Message to Ryanair pilots
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Up yours FR!
It's not official, but the counting has been done, and it looks like 11 bases rejected the FR 4 year proposal. 5 bases voted in favour of getting shafted further over the next 4 years.
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Having left FR a couple of years ago, I am out of the loop now, but I do have old colleagues in LTN.
They tell me the five on, four off is good for them. There is very little loss in sector pay, but naturally some because of working less. FOs complain of losses due to training and standbys (but that is company-wide, not as a result of the agreement).
As the majority appear to think this is a bad idea, how is it that LTN appear to have been smiling about it for the past year? Knowing FR, they have probably been buttering up LTN for an example-setting exercise.
There must be a few people in LTN that write on these threads. Where are they on this thread to tell us how the last year has been? If it has not worked for them, surely they will be giving a 'protest' NO vote this year.
They tell me the five on, four off is good for them. There is very little loss in sector pay, but naturally some because of working less. FOs complain of losses due to training and standbys (but that is company-wide, not as a result of the agreement).
As the majority appear to think this is a bad idea, how is it that LTN appear to have been smiling about it for the past year? Knowing FR, they have probably been buttering up LTN for an example-setting exercise.
There must be a few people in LTN that write on these threads. Where are they on this thread to tell us how the last year has been? If it has not worked for them, surely they will be giving a 'protest' NO vote this year.
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Config.
The point being, why were Ltn voting at all? They signed up to a static 5 year deal last year. Typically, FR management decided to change it already this year! No deal offered by FR is worth the paper. They can, and have, changed it at will with a memo.
'We only made £290 million this year instead of £300 million. Times are tough - off with your heads (as well as down with your allowances and conditions)......effective yesterday.'
The point being, why were Ltn voting at all? They signed up to a static 5 year deal last year. Typically, FR management decided to change it already this year! No deal offered by FR is worth the paper. They can, and have, changed it at will with a memo.
'We only made £290 million this year instead of £300 million. Times are tough - off with your heads (as well as down with your allowances and conditions)......effective yesterday.'
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Oh CONFIG,give me a break.i have friends in ltn also and they are getting screwed.the problem is that some pilots there continue to deal with management,knowing full well that the kid in the right hand seat is getting it in the neck.do they care,well it appears not!I'M ALRIGHT JACK!
It appears that in most bases,pilots have woken up to the fact that they are being screwed and are no longer willing to **** on their colleagues for a few scraps from mol's table.It is called RESPECT,a concept that is new to ryanair but is catching on fast.
As for the bases who voted for the 4 year deal.SUCKERS!!!
The question,now must be asked.Why does the overwhelming majority of ryanair pilots refuse to deal with ryanair for the second year in a row?
The deal was never good.
The deal will never last.
The deal is dependent on one pilot suffering to benefit another.
Lie down with dogs and you will get up with fleas!
It appears that in most bases,pilots have woken up to the fact that they are being screwed and are no longer willing to **** on their colleagues for a few scraps from mol's table.It is called RESPECT,a concept that is new to ryanair but is catching on fast.
As for the bases who voted for the 4 year deal.SUCKERS!!!
The question,now must be asked.Why does the overwhelming majority of ryanair pilots refuse to deal with ryanair for the second year in a row?
The deal was never good.
The deal will never last.
The deal is dependent on one pilot suffering to benefit another.
Lie down with dogs and you will get up with fleas!
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Config - I spoke to a few guys from the LTN base last year too. The 5/4 seemed to be ok for them, but that was BEFORE January, when the roster can change everywhich way DOB wants ("...because I can." -his words).
The 5/4 guys went through a period of instability in their roster (and roster stability is one of the best things about Ryanair!) - they've only just become stable again, but in that period between Jan and March it's difficult to plan ahead.
Also I heard there are no standbys either side of the 5/4 on the new deal (maybe was a "looney" suggestion, who knows?) - but I'm on 5/3 and I've had the last week off due to the combination of unused standbys and my off days.
Again, with that, there are pluses and minuses - sometimes its nice to have the time off (if you're at home - for guys who communte from abroad I imagine it's a living hell not being called out on standby), but the flipside is that since a good deal of our pay is made up from flight pay - especially as F/Os or S/Os - not flying can mean a huge reduction in pay.
