Oxymoron? Hmm.

I can't help remembering how the 380 project was pooh-poohed on here as soon as it surfaced, and that much of the ridicule came - and continues to do so - from UK posters. Now she's begun taxiing tests the tide almost seems to be turning to patriotic support.

Personally I hope the A380 is a huge success, that the project does make a profit and that it creates a new paradigm in commercial aviation, bringing in more passengers and more jobs. However, I wouldn't forget that it's a colossal gamble, with a large part of the stake put up by taxpayers who had no choice in the matter. It had damn well better work.

If it doesn't, well, shades of Concorde.

Direct link:
http://www.m6.fr/content/video/info/..._02_150405.asx
or mms://stream1.m6.fr.ipercast.net/m6.fr/6minutes/d/31/d050415190000SARAV3100002.wmv
Cut/Past and open it in media player if clicking doesn't work.

Thanks for the link nyt; great to see it moving courtesy of those 4 massive RRs :D

Are they trying to imply that Boeing is not receiving any government monies and is a private venture without any corporate welfare ?
Any company that big only exists at the pleasure of the various governments and financial support is only a small part of a companies viability.

How many airports the A380 is planned to operate to have Cat3 already? Surely virtually all of them? We're not talking about a regional jet here.

Errrrr.... Once companies get that big, they ARE the government

No, we're not talking about a RJ. We are talking though, about every possible alternate, both destination and en route.

puff,
very informative post. You know that it is overweight by 20 tonnes? Who told you?
And you also know it's underperforming when it hasn't even flown yet?
Please spare us any further cr*p like this.

Completely agree with you El lute...
To many wannabee's here on this forum that comment on stuff they don't even have a slightest clue what they're talking about.
Sad but true.....

Whoops, got the can opener out again - yum, these worms look great!

Sorry guys and gals - I heard this ugly rumour from a chap whose airline has ordered the A380 and it's just the crew-room talk .. and it does say rumours and news!

El lute - perfect summation.

unwise

surely the autoland stipulation is to discourage handflying where autoland is available? If 380 was to be banned from non-autoland airports I think the matter would have arisen well before now.

It is sadly unromantic that beancounters don't like handflying but it is up to training and sim time to maintain currency so the statistically safer option is retained for passenger operation.

3Greens

Check your PM

I sent you a PM last week

Been watching the network to see whether the rumour would emerge....

Looks like there's something in what puf m'call says....

Just caught a conversation with an engineer who say's the figure is closer to 30 tonnes and first flight is delayed until June.

Apparently, they've weighed it - but I can't believe it's that much overweight as it would be an absolute disaster and complete oversight for the project.

Anyone else got anything on this?

Ah.

Yes, because if the first flight had been delayed until June....

....they would of course be hurtling up and down TLS' runways at ever higher speeds on a daily basis....for the next 6 weeks?

Doubt it.

pff m'call

hear the one about the dog that bit the hand that fed it?

Kuningen, this is nothing to do with the British press. They are doing their job - reporting the contents of a US report on the A380.

The fact that it's biased against Airbus is nothing to do with the Times. The journalist didn't write the study - it is an American-backed analysis as is clearly stated in the opening paragraph.

Beside, the Times went to Airbus for a response - that's called balanced reporting.

The report's authors are all identified in the article, and a bit of Googling will give you their contact details. If you don't like the Americans' conclusions, take it up with them and please stop shooting the messenger.

Konkordski,

Perhaps Airbus were slow to react - but what would you have them do - respond to something they hadn't read? Even the Seattle press manage a more balanced perspective:

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/busine..._airbus18.html

The messenger isn't worth the bullet.

I'm not a commercial pilot or wannabee, however I'm sure that those who are and happen to be Muslim are really impressed with that comment.

As an aside I hope the A380 proves successful both in performance and commercial viability.

A380, no rudder?
 

Heard from a taxi-driver of Toloose, A380 will not have a rudder. Instead it will have two FEYCS (Fully electronical Yaw Control System) which will receive Yaw data from the IRS and command the outermost spoilers and the FADECS for asymmetric thrust to counteract for Yaw.

Regards

Hmmm saw a photo in flight, and it did look rudder-less.

