Concorde question
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There were 22 airframes built, even if only 20 of them flew.
There was one in Toulouse, used for static (structural) tests, and vibration tests, and suchlike, and the one at Farnborough, used for heat and stress cycling.
Neither of them survived. It seems a few sections of '0001' still exist somewhere at Toulouse, and a few sections of '0002' are still on display at the Brooklands (UK) museum.
I have no idea whether either actually had space models of the engines in place, or simply representative ballast weights.
CJ
(I made up the '0001' and '0002' designations.... maybe somebody here can still remember what those 'static' airframes were referred to formally at the time?).
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London Science Museum
I was recently able - for the first time in about twenty-five years - to visit the London Science Museum. Not only which, I was able to spend the whole day, on my own, with no children dragging me along. 
As always, the Aviation Gallery occupied a lot of my time there, but I was quite surprised that there is very little about 'our lady', when I should have thought she was sufficiently 'white heat of the technological revolution' to qualify for a whole display to herself?
Going on from remarks about tracing the number of 593s still around, there is one there. Right at the back corner of the Aviation Gallery, on a yellow trolley and next to an RB211. Very little explanation to it and none whatsoever of the astonishing intake/engine/thrust bucket combination.
The only other Concorde exhibit, that I could find, was a beautiful 'cut away' model, standing on a mirror. The model was so detailed and interesting, I took a photograph of it, as I did of the 593, but I find my "PPRuNe Posting Rule" do not allow me to post attachments.
Is it not slightly surprising that there is not more about Concorde there? After all, I was able to revisit an 'old friend' of mine - the original EMIScanner MkI CT scanner from Atkinson Morley's Hospital - that I used to look after back in the day.
Roger.
As always, the Aviation Gallery occupied a lot of my time there, but I was quite surprised that there is very little about 'our lady', when I should have thought she was sufficiently 'white heat of the technological revolution' to qualify for a whole display to herself?Going on from remarks about tracing the number of 593s still around, there is one there. Right at the back corner of the Aviation Gallery, on a yellow trolley and next to an RB211. Very little explanation to it and none whatsoever of the astonishing intake/engine/thrust bucket combination.
The only other Concorde exhibit, that I could find, was a beautiful 'cut away' model, standing on a mirror. The model was so detailed and interesting, I took a photograph of it, as I did of the 593, but I find my "PPRuNe Posting Rule" do not allow me to post attachments.
Is it not slightly surprising that there is not more about Concorde there? After all, I was able to revisit an 'old friend' of mine - the original EMIScanner MkI CT scanner from Atkinson Morley's Hospital - that I used to look after back in the day.
Roger.
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Roger,
Slightly O/T, but one does wonder about the Science Museum.
I've been a few times, many years ago....
They had a fascinating exhibit about radar, including its early history (and after all a lot of radar technology was invented in the UK). Then, about the last time I went, I found the entire historical exhibit had simply disappeared.
So, I expect the measly Concorde exhibit you saw will soon disappear too.....
Re your photos, download them to a site such as "photobucket",then post the links. PM me if that doesn't work.
CJ
Slightly O/T, but one does wonder about the Science Museum.
I've been a few times, many years ago....
They had a fascinating exhibit about radar, including its early history (and after all a lot of radar technology was invented in the UK). Then, about the last time I went, I found the entire historical exhibit had simply disappeared.
So, I expect the measly Concorde exhibit you saw will soon disappear too.....
Re your photos, download them to a site such as "photobucket",then post the links. PM me if that doesn't work.
CJ
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Tough crowd....
The Science Museum's primary Concorde display is at the FAA Museum, with 002 and the ogive winged Fairy Delta...
At South Ken the collection is thematically displayed, with Concorde items in a number of galleries; there is a nose cone in the materials gallery, wind tunnel development models in the milestone galleries, next to the Apollo capsule, and the Shorts SC1, plus computer units in the computer gallery and so forth.
Not ideal however quite well done in view of the way that collection is done.
The Science Museum's primary Concorde display is at the FAA Museum, with 002 and the ogive winged Fairy Delta...
At South Ken the collection is thematically displayed, with Concorde items in a number of galleries; there is a nose cone in the materials gallery, wind tunnel development models in the milestone galleries, next to the Apollo capsule, and the Shorts SC1, plus computer units in the computer gallery and so forth.
Not ideal however quite well done in view of the way that collection is done.
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C,
No worries, plenty of very good museums between you and South Ken...
Agreed SC1 has no relevance.. nor does Apollo.. the idea was to illustrate that the Concorde display runs thro' several thematic areas in the museum, often next to seemingly unrelated artefacts.
