Easyjet; B737 or A319?

[The ghost]

What would be the best choice to make.

I am flying the 737 and got the offer to enter as SFO on the 737.

I also got offered to start on the A319 via the TRSS, obviously this would cost my a lot of money compared to entering directly on 737. Ģ23000 pounds over 5 years + no salary till you start flying...

Would promotion be quicker when you're on the A319 compared to the 737? I understand that as copilot 737 you cannot become captain on A319... Obviously the 737 fleet is shrinking and the 319 fleet increasing...

Would you be able to go to the Airbus after the three years on the 737...

What is the present time to command once you meet the requirements?



Thanks!

[Flying Quill]

I should join on the 737. You will have a standard contract, no loan, proper salary, and neglible bond. However, if you want to live near a particular base which is currently, or planned to be served by the Airbus then perhaps this will influence your choice.

You can always apply for a base transfer to an Airbus base, but then you will be bonded for three years. This is hardly going to be a financial penalty, though, unless you want to run off with your new rating!

I don't see why you would have to wait three years to convert since you shouldn't be bonded if you're entering with the 737 rating.

Not sure about command prospects for 737 FOs, but it's unlikely that they would be discriminated against. But, could be wrong...

FQ

[Wizofoz]

No, there is no discrimination regarding command whichever fleet you're on. Once qualified and recomended, you get offered whichever vacency comes up. Increasingly, a 737 FO will be offered an Airbus command, which will include the three year bond, though there have still been vacencies on the Boeing recently.

[The ghost]

Thanks a lot for the input!

I got the impression that as a 737 FO it was not possible to get a command on the Airbus. Of course a 737 command would be very nice as well, no doubt!

I think that a 737 direct entry as SFO is the best choice for me.

Can somebody explain to me how the holiday system works? You have 36 days, does that mean you could take let's say 3 times 3 weeks a year? Can you also take them as single days?

Any base that is best/worst for the 737? I guess best chance is to get based in Luton isn't it?

Is Ģ2700 net a month what I can expect?


Thanks again!

[Wizofoz]

ghosty,

IMHO, any base outside of London is pretty good. LPL,BRS,BFS or NCL have good route variety, -700 flying, and don't seem to work as hard as our London bretheren. EDN and GLA have mainly domestic routes and fly -300s. (One possible consideration is that the rumours have the Scottish bases changing to Airbus soon. If you are in a base that converts, there is no bond.)

As to how holidays work, well, this year they didn't!! There was an enormous c0ck-up with allocation. How it's supposed to work is that with the 5/4/5/2 pattern, you take 4 periods of 5 days off (so you get 11 days off in a row). we also have an optional exta 5 days as "Guarenteed days off" which in theory they then take back as extra work days. It is not the best system in the world, but is probably the only real down-side to the company.

Yes, that is a good estimate of income (possibly conservative during Summer).

It's not for everyone, but personally I'm very happy at EZY, and there aren't many better jobs on offer, particularly if a fairly quick upgrade is a priority.

Welcome!!

[The ghost]

Wizofoz,


thanks once more for your kind answers!

I have a few more for you...

The roster is 5/4/3/2. Is this fixed? Are all days 4 legs? How far ahead do you get your schedule? You fly 800-900 hours a year? Is everybody on the 737 flying both the Classic and the NG?

The loyalty bonus is going I understand. Is the profit sharing thing expected to bring the same kind of money?

What about a 13th month?

What about share options?

[springbok449]

I would definately join on the 73, for the same reasons as posted above.
Why get yourself tangled in the TRSS scheme when you already have a current EZY type on your license?
If the base you join turns into an Airbus base after you joined it then you will get the rating free.
No descrimination as far as commands go, I echo the comments from above...again...
Good luck

[Scottie]

The Ghost.

The roster is 5/2/5/4 - always 5 days on, 5 earlies two days off, 5 lates 4 days off.

On your fifth late you are rostered to finish before midnight. However due to delays you can work up to 0130 into your day off without getting a new one. That can happen upto six time in the year. It has happened once to me. The first early always has to start 0600 Local or later.