(or perhaps the rudder was hard over to one side and therefor behind the main body of the fin?).

Never heard of FEYCS before... Can anyone shed any light on this?

Perhaps its time to change my name!

Er, a search on the Airliner website still have pictures of it having a rudder. The only plane I know that don't have a rudder is the B2 and but I don't exactly know how that thing manages to yaw.

Well I've got a big piccie on my desktop taken from about the 5 o'clock position showing an RTO test (with the two engine reverses open) and the beast looks as if it's got a rudder to me.

There are definate lines in the vertical tail at the location a rudder would hinge...

The picture is http://www.airliners.net/open.file/817619/L/

My Toulouse mole says planned first flight for 0800Z this morning (18th) was postponed due to low cloud base.

No rudder.....bull****.

Heres a pic
www.airliners.net/open.file/744760/M

Thanks guys...

It did sound a bit fantastical. Perhaps I should have looked at airliners.net before taking the word of a parisian taxi driver!

As for my name ... it shall remain now i'm convinced it can land in a crosswind!

:-)

Lol..is that you 747focal?

if not another boeing as*h*l* :=

The rudder is built in Spain in Puerto Real and transported to Stade in Germany to be joined to the rest of the vertical tailplane. Built from CFRP, it comprises an upper and a lower rudder. The upper rudder is 12 metres long, more than half a metre wide and weighs 350 kg/ 771 lb. The lower rudder is around seven metres long, almost one metre wide and weighs more than 250 kg/551 lbs.

dreamingA380,

Maybe a bus driver would be a better source ;)

Just kidding, it is B/S, the rudder is made in spain, and mated to the rest of the vertical stab in Germany.

:ok:

There was never -ever in aviation history more false rumours floating arround then currently ,associated with the first flights of A380.
Any project of this size obviously calls for problems and un-predicable last minute hick-ups.But I would love to see a fraction of these negative gossip associated with the 7E7 dreamliner project.
Not that I am against Boeing or particularly pro -Airbus. But as most people crowding aviation forums ,we are supposed to be aviation freaks and supportive of any major development in civil aviation.Some threads are so full of hate or non-aviation related B.S. that I wonder why people take time to participate in forums.
The A380 has probabely it's fair share of issues -shall it be weight,cost-overrun or infrastructure related issues with airports refusing to accomodate the plane - but it still is a massive job-creator not only for europeans but also for americans. 30-40% of any A380 value is manufactured in the USA !
I do look forward to see the A 380 and the Dreamliner take off successfully ....

Making money,will it fly?
 

Good old Boeing!

A bit like the presedential ellections lets rubbish the competion!

I seem to remeber they said all these things about the Jumbo when it was first conceived!

how long has it been flying?

Mind you I beleive the guys have had a tough time landing the beast on the simulator!

:\

Now come on! a taxidriver? Does he think he knows because it is doing taxi tests? :rolleyes:
Or because he overheard a conversation in his taxi? (in French ofcourse) :rolleyes:

Smells a litle of a wind-up...............:rolleyes:

Jodiekeyz, Nope was not me....... and for your info, I don't work for Boeing. :confused:

FEYCS - would that be pronounced "fakes"? That taxi ride wasn't on April 1st was it?

One must question why the report was not published in 2002 at the time it was completed.

First flight has now been postponed until next week due to poor weather.

Slightly off topic, but this image should explain how it yaw's. Look at the ailerons...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...rit.750pix.jpg

weather in Toulouse is not looking to bad, no clouds, no fog at the time of posting.
(You can continuously check in this automatically updated picture)
http://www.dfd.dlr.de/ftp/put/wetter...nce/image1.jpg

On the B2 the control surfaces at the wing tips are not just the ailerons, they are the split rudders whic work to increase the drag of that wing to yaw the plane...hence the deflection both above and below the wing..

They may also work as ailerons I'm not certain they do tho...

Aren't those flaperons on the B2?

Faced with the above, and the blizzard of other garbage it is accused of, I can understand Airbus' reticence to comment and fight all this unsubstantiated rubbish! Better to rise above it all and let the aeroplane prove itself! It is more economical than anything else, and the B747, great though it is cannot be flogged on another 40 years. Hail the new Queen of the Air!