U.S. Pilots
 

U.S. pilots are the best in the world by far. We build the best aircraft both civilian and military. It is the way that all countries other than the U.S. grade the level of pilot skill that everyone simply doesn't understand. The U.S.A. promotes aviation, encourages it in every way and even has over 20 Universities across the nation teaching aeronautics. Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University being the best on the planet.
All countries other than the U.S. makes thier tests hard to make sure a large number of candidates fail. Its the way they weed out most of the people. Your governments do not want aviation to grow in there country. Hard tests on the ground do nothing for you in the air.

Whoever took my last message off about this subject cannot handle the truth because of where they were trained. See ya.

Flyle -

You need to study up for a drug test!

While American pilots are fairly good, there is no way that the average American pilot can touch the expertise of either British or Japanese pilots.

I'm a proud American, but there is no way I'd consider trying for the Canadian or British ATP. Their standards are not a matter of refresher training or local knowledge; they want that much more professional knowledge and skill from their pilots.

If you can find the data, check the number of airlines in the U.S. who issue FAA regulations to their pilots. I suspect it's rarely done and you can be certain that an extremely small percentage of pilots buy their own or download them from the Internet.

No regulations - no professionalism - sorry.

I don't mean to knock Americans, but if you get into the 'profits first; safety last' practices of the FAA, there is no other conclusion available.

Grow up dude!

Wind up. YAAAAAWWWWWWNNNNN......


:rolleyes:

Yes mate, we know, we know, the sun shines out of your @rse, heard it all before .....see ja in JB.....

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It is said that GOD doesn't subtract from ones' time on earth, those hours spent flying.

SKYDRIFTER,

You seem a little too anti-American to call yourself one. ;-)

I was just wondering why you view American pilots a being less skilled or knowledgable than Japanese or British pilots. Considering airline pilots, with all the automation, how would an ANA or BA crew pilot a 777 diffrently than an AA or UAL crew. In my opinion there would be no difference at all.

On the matter of professional knowledge, why do you discredit the aeronautical universities in the U.S.; especially schools like Embry-Riddle. These universities offer 4 year degrees for professional pilots that cover, in great depth, the subject of aviation. I admit, and this is strictly speaking from what I have heard, that the JAA ATPL written is difficult. However, most people on this site talk of completing the the 14 writtens in 6 months. It may be possible that people can cover 4 years of material in six months, but what is a persons retention of that material if it was covered in such a short period of time.

The FAA writtens are pretty pathetic, but in the U.S. you have absolutely no chance of being hired without a four year degree; whereas in Europe (again, this is from what I hear) airlines don't require college degrees. The trend in the U.S. nowadays is you either have an aviaton related degree or you're from the military. With all this, I really do not see how U.S. pilots are less skilled in anyway. I don't mean to start an argument, I'am just responding to all the anti-U.S. comments I see on this site. Any comments are welcome, especially from you SKYDRIFTER. :-)


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[This message has been edited by AACapt (edited 23 March 2001).]

[This message has been edited by AACapt (edited 23 March 2001).]

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Think the average American pilot has more experience than their European counterparts. Euro pilots tend to know more about the theory (required by the exams). Don't know which one is better but maybe a combination of the two could be a good start.

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If you can't save the engine...save the airframe :)

[This message has been edited by AMEX (edited 24 March 2001).]

Americans have one thing on the rest of us and that is the size of their ego's.

R soles the lot of em.

[This message has been edited by Blake (edited 24 March 2001).]

flyle
One of the most dangerous traits in a pilot is arrogance.

Nature is no respecter of inflated egos or overconfidence, and Murphy positively delights in bringing them down to earth.

Reflect on that before we get into an "I'm better than you" debate here.

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It'll never fly.

Hey flyle,
As you have done, I am going to make some outrageous generalisations here.

Guess what, your 4 year degree is not even the equivalent of a European 2 year degree. Heck, outside the Ivy League, all you have to do to graduate, is show up .

Education has little to do with pilot skills as is shown by the accident statistics for Doctors and Lawyers in general aviation.

The minimum standards are set by the FAA, or JAA, or whoever, but then it is up to the pilot or his employer to improve on that.

The achieved, or in service, standards of piloting vary greatly within all jurisdictions and your generalisations highlight your limited exposure.

There are brilliant and cr*p pilots in all countries, which are you?

I like American pilots , their antics in UK airspace have kept me amused for over 25 years.

1...Inability to listen out.

2...Always querying the route

3...Amusing variations on fix/ reporting points eg Saint Rumble (Strumble)

4...Not understanding plain English (it`s them with the accent, not me)

I could go on (which is another thing they do)

From our side of it - the Americans can fly the planes no problem, no better or no worse than any other international airline, however there seems to be a 'slight' language barrier. It may work state side, but definately not here. We have the ICAO recognised standard which we do veer from SLIGHTLY, but the Americans don't seem to have any knowledge of it what so ever. However I can see its the same for the Brits flying in America. Reflecting on that, some Brits flying the 'larger' a/c over here seem to have very similar problems!