That's something I'd like to see changed - more basic pay, less flight pay or pay for standby days even if they are unused.
The 5/4 guys went through a period of instability in their roster (and roster stability is one of the best things about Ryanair!) - they've only just become stable again, but in that period between Jan and March it's difficult to plan ahead.
Also I heard there are no standbys either side of the 5/4 on the new deal (maybe was a "looney" suggestion, who knows?) - but I'm on 5/3 and I've had the last week off due to the combination of unused standbys and my off days.
Again, with that, there are pluses and minuses - sometimes its nice to have the time off (if you're at home - for guys who communte from abroad I imagine it's a living hell not being called out on standby), but the flipside is that since a good deal of our pay is made up from flight pay - especially as F/Os or S/Os - not flying can mean a huge reduction in pay.
That's something I'd like to see changed - more basic pay, less flight pay or pay for standby days even if they are unused.
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That's something I'd like to see changed - more basic pay, less flight pay or pay for standby days even if they are unused
Can see DOB going for that one.. That would be great, but unless we get union recognition we've no chance.
JOIN REPA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JOIN REPA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JOIN REPA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JOIN REPA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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join Repa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join Repa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join Repa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join Repa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join Repa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join Repa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join Repa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join A Union!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join A Union!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join A Union!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Join A Union!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Union Recon is the future for Ryanair.
The sooner we all join the sooner we can make a change for the better.
Remember this is not about making a change in Ryanair, it's about making a change for the rest of the pilot community.
If Ryanair continue with the downward spiral of t's and c's, then it's harder for the competing company to match the low cost fares. They either go out of business, or have to cut their own t's and c's.
Ryanair is going to be the biggest airline in Europe, it's up to us to prevent it from destroying it due greed
The sooner we all join the sooner we can make a change for the better.
Remember this is not about making a change in Ryanair, it's about making a change for the rest of the pilot community.
If Ryanair continue with the downward spiral of t's and c's, then it's harder for the competing company to match the low cost fares. They either go out of business, or have to cut their own t's and c's.
Ryanair is going to be the biggest airline in Europe, it's up to us to prevent it from destroying it due greed
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Thats right easymoney! So all those pilots who think "I`m just in FR for a couple of years until I can get a couple of thousand hours or a command, then I`ll be able to get a decent job" are fooling themselves - there will be no "decent" jobs left! It is time to stop the rot NOW! You are getting the support of the international pilot community through REPA, IALPA, BALPA, ECA etc, you are not on your own. Join up today!
I`m done now.
I`m done now.
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Ok, I admit I do not know the inns&outs of the proposed "deal"
but just from what's posted on this tread, it hardly seems
to be good (to say the least).
But if it really is that bad, can somebody explain
how this deal (preferably from somebody that voted in favour) was
accepted in 5 bases out of 16??!!
And as mentioned before, get a Union!! Now!
but just from what's posted on this tread, it hardly seems
to be good (to say the least).
But if it really is that bad, can somebody explain
how this deal (preferably from somebody that voted in favour) was
accepted in 5 bases out of 16??!!
And as mentioned before, get a Union!! Now!
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Easymoney, St Patrick - right on the money. The big challenge is trying to convince the unaware that they have no chance whatsoever of a good job in the future as things stand.
The even bigger challenge is to convince those who actually think that fr is a good future. These innocent folks are mainly trainers who will shortly be on mickos hitlist, now that he has destroyed FO pay. They don't think it will happen to them, so the $hitstorm, when it does hit them will be even more of a surprise. Considering FR have never ever honoured a single agreement with any group of pilots, quite what they're basing their conviction that fr actually value them is quite beyond me and plenty of others.
The upside is, that, when they are targetted, the shock should turn them into enthusiastic REPA supporters.
However I believe we are more than equal to the challenge and union recognition and the RPA WILL happen. FR themselves admit this, what we finally need is for the remaining unconvinced pilots to admit this to themselves. Then we will have the confidence to move forward with conviction. We're almost there, not quite, but very soon.
When that days happens, the fr pilot group will finally be able to look the rest of our colleagues in the eye and say "we fixed what we destroyed."
