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Geez guys why don’t you take a look at how they treated the last expat pilots they’ve employed!!!! doesnt anyone EVER learn?!!!! |
Blunder Bus - With regard to SQ you A). Don't know what you are talking about and B). Know nothing of the inherent ramifications of an expat contract versus a Local contract. It is you who apparently doesn't learn.
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I was there in the early 1990s when there were a large number of Expat F/Os on expat contracts. Not on the seniority list so no command AT ALL. given very early the word that "NOT NEEDED, NOT WANTED".
Many fled, some converted to local conditions and on the "list" from that date, a few stayed until the end of their contract, BUT were not guaranteed the chance to go "local", not many stayed the time. Some of those who stayed have done well, senior management in some cases. You need to ADJUST to the way of SIA, i did time on the L-31 and the A-310, minor differences at times, good overall flying, fun training on both fleets, some of my trainees are up in Management which after 15-20 years so they should be. It is not where you have come from, it can be where you are mostly happy, big shiny jets, generally acceptable then and i believe now as well. |
Email in early November from HR Fill out 3 forms- licence & flying experience, pilot addendum, final interview CV summary. When asked about sending salary terms and conditions for my viewing, was informed that it’s confidential information and will be supplied if successful. ( how do you know your really interested ?) Flight and accomodation given for two nights but only on request to HR. Flight was non upgradeable Economy. Ground transport from airport to hotel is via a free shuttle from the airport ground transport desk. Hotel is the Grand Mercure Roxy, and breakfast is not included with your room. There is a mall and supermarket across the road. Late checkout is available till 1400 for no additional charge. ( depends on your Sim session time if successful in your interview in Day 1) Day 1 Take a taxi for $15 each way to SIA training centre for 1130 on upper Changi road. At the gate you will swap your ID or passport for a security pass then ask for directions to Lobby C level 1 and wait. You may meet other cadets, DESO or DEFO. You will then be called as a group for a document check. Licence, medical, logbook, educational certificates, birth certificate, passport copy, recommendations from current/ last company. Also to provide a visual acuity test as class one medical will not suffice. All originals With Copies. Then you will be given the training bond form to view, tick and sign.... BEWARE for cadet and DESO expats ( non Singaporean) It’s 7 years and 200,000 Sing $ DEFO bond is 3 years expat or not and S$150000. Then your numbered by application, so DEFO first then DESO, then cadets. DESO’s & cadets are required to write an essay with a minimum of 50 words as to why they want to join SIA. DEFO’s will not do this. You are then required to sit in the hallway on a chair, and wait to be called by the panel. The panel consisted of four men. We were told beforehand that three are management pilots and one is ground training. They do not introduce themselves by name or their position but one takes the lead. As I was DEFO They did not ask me anything technical or anything else ATPL related. No CRM or tell us about a time when ....... Very contrary to what I thought it would be. They asked questions about me and my flying experience. Being hired on local terms and conditions for permanent contract. (Of which were not provided.)This is especially for those with families (wives & children) They are not shy and will tell you there is no housing, schooling or any other expat allowances. Although normal state schools are very good. Even on day one of employment standing at the airport with your bags, you will be finding your own accommodation. There is no accomodation assistance such as hotel or company housing to ease you into living here. Why join SIA ? Have you been to Singapore before? What do you know about cost of living here? What do you know about time to command here ? What are your thoughts about that ? Why leave your current airline ? They may ask you to join on 737 with Silk now that they’re part of the group, but the question may be designed to illicit a response. Depends if you like Boeing or are willing to take whatever opportunity that gets you into SIA. In recent view of the Lion Air incident and Air France 447, what would you have done differently ? The Interview finished after 20 mins, with some closing questions for them. They say you will be notified via email by 10am the following day to proceed to the sim centre at the same location ( SIA training centre) at roughly 1330 the very same day. I was emailed three hours later. DEFO Basic entry level salary monthly is $6000 Sing, this is before tax of which you pay and sort out at the end of the year. Time from induction to final line check is between 4 to 6 months as mentioned in the interview. If you fly max hours, you will earn $8500 per month before tax. BE AWARE of what your left with after taking into account personal, tax related, accomodation, and transportation costs etc. Day 2 The sim is 777, and you will meet with HR, who will take you upstairs to meet one instructor and he will brief you on the sim assessment. Everything is raw data. Depart via SID. Then HDG then direct to a position. ( LOFT) Some wx then deviation required. After deviation engine surge which then continued to become inextinguishable engine fire. Decision making exercise. Land via raw data ILS. No autopilot or auto throttle. You will be notified to attend the medical on Friday( it’s always on Friday) Rescheduling flights and hotel will be taken care of. Day 3 The CAA Medical is free for DESO, they pay online and have it reimbursed at the clinic. DEFO will pay $236 sing , it’s NOT REIMBURSED.. They’ll let you know in time. |
$8500?? USD or Sing dollars?...if in Sing..think its wrong mate. Not that low..well maybe
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Must be desperate to accept this, a good case of big shiny jet syndrome . Thanks for the info anyway.