Days can be 2, 4 or 6 legs depending on FTL and where you are based. Scottish and BFS bases do some six sector lates. On average expect two to three six sector days on your 5 lates. FTL's don't allow six sector earlies unless they are LPL-BFS....

You will not necessarilly fly both classic and NG depends where you are based. NCL, BRS and BFS are NG bases. EDI, GLA and EMA are classic bases and LTN and LPL are NG and classic bases.

The loyalty bonus has gone for copilots. Captains still get it and unless the pilots vote to get rid of it then it will stay. Don't listen to any management bull about it going. It ain't going unless we vote to get rid of it. They would like to implement profit share but we'd only vote for it if the profit share was better than the loyalty bonus.

No 13 month, this isn't Hong Kong!

Yes you get allocated shares. I think it is once a year. Also they have just introduced "Save as you earn" and buy as you earn. Save as you earn allows you to save up to Ģ250 a month over a 3 year period. The share price has been fixed at Ģ1.81 so at the end of three years you could potentially have saved Ģ9000. Divide this by Ģ1.81 and you'll have 4972 shares. At the moment the share price is around the Ģ2.50 mark so thats a theoretical profit of 69p a share. This give a healthy Ģ3400 profit. However the share price goes up and down so don't bank on it......

I enjoy it. It ain't the best place to work but neither is it the worst.

[The ghost]

Great stuff! Keep it coming!


So as I understand it, you can get twice a year a period of 20 days off.

And there are 5 GDO days you can take, but easyJet will take them again from your free days...

I have a paper saying the annual leave entitlement is 36 days comprising 20 working days, 8 weekend days and 8 days in lieu of public holidays.

Did this change with the 5/4/5/2 ?

[Flying Quill]

Mmm, interesting, young Sir - if indeed you are a Sir.

You can apply for 4 blocks of 5 days leave. After these has been allocated you can apply for an additional 5 days leave called 'guaranteed days off'. You must take them as a block of 5 days and they will be recovered from your normal pattern. In other words, you will get your roster for a particular month and find that one week you are working 6 days instead of 5. There will be 5 such suprises until these RDOs are recovered. So, you only really get 20 days leave which you can book and call your own.

FQ

[orangetree]

If you have an EZY type on your licence and an ATPL, you should join as an SFO (non trss) regardless of whether or not you go on the Airbus. If this is still the case then go for Airbus. Its a much, much nicer day out and probably what you'll get your command on anyway. Or, go to NCL on the 73 and you'll get a free bus in a few months. I would doubt that Scotland will see buses for a fair while. BFS could do with them too, based on pax loads and performance on international routes but it's not on the horizon.

[Scottie]

Also by going TRSS you'll be on a reduced salary, it's about a Ģ5k pay cut. This reduced TRSS salary applies whilst a Captain as well. So go 737!

Nobody knows where the Airbus will go next, I'd heard the Scottish bases were next but then who knows?!

[Slim20]

LPL,BRS,BFS or NCL have good route variety, -700 flying, and don't seem to work as hard as our London bretheren

I'd like to see that one backed up with hard facts! 90 hours / 50 sectors a month speak for themselves. Pretty daft claim from a part-timer.

ghost - please note that

1) The loyalty bonus is history as of October, regardless of what Scottie/Balpa members say. New entrants are already being told at interview that it is the case. The profit sharing scheme at its best (EZY exceeding projected profit by >Ģ50m) will net the average pilot just Ģ1000 annually. Compare that with the loss of 5% of salary annually and you get the picture.

2) Leave is 4 blocks of 5 on paper, but in reality at a lot of bases you will not get the 5 extra days as a block. In this case, it then defaults to just 3 days to be taken individually, and you have to work them back.

3) The TRSS is the poisoned chalice. Pay for your training, work at reduced salary and be bonded for 5 yrs. Fail the course at any point and you walk away with nothing except a massive loan repayment.