Various reasons. Naievty, lack of interest, lack of information. This list is endless. Astonishing as it may seem, some people genuinely couldn't be bothered doing the numbers and/or seek proper detailed information. I'm convinced anyone that did voted against. How these people who just couldn't be bothered about their career and personal wellbeing is beyond me. But out there they are. And flying jet aeroplanes
It is likely anyway that if fr hadn't used some good old-fashioned methods of disrupting the vote, the vote against would have much much higher.
The even bigger challenge is to convince those who actually think that fr is a good future. These innocent folks are mainly trainers who will shortly be on mickos hitlist, now that he has destroyed FO pay. They don't think it will happen to them, so the $hitstorm, when it does hit them will be even more of a surprise. Considering FR have never ever honoured a single agreement with any group of pilots, quite what they're basing their conviction that fr actually value them is quite beyond me and plenty of others.
The upside is, that, when they are targetted, the shock should turn them into enthusiastic REPA supporters.
However I believe we are more than equal to the challenge and union recognition and the RPA WILL happen. FR themselves admit this, what we finally need is for the remaining unconvinced pilots to admit this to themselves. Then we will have the confidence to move forward with conviction. We're almost there, not quite, but very soon.
When that days happens, the fr pilot group will finally be able to look the rest of our colleagues in the eye and say "we fixed what we destroyed."
But if it really is that bad, can somebody explain
how this deal (preferably from somebody that voted in favour) was
accepted in 5 bases out of 16??!!
how this deal (preferably from somebody that voted in favour) was
accepted in 5 bases out of 16??!!
It is likely anyway that if fr hadn't used some good old-fashioned methods of disrupting the vote, the vote against would have much much higher.
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how this deal (preferably from somebody that voted in favour) was
accepted in 5 bases out of 16??!!
accepted in 5 bases out of 16??!!
So bit of propoganda work for Ryanair to include LTN.
So that really leaves 4 out of 16:
EMA: Probably because they have a lot of Line Trainers and SFIs earning decent money which negates any loss of earnings they would have suffered if they were not in a training role, and innocent naive S/Os who were probably out numbered by the above.
CIA Some very, very "unusual" behaviour by a management figure there. I don't want to get the owners of this site in trouble so I will leave it at that. Don't be suprised if there is legal action at some point.
ORK 6 sector days the norm in cork, they Pilots probably wanted 5/4 to make it to retirement. Selfish Captains towards the end of their career who wanted more time off, not concerned about taking the money from S/Os and F/Os
PSA Similar situation to CIA.
Factor in a bit of interference in the balloting, e.g. closing polling stations before the advertised times, making promised proxy voting difficult to impossible and the result is not a surprise.
All the other bases saw this deal for what it was. Very attractive headline figures, but when held up to the light a sizeable paycut for S/O and F/O ranks with a few tidbits for Captains which would be completely swallowed up by inflation over the period of the deal.
Real Ryanair Pilots know all this, because they read it on www.repaweb.org
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Off on a trip so missed all your excitement. Congratulations guys!! Without wishing you to give the game away, where to from here? When/ how do you get recognition for your union membership? When do the rest of us get to see micko squirm?
ECON cruise, LR cruise...
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Sooner than you think...how does late March '08 sound to you???
The union recognition thing will first of all depend on getting as many pilots as possible on board. After that, it's a simple vote among BALPA members wether we want our union to do the negotiating for us. If the majority of votes cast are "yes", then that's it - whenever RYR come to us with their new "Fantaistic 
Paydeal", the reply will be a polite "Talk to BALPA, please".
When BALPA then - predictably - are turned away @ the doors of the White House, they will get back to the pilots with a request for proposals for a reaction to the unwillingness by RYR management to talk to our chosen representatives. It does not take great imagintion to see what we'll deem a fail, balanced & proportionate reaction to RYRs actions
UNITY
Paydeal", the reply will be a polite "Talk to BALPA, please".When BALPA then - predictably - are turned away @ the doors of the White House, they will get back to the pilots with a request for proposals for a reaction to the unwillingness by RYR management to talk to our chosen representatives. It does not take great imagintion to see what we'll deem a fail, balanced & proportionate reaction to RYRs actions
UNITY
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I have heard from rumours that in CIA the F/A's tried to form an inofficial union last year. Ryanair retaliated and fired / moved to other bases several of the "ring leaders". As a result the F/A's went on a kind of strike and while still performing their safety duties, refused to sell food and other goods during flight. Again MOL retaliated and replaced a lot of F/A's there, with several getting sacked. This might have caused some of the pilots to be afraid of MOL.