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6000SGD basic with only 2500SGD allowance is kinda pathetic to be honest
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Unless one is really desperate for jet time, or has nowhere to go, the TnC's for DEFO seem pretty poor considering Singapore is one of the most expensive cities in the world. Plenty of better options around financially for expats from the looks of what has been posted above. Even the interview panel know this fact as posted above, and they even had the cheek to ask the candidate how will he cope. Smacks of true arrogance! I guess their cabin service is impeccable but when it comes to renumeration, it has a long way to go!
FK |
It will be about between 10-11k SGD for an FO.
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My buddy is in management at Scoot. He is taking home $45,000 SGD a month. SIA can pay way more.
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Originally Posted by mach92
(Post 10324960)
My buddy is in management at Scoot. He is taking home $45,000 SGD a month. SIA can pay way more.
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FK---pilots managers aren't a dumb bunch... All the terms and conditions are HR driven(the TnCs are really pathertic), the the pilot managers know very well that there really is no way anybody can up root to restart life in SIN with that salary. The hope is that they go thru the process and hope nobody comes.... airplanes get parked and go uncrewed... then and only then can they say HR screwed up and Flight Ops dictate the terms and conditions
Mach92_think you are wrong.... that scoot management FO does not earn 45000 sgd/month.... too little... he gets 145000 sgd/month... please check with him again...he only flies 10hrs/months and has 2 hard office days a week..... tuff gig... not paying the poor FO enuff |
Dont forget you are dealing in a area where losing face is not a option, so a long wait before change in contracts. If HR is controlling the T&C of pilots, expect a escape goat if planes get grounded, HR will not be responsible..
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Any news on this? They wrote me for video interview but considering the conditions vs life price there.. DEFO.
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Dear All,
Was also contacted for a video interview. Any details about this first step ? DEFO Merovingio The same ... I do have a good position right now and have a family. Should I make this jump ? wlshwzd What was the outcome of all this ? Was surprised to read that not even one technical question was asked. Yet I do really appreciate all your inputs ! thx ! |
Originally Posted by evanra
(Post 10382152)
Dear All,
Was also contacted for a video interview. Any details about this first step ? DEFO Merovingio The same ... I do have a good position right now and have a family. Should I make this jump ? wlshwzd What was the outcome of all this ? Was surprised to read that not even one technical question was asked. Yet I do really appreciate all your inputs ! thx ! |
Originally Posted by evanra
(Post 10382152)
Dear All,
Was also contacted for a video interview. Any details about this first step ? DEFO Merovingio The same ... I do have a good position right now and have a family. Should I make this jump ? wlshwzd What was the outcome of all this ? Was surprised to read that not even one technical question was asked. Yet I do really appreciate all your inputs ! thx ! |
JetJockey - SCAPEGOAT, not ESCAPE GOAT ...a scapegoat is an animal which is ritually burdened with the sins of others, then driven away. The concept first appears in Leviticus (Bible), in which a goat is designated to be cast into the desert to carry away the sins of the community.
Good luck with SQ :cool: As mentioned above, they booted out all expats previously and they'll do it again. Happy landings:ok: |
they booted out all expats previously ---yes they did... all the guys on expat contracts were not renewed nor continued--- but they did help them get jobs
As for the foreign pilots(non Singaporean) pilots on local terms---- we are still here duly employed on local terms--some even in management.... so now what is it... expats or foreign? It is however really a captain airline... if you are coming as DEFO and you are single.... pretty good long term gig.... Assessment for command is 5 years for check out productive date...and yes it is written in black and white |
I wish I had this chance when I was 25! Really good long term career in a fantastic city. Yes, it is not the expat contracts of 25 years ago, exactly like anywhere else in the world, but you get to fly the best iron in a super professional environment. |
Can someone please confirm the approximate pay per month after deductions for DEFO new joiners?
A few have mentioned circa S$11500 after deductions, which doesn't seem too bad. But someone else (recently interviewed) mentioned S$8500 (maximum) before deductions, which is very different! Also that the bond is an eye watering S$150,000. Surely this information is mistaken or a typo...? If not, is the huge difference because the guys getting circa S$11500 net are actually on older (and much much better) contracts?. Confused |
You don't actually have to pay the SIA bond unless you want to leave before the bonded period, (for non rated about 5 years), is up, then you pay pro rata depending on how much of your bonded period is left.
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Any clarity on this?
Originally Posted by HHChan
(Post 10317235)
$8500?? USD or Sing dollars?...if in Sing..think its wrong mate. Not that low..well maybe
Any clarity on this? If it’s SGD then that means it’s as low as some local contracts in South East Asia. |
Originally Posted by newpielot
(Post 10393227)
Any clarity on this? If it’s SGD then that means it’s as low as some local contracts in South East Asia. I think that is your basic monthly pay without your flying allowance, on 75hrs above your take home will be approximately 12k or there abouts. Correct me if I am wrong. |
Originally Posted by Stilllearning1234
(Post 10394279)
I think that is your basic monthly pay without your flying allowance, on 75hrs above your take home will be approximately 12k or there abouts. Correct me if I am wrong. Thanks for the response. |
Originally Posted by parabellum
(Post 10391253)
You don't actually have to pay the SIA bond unless you want to leave before the bonded period, (for non rated about 5 years), is up, then you pay pro rata depending on how much of your bonded period is left.