I urge you (if you do join), take the 737. Avoid the TRSS, you will get an airbus command anyway, if not in UK then certainly in Europe. But go into this with your eyes open - they want you to join at least cost to EZY with no regard for your wishes or circumstances. Take the best deal you can get now or you'll regret it later.

[Scottie]

1) The loyalty bonus is history as of October, regardless of what Scottie/Balpa members say. New entrants are already being told at interview that it is the case. The profit sharing scheme at its best (EZY exceeding projected profit by >Ģ50m) will net the average pilot just Ģ1000 annually. Compare that with the loss of 5% of salary annually and you get the picture.

So just how are they going to get rid of it slim20? It's part of out T&C and can only be voted away by us.

[Slim20]

Scottie don't be naive! You don't think we'll get a vote on the loyalty bonus itself? Look at the pattern over the last 4 years. Every major lifestyle change has been voted through because it formed part of a trade-off package of T&C's. (5/2/5/4 for loss of leave, crew food for reduced pay rise and reduced sector pay, over-60s rights for loss of F/O loyalty bonus, need I go on?)

I bet the loyalty bonus will be voted out by the members because it will be tied in with an attractive pay rise and/or a proper leave offer to replace the GDOs option. Most of our esteemed colleagues will find it hard to say no, especially as the CC will no doubt find many compelling reasons to accept the offer.

The company always gets what it wants - and right now it wants rid of the loyalty bonus. Bye-bye!

[Scottie]

Slim20, I see where you're coming from. I hope you're proved wrong in the nicest possible way of course

Maybe this could be the straw that breaks the camels back?

We need more members. Anyway this is thread creep - oops.

[The ghost]

So no TRSS then for me. Thatīs very clear!

The vacation thing is a bit disappointing. Meaning if you donīt get a 5 day block you are left with a good week of instead of 11 days!

So according to some the loyalty bonus is there to stay. Others say itīs gone, and again others say itīs going. According to the info I have from the 1st of October 2005 it will be replaced by a profit sharing scheme as agreed between easyJet and BALPA...

Going easy would mean i will lose some nice T&CīS including a 13th month and 6 weeks holiday a year. On the other hand I will gain a chance of a relatively quick promotion on a nice aircraft!


So what about the roster. Is it realy fixed 5-4-5-2? How far ahead do you get it? Any standby or available?

Anybody an idea on where itīs most likely to start as a direct entry fo on 737?


Highly appreciated everybody!

[Khaosai]

Hi, if joining easyjet now with over 6000 hrs on boeing jets as F/O, can someone give me an approximate time to command. Rgds.

[Wizofoz]

According to the info I have from the 1st of October 2005 it will be replaced by a profit sharing scheme as agreed between easyJet and BALPA...

Hi ghosty,

There has been no agreement. Part of our last negotiations was that we would replace the loyalty bonus with a profit sharing scheme IF it could be negotiated and agreed by the majority vote. If we can not reach an agreement (and to the best of my knowledge there has been very little negotiation on it) or do not vote it in, the bonus stays.

As Slim 20 says, if an attractive enough deal is offered, it may be voted on. What I don't understand is his tone that somehow, if we agree to a deal that is more attractive than the bonus, it is to our dissadvantage.

Khaosia,

Do well in your checks, and I would say within 12 months.

[Flying Quill]

Roster pattern is rock solid outside your twice-yearly 'reserve period'. This is the new 3 week standby period that goes with the equally new 5/2,5/4 roster pattern. Everyone knows when their reserve period falls.

Rosters are published by the 17th of each month and emailed to your company email account (accessible from home). Rosters have been produced on time every month for almost two years - or at least that's the general claim. It's true in my case, anyway. Stability is determined by your base. My base enjoys almost 100% stability, others do not.

You could still see a standby out side your reserve periods. We also have 'contactables' which could be changed to a duty in advance. But once you've checked out the day before they essentially become days off since the company has to give at least 10 hours notice prior to a duty. This is not always the case though, but nearly always. 'Contactables' are given when there are surplus pilots (for whatever reason) and rostering wish to safeguard your duty hours.

It's not as bad it often sounds here on this website, though alot depends on your base.

FQ