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Fantastic
I must applaud all of those who finally decided to stand up to the "barrow boy" MOL. It is about time that we all stand together as a profession. I have Many Friends in FR and glad to find out that you all will no longer be the scrapings on MOL's shoes
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Only Fools and Ryanair
If you are ever considering joining FR maybe you’ve read the banner Ad, please seek medical attention. Or speak to someone on the inside.
Anyone for charades?
So this is how it happens.
FR announce by company Intranet (in most bases the night before) that management are presenting this years pay deal having conducted "negotiations".
"negotiations"…Ha what a joke. STN has a long standing employment relations committee (ERC) member. (supposedly independent pilot representative). other bases had none.
And so it starts
Management do a whirlwind tour with laptops and powerpoint presentations, telling you about this wonderful 4 year deal, that for all ranks bar the most senior is a considerable deterioration in terms.
Some pilots have the audacity to dare and challenge the figures and assumptions, (bloody insubordinates how dare they challenge the Almighty) Management often do not have specific answers on the information they are presenting. Some managers admit "in the main it is a pay cut" others deny it. The figures are clear if you can use a calculator.
Pilots angry at further attempts to reduce T&C's are hostile towards deal. FR try and convince anyone who is willing to negotiate on behalf of pilots in their base. FR's own rules say individual must be independent and voted for by colleagues. Forgetting for a brief minute the employment laws that govern these situations. Most bases flatly refuse to be involved in the whole charade. so bases having their base captains in overdrive trying to find anyone with a stripe and a pulse to “negotiate” (officially listen to the dictation). Some bases end up with 6 month second officers with guarantees to "help their mates get a job" if they "negotiate" on behalf of their colleagues.
No rep was voted for this year, not one and most have no idea who is supposedly "negotiating" and these invisible people only known to management have certainly never spoken to pilots to ascertain what they might want.
General concencus is an overwhelming rejection, that is if you could, you see there is no rejection option its
A/ damned if you do or
B/ Damned if you don't
So with the secret deals behind closed doors there are now apparently some (ERC) reps in some bases who nobody actually knows or have consulted.
and then
Its management tour number 2 with a slight increase on their original Dictation, thats has been "negotiated" by your ERC rep, the standard rumours start that this base is going to accept it so you better act quickly blah blah and you will all decide by a secret ballot next week.
So what does the one recognised ERC in STN do, as they once haven't consulted pilots on what they want and have been absolutely silent to this point.
They hold a meeting to recommend this deal is accepted whilst seeking union recognition. “take the deal today and then get in the unions”, Have they checked that is possible with BALPA, BALPA say not and the information is misleading.
The majority of pilots present say this is not negotiated or consulted upon and the whole process is a farce and as you are suppose to represent us we do not agree with this. So the ERC back down from “official” support and just discreetly try and push it on an individual basis around the crew room.
Then we get 3 memos from management entitled LUNACY, LUNACY, LUNACY (trying to mirror the unity, unity, unity message of REPA) saying the loonies (unions) are lying, to you a sector pay decrease for F/O's is actually a payrise, this deal would deliver so much more for all blah blah. Lying, this is hilarious ( and this coming from those whose native language is bull$hite) who do so at will and have done so on numerous occasions and whose head of personnel in a case taken against REPA last year was slammed by the judge for what he called “False and Baseless” evidence. A company who every year cut and cut and change contracts of employment at will and by memo say trust us the Unions are lying. It was gutter propaganda as FR hoped to "lock in" pilots for 4 more years of whatever they chose.