No worries, plenty of very good museums between you and South Ken...
Agreed SC1 has no relevance.. nor does Apollo.. the idea was to illustrate that the Concorde display runs thro' several thematic areas in the museum, often next to seemingly unrelated artefacts.
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mfaff,
Point taken.
In a way, Apollo is relevant.... At the time, there were two "prestige" programs to be on : Concorde and Apollo. I've been lucky, I was part of one of those !
CJ
Point taken.
In a way, Apollo is relevant.... At the time, there were two "prestige" programs to be on : Concorde and Apollo. I've been lucky, I was part of one of those !
CJ
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Shaggy,
I doubt South Ken would want to get rid of their 593 (BTW, I'm still curious where that one came from, and what model it is).
I thought Alpha Charlie arrived with all its four engines....
Without wanting to go into the current squabbles, couldn't the museum drop one of the engines for display? They're pretty well invisible from the outside, so taking one out (and replacing it with a couple of plywood panels inside the nacelle, to avoid the horrible hollow-tooth effect we saw on Alpha-Delta in NY), would not do any damage to the display, but it would add another attraction to the museum.
CJ
I doubt South Ken would want to get rid of their 593 (BTW, I'm still curious where that one came from, and what model it is).
I thought Alpha Charlie arrived with all its four engines....
Without wanting to go into the current squabbles, couldn't the museum drop one of the engines for display? They're pretty well invisible from the outside, so taking one out (and replacing it with a couple of plywood panels inside the nacelle, to avoid the horrible hollow-tooth effect we saw on Alpha-Delta in NY), would not do any damage to the display, but it would add another attraction to the museum.
CJ
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That brings a question to mind. Under service conditions, how long would it have taken to remove and replace an engine, and how often would it have been done? Also, would the same engines have stayed with each airframe, or would they have "circulated" around the fleet?
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CJ - AC does indeed have all 4 engines in place and complete. I wouldn't want to drop an engine as that would make her an incomplete aeroplane, and actually you can clearly see the compressors deep inside the intakes during tours, which is nice. She'd look odd with one intake blanked off.
Ideally I'd like a sectioned 593 on display, as there's not a lot to see on the outside of a turbojet engine except the ancilliaries - and you can see those by opening the engine bay doors.
Ideally I'd like a sectioned 593 on display, as there's not a lot to see on the outside of a turbojet engine except the ancilliaries - and you can see those by opening the engine bay doors.
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That brings a question to mind. Under service conditions, how long would it have taken to remove and replace an engine, and how often would it have been done? Also, would the same engines have stayed with each airframe, or would they have "circulated" around the fleet?
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Why are the log book and other records being sold separately?
When you buy an aircraft or component, the records form an integrated part or the item is effectively worthless.
I think the price is somewhat over inflated as there is no operational use for this. If the seller takes some zeros off the end there might be some interest.
Maybe someone looking for an engine for a land speed record attempt might be interested but no museum would stump up this much.
Just my thoughts.
When you buy an aircraft or component, the records form an integrated part or the item is effectively worthless.
I think the price is somewhat over inflated as there is no operational use for this. If the seller takes some zeros off the end there might be some interest.
Maybe someone looking for an engine for a land speed record attempt might be interested but no museum would stump up this much.
Just my thoughts.
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That brings a question to mind. Under service conditions, how long would it have taken to remove and replace an engine, and how often would it have been done?
Also, would the same engines have stayed with each airframe, or would they have "circulated" around the fleet?
A more practical issue was that the engines were "handed", so that if a "left-handed" engine failed and you had only "right-handed" engines in stock, you had a problem.....
There is a nice interesting chapter in the Olympus 593 manual on how to convert a "left-handed" engine into a "right-handed" one (it mostly involved moving auxiliaries and other connections from one side to the other), but it was work, and took time. More time than a 'simple' engine change .....
CJ
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Olympus, anyone?
eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace
eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace
So either no monetary value (museum exhibit) or a few hundred pounds (scrap). Minus a few hundred pounds to transport it to the scrapyard!
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Does anybody still have notes about how much the Olympuses at Dovebid went for at the time?
Shaggy, I doubt anybody would buy it to "use" it. I would bet that surplus military engines of the same kind of thrust rating could be had much cheaper. Not to mention that parts, ancillaries, etc., would be far easier to procure....
CJ
Shaggy, I doubt anybody would buy it to "use" it. I would bet that surplus military engines of the same kind of thrust rating could be had much cheaper. Not to mention that parts, ancillaries, etc., would be far easier to procure....
CJ