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FO basic if I'm not wrong is 6200 Sgd a mth. 30-40 sgd/hr and other variable allowances, 13 mth and yearly bonus. So ur mthly take home will vary.
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Really hiding lots of info.
So,as i had a call from them,and asked to give a 45 minute Skype interview.
pretty standart and relaxed,but they dint tell any details at all,like mmmmm you gonna make approximately 7000USD,that is it,they ask,general questions based on your CV,nothing tricky,except you dont know **** abut terms and conditions for this job. They said it is most likely 737 r 747-400,so they are looking drivers for Scoot and cargo,so no fancy routes as i had in my fantasy world After the interview they said they want to bring me to Singapore for an assessment,BUT!!!!only ticked and accommodation provided,there additionally you have to pay for the medical check and some exams,air law and ops,around 700USD~!!!!!!!!!!!! i dont know guys,what is it all about,i will try to ask more info,but they said no everything gonna be okay. |
Originally Posted by Yevgeiy.Ka
(Post 10398180)
So,as i had a call from them,and asked to give a 45 minute Skype interview.
pretty standart and relaxed,but they dint tell any details at all,like mmmmm you gonna make approximately 7000USD,that is it,they ask,general questions based on your CV,nothing tricky,except you dont know **** abut terms and conditions for this job. They said it is most likely 737 r 747-400,so they are looking drivers for Scoot and cargo,so no fancy routes as i had in my fantasy world After the interview they said they want to bring me to Singapore for an assessment,BUT!!!!only ticked and accommodation provided,there additionally you have to pay for the medical check and some exams,air law and ops,around 700USD~!!!!!!!!!!!! i dont know guys,what is it all about,i will try to ask more info,but they said no everything gonna be okay. It depends on what you’re willing to take. Would you regret doing it or regret it more that you didn’t? Will they reimburse your 700USD if you get the job? |
No, you only have to pay them if you break the bond and leave early, there are no monthly deductions from salary, you do not pay for your rating, just complete your bonded period, that is all.
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Originally Posted by parabellum
(Post 10398992)
No, you only have to pay them if you break the bond and leave early, there are no monthly deductions from salary, you do not pay for your rating, just complete your bonded period, that is all.
I guess you worked for them during the glory years as a DEC and were well treated. What the above posters are mentioning is the cost of the interview and subsequent medical to join is from their own pocket. Just another job which is reeking of the low cost disease which is griping this industry. What you say though about bonds and leaving is apparently correct and verified by my sources their as well. Cheers, FK |
Originally Posted by fighterkok
(Post 10399086)
ParaB,
I guess you worked for them during the glory years as a DEC and were well treated. What the above posters are mentioning is the cost of the interview and subsequent medical to join is from their own pocket. Just another job which is reeking of the low cost disease which is griping this industry. What you say though about bonds and leaving is apparently correct and verified by my sources their as well. Cheers, FK Im guessing its a local contract with no help in terms of housing in the short term? |
Hello fighterkok. Correct, I was a DEC way back. In case it gives you any comfort we had to pay costs related to the interview and medical as well, all medical fees, food and accommodation etc. We did get a non upgradeable Economy ticket on SIA to get there and back from the interview, from the nearest airport that SIA had a scheduled service to, not necessarily your home airport. I found them very good to work for but there is no such thing as a free lunch! :)
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Hi!
Is there anyone that has more info about the DESO entry besides the info from their website regarding the selection process, contracts etc? |
Upgrades...?
Originally Posted by HHChan
(Post 10256189)
No more 5yrs yes..but where is this 13-15 yrs for DEFO? Its not written on stones yet. The 13-15 yrs are meant for those who start from day one cadets. There is a queue but nothing is firmed on how many years yet. Maybe shorter...
Varying reports on upgrades. Does SIA upgrade foreigners, and how long is the wait for a DEFO? |
Originally Posted by Big Neil
(Post 10391246)
Can someone please confirm the approximate pay per month after deductions for DEFO new joiners?
A few have mentioned circa S$11500 after deductions, which doesn't seem too bad. But someone else (recently interviewed) mentioned S$8500 (maximum) before deductions, which is very different! Also that the bond is an eye watering S$150,000. Surely this information is mistaken or a typo...? If not, is the huge difference because the guys getting circa S$11500 net are actually on older (and much much better) contracts?. Confused |
Hi,
Just for info, did they ask you anything about ATPL theory or anything similar? |
Hi guys does anyone know anything about the DESO interview and the recruitment process? I’m from malaysia and got an interview with them in KL so I would like to know any insight abt it Thanks |
Originally Posted by mcchow
(Post 10444826)
Hi guys does anyone know anything about the DESO interview and the recruitment process? I’m from malaysia and got an interview with them in KL so I would like to know any insight abt it Thanks |
for the fact no one has really replied on this topic, it seems its not ideal to come to Singapore airlines...there are better offers out there
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