Then comes the vote, the final step in the whole charade. well not for all, many guys commute or are away from base so FR have a so called proxy system, if you live overseas and are on a day off….sorry. if you meet the very exacting requirements and you can prove a good enough reason to get a form, then you must leave your name on it and sign it, with either option
1 FR's "4 year lock in" dictation or option
2 1 year deal
Secret ballot? "If you vote NO we're going to see you"
even with all this most pilots in most bases having seen all the tricks before, the propaganda, tight deadlines, fake negotiations, the pressure, FR started rumours, FR ignoring their own rules on ERC, their voting system, not withstanding employment laws of independent representations.
The pilots only interaction in this whole thing is 1 bit of paper and a pen
They all Vote.....the company holds its breath……. And…and……… oh dear.
11 Bases reject FR's dictation and chose the 1 year offer even though FR told us how wonderful the 4 year lock in was and it was LUNACY to turn it down.
So next the memo from senior management figure, just as last year, was saying you saved the company 10 million euros by voting No, thanks speak to you all next year.
But hold on a minute, that’s a bit of boring ending to this little drama
Then the problems start to hit home, you see BALPA have started a recognition campaign in the UK which MOL himself (in DUB pilot meeting) is alleged to have admitted "is highly likely to succeed" good for the guys on UK contracts,
but what about the brothers and sisters on Irish contracts. Well they are off to the Labour court armed with stacks of proof to prove that the whole ERC process is nothing more than a cosmetic charade, that FR control completely so they can claim to be dealing directly with pilots, for which ERC members past and present will be put on the stand to support all the documentary evidence and even FR's gold plated lawyers will find hard to defend.
So the majority of pilots voted against this despite our best efforts, But you, my generals, said if we spun it this way and chucked out the LUNACY memos we would get enough to buy it what happened??
Sorry your highness I’ll think of a plan to protect your kingdom, long live the king
this won't look good in the Labour court, we need to somehow prove our misguided pilots are happy dealing directly (us dicatating to them).
Iv'e got it .............Eureeka, the mighty one might spare me.
Oh mighty Lord of All I have it
Even though we said it saved us 10 million we will put all new hires and people transferring base on it and maybe all command upgrades on it,
Thats not enough.....
er er... we could even put a banner ad on a well respected Pilot forum and "sex up" the reality of the figures or your 4 year plot to put these jumped up 18hrs a week aerosexuals back in their place.
That’s not good enough we still don’t have enough for the labour court, Off with his head
But please lord, please have mercy I have not finished.
Go on then this better be good for your sake.
We will just appeal to all the pilots again, yeah we dictated the terms, to those gullible fools without a mandate,
Who cares about the Rules, I am the rules and don’t forget it
We arranged the vote and count and even though 11 bases including the biggest STN,DUB and HHN might have voted by a majority No in our "democratic" process, we think that it is “undemocratic” to stop to accept the will of all the voters.
So if you were one of the minority that voted "yes" in the 11 bases that rejected the deal come and speak to us and you can still get it anyway,
you see we don’t have a high enough percentage to take to the labour………..
Cut that out and add this “we recognise that all should have the opportunity of accepting our generous negotiated deal and maybe you accidently ticked the wrong box or something, anyhow LUNACY liars have conned you and we are back to save you again……..yes something like that should do it
Yes master,
And add this disclaimer as well
NB this generous Offer applies only to minority "yes" voters in bases that rejected,
if you were a misguided LUNACY "No" voter in one of the 5 smaller bases that voted "yes". Congratulations because you win to, in those bases we have decided to accept the democratic will and accept the majority view which will be imposed on you.
(Everyone's a winner. This time next year you'll all be millionaires. trust me)
Write the deal, crush the mutiny, write the memos, run the company.......do I have to do everything around here.
Yes oh Lord and ruler of all.
Management lackys (hary Carin, Supreme Lord of all Leo H-C) chip in with the propaganda or better still for the labour court, openly deny it, should compliment the the bagfuls of proof nicely.
Anyone for charades?
So this is how it happens.
FR announce by company Intranet (in most bases the night before) that management are presenting this years pay deal having conducted "negotiations".
"negotiations"…Ha what a joke. STN has a long standing employment relations committee (ERC) member. (supposedly independent pilot representative). other bases had none.
And so it starts
Management do a whirlwind tour with laptops and powerpoint presentations, telling you about this wonderful 4 year deal, that for all ranks bar the most senior is a considerable deterioration in terms.