Basically, in your own ways, your all as BAD as each other, but then again, we're not perfect either. http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/tongue.gif

Look at the number of post - this is someone who has registred just to provoke :rolleyes:

But it's quite amusing. My contribution to the fun, is to say that no one flies better than the Brits - they can do it half asleep or even drunk :)

Tor, you are absolutely right, they do seem to do that rather well.

I wonder if this isn't some cheap advertising by Embry-Riddle?

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rgds Rat

In my short career as a pilot I have seen things which back up both sides of the argument. I'm a Brit and I learnt to fly in the States, and then instructed out there. I was asked to check out a guy (to fly a light twin) who had this 4 year degree from Embry Riddle and he did not have a clue about flying or the way the aircraft worked.
On the other side, in the states when learning multi engine there is a huge emphasis on understanding the various factors of Vmc. When I went to Oxford to convert to a CAA licence there was not a single mention of this in the ground school or even when flying the aircraft.
With this in mind I don't think it is fair to generalise those from either side of the Pond.

FLYLE,

Before you start boasting your academic achievements in the colonies, first start by getting your grammar right. English is not my native language, but even I can see from your posting that you didn`t read aeronautics at any decent university anywhere. And that`s just from your short posting.
Amusing, though.

Tell me, what on earth is an "Aeronautical University" actually for?

Here in the UK we can turn a high school graduate into a PHD in Nuclear Physics (or Aeronautical Design & Engineering)in 4 yrs, and a dumb ATPL pilot at Oxford or Perth in just 11 months. What the hell do they do for all that time at these places?

Just curious.

;)

I have a UK and a US ATPL and so I know what I am talking about!

I have completed the training in the US as well as in England for an ATPL licence / license.

I spent 3 years in America and I passed every single exam first time, from PPL thru to ATPL, whether it was a ground exam or flight exam.
In the UK, I failed most of my exams first time round.
This shows the level of difficulty and the standards required by each country.

Most people would think that the flying remains the same where ever you train.
I can tell you from experience that even flight training in the UK is more stringent than in the US.
As for the knowledge required, the UK ATPL demands much more knowledge that you can imagine. This could possibly prepare the pilot for any contingencies.

For e.g. : A PPL pilot got lost. An Airline Pilot started to question him about his position with regards to the sun and the ocean. Eventually, the airline pilot fixed his position and relayed the info to the rescue team. The PPL pilot was found. The Airline Pilot had utilised some of the knowledge which we learn in the UK ATPL Navs. I would imagine that 98% of American Pilots wouldn't have a clue with regards to cosmic navigation.

All areas of flying and studying including ETA's, R/T Procedures, Rules and Regulations are far more stringent in the UK than the US. This makes for a harder life but it also makes for a thoroughly well prepared Pilot. [The Creme de la Creme - The Bees Knees - The Dogs Bo!!ocks!].

Having said that, since there are less restrictions in the US, flying is more fun and relaxed.

Now the choice is up to the individual - Would u rather be relaxed or would u rather be well prepared?

I leave it up to you.

So the tests are harder in the UK and from seeing all the advertising for pilots there seems to be a shortage of qualified/experienced applicants. I can understand how one leads to the other but why is the pay so low in the UK? That’s not a slam. It just doesn’t make sense to me. If it’s so hard and there’s a shortage I would assume the market rate for your services would be higher. What am I missing here?

JetHeat - I hear your quals and I'll raise you five:

Ex-RAF, ex-USAF exchange, ex-UK regional, Ex-Cathay, now US major. OK?

What a load of tripe this thread is; it should be hermetically sealed. Unless you've flown for both's militaries and both's major carriers you really have no clue on what you're talking about when it comes to professionalism comparisons.

There are good and bad for both systems. I guarantee that most US pilots would struggle through the JAA exams ( and wonder about their relevance ). I am also absolutely certain that most BA or Cathay folks would find a US Major Airline type oral and checkride a shock ( and just as demanding ).

The US just doesn't put as many obstacles in the way of obtaining your licenses - the major's examine your knowledge at the interview board several years down the road. No 200 hr pilots in the biggies here.

And yes, I've cringed at my fellow Brits sounding lost and mis-pronouncing places over here, and also cluttering the radios with precise dictation. You can tell straight away the long-timers in BA - they blend in seamlessly at JFK/ORD/LAX or where-ever. Then again, that's my point. If you've spent all your time in a different system, you're bound to sound a little hesitant in another if you visit it only occasionally. With the rapid movement going on at the US carriers the overseas experience level is being diluted as many intl FO's are moving to domestic Capt. But I will say that the some of the best "polers" I've seen are over here - I think it's because they get more chance to hand-fly due to more visual days.
Endless Cat III's into LHR don't help your handling skills.

And as for the wind-up merchant who started this thread: grow up. Post your experiences of the rest of the world, so that we can all judge your background.