US rules about after landing taxing in undeclared hijacking conditions

[DA50driver]

Taxi in with flaps extended

It has something to do with Miami, not much snow to worry about there usually.

[kansasw]

Originally Posted by Double Zero

Whatever you guys do, asking in public, let alone discussing it, must be one of the dumbest things I've seen !

DZ

Disagree. ......

[Astrocaryum vulgare]

have a look at the FAA-AIM before flying to the USA.

OK, many of us fly to many, many nations around the world, I can't possibly think it's practical to look at every nation's legislation.

Silly Americans!

[con-pilot]

Originally Posted by Astrocaryum vulgare

OK, many of us fly to many, many nations around the world, I can't possibly think it's practical to look at every nation's legislation.

Silly Americans!

Well old buddy I may be a Silly American, however, when one is in the non-airline environment, as I in corporate aviation, you better bloody well believe that I check the rules and regulations of every country I fly to or may have to fly into on any extended trip.

Now back to the subject at hand.

When I was with the United States Marshal Service flying Boeing 727s most ATC folks knew who we were and who we had as passengers. One day we had problems extending the flaps for landing and I decided to leave the flaps down after landing so maintenance could inspect the flaps and find out what the caused the problem.

We had taxied about half way back to the ramp when the local controller asked us if "operations are normal". It took a second for the meaning of that statement to hit me and we replied yes and thanked them for asking.

So, back eight, nine years ago it worked. Don't know about today.

[bomarc]

SECURITY ALERT SECURITY ALERT SECURITY ALERT:

I went to the FAA website to give all you guys the quoted info so you would know...the AIM is no longer on the website! Perhaps there were too many goodies in there. top secret goodies?

AS pilots we know what responsibility is. For those of you who can quote the AIM from years gone by, you know all about things pertaining to unlawful interference.

You know the secret code words, numbers, flaps, and even how to order a mai tai in latin ;-)...some of you even know which way to fly your triangular pattern for loss of all radio or just loss of transmitter: super big ;-)

To those younger guys and non US pilots, I guess you will have to just stop by the control tower some day and ask.

While nothing is wrong with talking about such things, the fact that the FAA has the website down is a bit disturbing...I just used it about 4 months ago (easier than typing from my personal printed copy).


so, let us ask the moderator to remove this thread and place it in a long term holding pattern for Idylwild Airport or Orchard Field. also a big ;-)


you old guys who know...good on you.

DANNY BOY, zap this thread!~

[Henry VIII]

Thank you all for the quick replay.
Tks to bomarc for the AIM suggestion. I found it here, but tonight I have no time to perform a deep search, will see in the next days.

Any other suggestion(s) are welcome.

To all other colleagues who wondered considering the winter ops environment (such as snow, ice, etc.), in my thought I presumed the management of those situations are deeply acquired by everybody. Sorry for that.

Originally Posted by I-FORD

Henry VIII,
it should be written in your RM (in mine it is).
On the other hand you can always follow the suggestions above (from bomarc), have a look at the FAA-AIM before flying to the USA.

Honestly I read about the 3d topic in your company RM, which is for me an unofficial docs.
It is not present in mine and for these reason I am looking for official source(s) to propose to my company an eventual additional note explaining the situation.

Ciao

HVIII

[Henry VIII]

The only reference I found on AIM is :

Chapter 6. Emergency Procedure

Section 3. Distress and Urgency Procedure

6-3-4. Special Emergency (Air Piracy)

This is the link

No evidence about the mentioned procedure.

Regards
HVIII

[bomarc]

dear henry VIII

I too checked the latest AIM and you are quite right...the reference to the mentioned procedure is no longer there.

I assure you that at one time it was listed in the AIM along with some other things of interest to an air piracy.

I plan to call my local FAA rep and ask him what happened.

There are other ways to get this information out to the transport pilot and perhaps those methods are being used.

interesting food for thought



j

[Tree]

Originally Posted by Henry VIII

Hi all,
read somewhere in unofficial docs that taxing to the gate after landing in US airport with slats/flaps extended is codified as a request to police action following hijacking.
I searched the FAA website with no result.
Can anybody clarify me if it is true or not and, if yes, show reference to official docs/website ?
Tks in advance
HVIII

The old rule was that the signal was actioned by police only in the case of an "ongoing" hijacking. "Ongoing" meaning ATC etc. already know of your situation before you land.

For normal ops do whatever you like with your flaps and there is no requirement to notify anyone (other than possibly your maintenance people!)

I am glad the rule is gone; there was so much urban myth and misunderstanding. My company SOP was recently incorrect and up here we often leave the flaps extended during slush/snow ops.

[West Coast]

"I can't possibly think it's practical to look at every nation's legislation"

Why not? Too good to I guess Do you think its ok for YOU to fly to another country and not observe its regulations.

[Consol]

Understand it means you require immediate armed intervention only after a situation has developed and the authorities are aware of it, the flaps down indicates a sudden deterioration hence need help now. (They will then send out a jobsworth to find out where the pilot hid his yogurt/toothpaste/ham sandwich and whether they are in the correct sized plastic bag). Sorry, couldn't resist it.

[Ignition Override]

Double Zero.

Well-spoken.

The amateurs (or 300-hour "wonders") have revealed themselves, again.

[misd-agin]

Why would anyone talk about any security related stuff on the net? If you have a need, and right, to know you can find the information from a qualified source.

[smith]

and have indeed heard controlers asking 'confirm ops normal' to guys a little slow on the after landings

If you got a guy in a balaclava with a gun at your temple ready to unload it, you probably are going to affirm ops are normal, if you say negative I think even the dimmest terrorist will realise his secret mission has just been rumbled.