Some pilots have the audacity to dare and challenge the figures and assumptions, (bloody insubordinates how dare they challenge the Almighty) Management often do not have specific answers on the information they are presenting. Some managers admit "in the main it is a pay cut" others deny it. The figures are clear if you can use a calculator.
Pilots angry at further attempts to reduce T&C's are hostile towards deal. FR try and convince anyone who is willing to negotiate on behalf of pilots in their base. FR's own rules say individual must be independent and voted for by colleagues. Forgetting for a brief minute the employment laws that govern these situations. Most bases flatly refuse to be involved in the whole charade. so bases having their base captains in overdrive trying to find anyone with a stripe and a pulse to “negotiate” (officially listen to the dictation). Some bases end up with 6 month second officers with guarantees to "help their mates get a job" if they "negotiate" on behalf of their colleagues.
No rep was voted for this year, not one and most have no idea who is supposedly "negotiating" and these invisible people only known to management have certainly never spoken to pilots to ascertain what they might want.
General concencus is an overwhelming rejection, that is if you could, you see there is no rejection option its
A/ damned if you do or
B/ Damned if you don't
So with the secret deals behind closed doors there are now apparently some (ERC) reps in some bases who nobody actually knows or have consulted.
and then
Its management tour number 2 with a slight increase on their original Dictation, thats has been "negotiated" by your ERC rep, the standard rumours start that this base is going to accept it so you better act quickly blah blah and you will all decide by a secret ballot next week.
So what does the one recognised ERC in STN do, as they once haven't consulted pilots on what they want and have been absolutely silent to this point.
They hold a meeting to recommend this deal is accepted whilst seeking union recognition. “take the deal today and then get in the unions”, Have they checked that is possible with BALPA, BALPA say not and the information is misleading.
The majority of pilots present say this is not negotiated or consulted upon and the whole process is a farce and as you are suppose to represent us we do not agree with this. So the ERC back down from “official” support and just discreetly try and push it on an individual basis around the crew room.
Then we get 3 memos from management entitled LUNACY, LUNACY, LUNACY (trying to mirror the unity, unity, unity message of REPA) saying the loonies (unions) are lying, to you a sector pay decrease for F/O's is actually a payrise, this deal would deliver so much more for all blah blah. Lying, this is hilarious ( and this coming from those whose native language is bull$hite) who do so at will and have done so on numerous occasions and whose head of personnel in a case taken against REPA last year was slammed by the judge for what he called “False and Baseless” evidence. A company who every year cut and cut and change contracts of employment at will and by memo say trust us the Unions are lying. It was gutter propaganda as FR hoped to "lock in" pilots for 4 more years of whatever they chose.
Then comes the vote, the final step in the whole charade. well not for all, many guys commute or are away from base so FR have a so called proxy system, if you live overseas and are on a day off….sorry. if you meet the very exacting requirements and you can prove a good enough reason to get a form, then you must leave your name on it and sign it, with either option
1 FR's "4 year lock in" dictation or option
2 1 year deal
Secret ballot? "If you vote NO we're going to see you"
even with all this most pilots in most bases having seen all the tricks before, the propaganda, tight deadlines, fake negotiations, the pressure, FR started rumours, FR ignoring their own rules on ERC, their voting system, not withstanding employment laws of independent representations.
The pilots only interaction in this whole thing is 1 bit of paper and a pen
They all Vote.....the company holds its breath……. And…and……… oh dear.
11 Bases reject FR's dictation and chose the 1 year offer even though FR told us how wonderful the 4 year lock in was and it was LUNACY to turn it down.
So next the memo from senior management figure, just as last year, was saying you saved the company 10 million euros by voting No, thanks speak to you all next year.
But hold on a minute, that’s a bit of boring ending to this little drama
Then the problems start to hit home, you see BALPA have started a recognition campaign in the UK which MOL himself (in DUB pilot meeting) is alleged to have admitted "is highly likely to succeed" good for the guys on UK contracts,
but what about the brothers and sisters on Irish contracts. Well they are off to the Labour court armed with stacks of proof to prove that the whole ERC process is nothing more than a cosmetic charade, that FR control completely so they can claim to be dealing directly with pilots, for which ERC members past and present will be put on the stand to support all the documentary evidence and even FR's gold plated lawyers will find hard to defend.
