alot of the time.
It's a sad time for both the crews and the Electras.
wobble2plank
Are you speculating about training costs and pay? There is no incremantal pay system based on years of service at Atlantic, apart from the senior FO wage which most are not on as promotion to Captain comes quicker alot of the time.
It's a sad time for both the crews and the Electras.
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Oh yeah, other criteria.
Like penalising crews based on where they live! The further from Coventry you live the bigger the penalty. Whats that all about?
How about giving more "points" to those who sink the most lagers, actually that would help most of us.
I can only assume that whoever is advising Atlantic Airlines on employment law knows what theyre on about because otherwise its gonna be messy.
Like penalising crews based on where they live! The further from Coventry you live the bigger the penalty. Whats that all about?
How about giving more "points" to those who sink the most lagers, actually that would help most of us.
I can only assume that whoever is advising Atlantic Airlines on employment law knows what theyre on about because otherwise its gonna be messy.
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Atlantic's HR policies have always been questionable at best - as any ex-fugly will know (*cough*trainingagreement*cough*). I do seem to remember an engineers contract that was so badly written they all refused to sign it.
I wouldn't worry about the senior staff being up for the chop first - from what i've seen out and about most of them are jumping ship anyway...
I wouldn't worry about the senior staff being up for the chop first - from what i've seen out and about most of them are jumping ship anyway...
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They have always traded on dumb pilots failure to realise that nostalgia doesn't pay the bills. Anyone who stayed there 5 mins longer than absolutely necessary has my sympathy, mixed with incomprehension. There must have been other gigs out there you could/should have gone to ?
Still it's good to see that they are at least consistent, doesn't sound like Massey Ferguson Foden and his happy band changed their tune much since 1984.
Still it's good to see that they are at least consistent, doesn't sound like Massey Ferguson Foden and his happy band changed their tune much since 1984.
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Dont be a muppet!!
The criteria laid down for getting rid of people was composed by those with THE agenda, Jeez!!
It has been designed to fit their purpose. Very sad that Atlantic has lowered itself to this but as most out there will know. Not surprising!
The criteria laid down for getting rid of people was composed by those with THE agenda, Jeez!!
It has been designed to fit their purpose. Very sad that Atlantic has lowered itself to this but as most out there will know. Not surprising!
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The Arian Electra Race??
Hmm, an excuse to kick a few non brits, bond expired and non ar** lickers from the company. A management pilot already boasted about who he'd kick if it came to downsizing. And dont forget captains who tech Electras with MEL deficiencies... naughty boys will get punishment perhaps? Very smelly. Time will tell.
SiPsss
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I spelled aryan wrong, so they tell me!
The saga continues, or should I say - the charade!
9 crew have been selected for redundancy. 6 skippers and 3 SiCs.
As predicted, the Dutch and Canadian guys have been included, leaving only one foreigner left in the company!! Of course, the company will deny that these candidates were preselected before the redundancy consultation began. DfO should be worried - it was his crystal ball making the predictions! HIs son is safe though! Sssssss.
We may be jumping the gun here, but the axe seems to be falling on the chosen few. Those who felt safe are already in fear of the second wave and are sending out CVs!
Guessing that the newly declared Westair sister company have no idea about the redunancy plans on the Atlantic Electra fleet.
What a
up!
RIP guys - we know you loved flying the L188, but you'll be better off at a professional company where command skills come before personality.
SiPsss
9 crew have been selected for redundancy. 6 skippers and 3 SiCs.
As predicted, the Dutch and Canadian guys have been included, leaving only one foreigner left in the company!! Of course, the company will deny that these candidates were preselected before the redundancy consultation began. DfO should be worried - it was his crystal ball making the predictions! HIs son is safe though! Sssssss.
We may be jumping the gun here, but the axe seems to be falling on the chosen few. Those who felt safe are already in fear of the second wave and are sending out CVs!
Guessing that the newly declared Westair sister company have no idea about the redunancy plans on the Atlantic Electra fleet.
What a
up!RIP guys - we know you loved flying the L188, but you'll be better off at a professional company where command skills come before personality.
SiPsss
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Que!?
Guys, people might be feeing a little bitter here, but the company seem to be doing their best in a difficult situation. Imagine being the person having to choose the redundant people? Not easy, but emotions will run high naturally.
Shi* happens - they're making your job redundant, not you.
We love you, even if JL doesn't.
Merry xmas aviators! Imagine telling your grandchildren all these stories!?
WcB
Shi* happens - they're making your job redundant, not you.
We love you, even if JL doesn't.
Merry xmas aviators! Imagine telling your grandchildren all these stories!?
WcB
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Stellair,
Chill dude, emotions are a wee bit high but nobody is casting aspersions(sic) about Pilots integrity, ability etc.
If your lucky enough not to be affected by the redundancies, at least allow those that are , their chance to let off steam.
Personally I am affected, but would like to say firstly that I feel priveleged to have flown the Electra, loved every single minute, and will be sad not hear those Allisons roar as the Old Girl sprints away(even at 3o`clock in the morning). Secondly, the guys left behind ( Electra, of course) are really top guys who have made my experience such a good one, I hope to keep in touch with them all and wish every single one my best wishes for the future.
Unfortunately, as all will know, the process of redundancy has been blighted by the fact that selection was based on personality rather than ability( again, no disrespect to those remaining). The DFO in most peoples opinion has made the CP job almost impossible,and has compromised the whole thing to such a degree that personal greivance procedures will undoubtedly follow.
Just a note of caution to those that remain: the criteria for redundancies has been drawn up and by law will have to be used again if required.
Remember guys, that the longer you stay at Atlantic the higher chance you stand of being laid off, not a great incentive to reamain loyal,eh?
Chill dude, emotions are a wee bit high but nobody is casting aspersions(sic) about Pilots integrity, ability etc.
If your lucky enough not to be affected by the redundancies, at least allow those that are , their chance to let off steam.
Personally I am affected, but would like to say firstly that I feel priveleged to have flown the Electra, loved every single minute, and will be sad not hear those Allisons roar as the Old Girl sprints away(even at 3o`clock in the morning). Secondly, the guys left behind ( Electra, of course) are really top guys who have made my experience such a good one, I hope to keep in touch with them all and wish every single one my best wishes for the future.
Unfortunately, as all will know, the process of redundancy has been blighted by the fact that selection was based on personality rather than ability( again, no disrespect to those remaining). The DFO in most peoples opinion has made the CP job almost impossible,and has compromised the whole thing to such a degree that personal greivance procedures will undoubtedly follow.
Just a note of caution to those that remain: the criteria for redundancies has been drawn up and by law will have to be used again if required.
Remember guys, that the longer you stay at Atlantic the higher chance you stand of being laid off, not a great incentive to reamain loyal,eh?