So the majority of pilots voted against this despite our best efforts, But you, my generals, said if we spun it this way and chucked out the LUNACY memos we would get enough to buy it what happened??
Sorry your highness I’ll think of a plan to protect your kingdom, long live the king
this won't look good in the Labour court, we need to somehow prove our misguided pilots are happy dealing directly (us dicatating to them).
Iv'e got it .............Eureeka, the mighty one might spare me.
Oh mighty Lord of All I have it
Even though we said it saved us 10 million we will put all new hires and people transferring base on it and maybe all command upgrades on it,
Thats not enough.....
er er... we could even put a banner ad on a well respected Pilot forum and "sex up" the reality of the figures or your 4 year plot to put these jumped up 18hrs a week aerosexuals back in their place.
That’s not good enough we still don’t have enough for the labour court, Off with his head
But please lord, please have mercy I have not finished.
Go on then this better be good for your sake.
We will just appeal to all the pilots again, yeah we dictated the terms, to those gullible fools without a mandate,
Who cares about the Rules, I am the rules and don’t forget it
We arranged the vote and count and even though 11 bases including the biggest STN,DUB and HHN might have voted by a majority No in our "democratic" process, we think that it is “undemocratic” to stop to accept the will of all the voters.
So if you were one of the minority that voted "yes" in the 11 bases that rejected the deal come and speak to us and you can still get it anyway,
you see we don’t have a high enough percentage to take to the labour………..
Cut that out and add this “we recognise that all should have the opportunity of accepting our generous negotiated deal and maybe you accidently ticked the wrong box or something, anyhow LUNACY liars have conned you and we are back to save you again……..yes something like that should do it
Yes master,
And add this disclaimer as well
NB this generous Offer applies only to minority "yes" voters in bases that rejected,
if you were a misguided LUNACY "No" voter in one of the 5 smaller bases that voted "yes". Congratulations because you win to, in those bases we have decided to accept the democratic will and accept the majority view which will be imposed on you.
(Everyone's a winner. This time next year you'll all be millionaires. trust me)
Write the deal, crush the mutiny, write the memos, run the company.......do I have to do everything around here.
Yes oh Lord and ruler of all.
Management lackys (hary Carin, Supreme Lord of all Leo H-C) chip in with the propaganda or better still for the labour court, openly deny it, should compliment the the bagfuls of proof nicely.
Last edited by DoOrDie; 7th Apr 2007 at 11:19.
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It`s not only at Ryanair it happens. It makes part of all people in all professions.
All the offers , or deals , or gentleman agreements suggested by the management in any company in any business are good for the f!"#$% ass writer who presented it to promote himself in detriment of the others.
They use ways that we, in this case pilots , don`t know to present a deals which seems good but that in reality it isn`t.
What pilots often forget is that the management guys are professionals the same way you are in an airplane.
Most of the problems we have nowadays in our profession came from pilots with a big ego which thought they could be pilots and managers and in this way accepted worst conditions thinking they were doing a big deal.
We all have to be aware that despite all our smartness we are not managers. The expert guys to deal at the same level with the management are at the unions .
So don`t do the historic mistake of accepting anything which comes from the management .Even more a management with the history of Ryanair.
I wish you all at Ryanair
GOOD LUCK !!!!!
All the offers , or deals , or gentleman agreements suggested by the management in any company in any business are good for the f!"#$% ass writer who presented it to promote himself in detriment of the others.
They use ways that we, in this case pilots , don`t know to present a deals which seems good but that in reality it isn`t.
What pilots often forget is that the management guys are professionals the same way you are in an airplane.
Most of the problems we have nowadays in our profession came from pilots with a big ego which thought they could be pilots and managers and in this way accepted worst conditions thinking they were doing a big deal.
We all have to be aware that despite all our smartness we are not managers. The expert guys to deal at the same level with the management are at the unions .
So don`t do the historic mistake of accepting anything which comes from the management .Even more a management with the history of Ryanair.
I wish you all at Ryanair
GOOD LUCK !!!!!