The state of (the) Philippine(s) aviation
 

There's this guy who applied for his Student Pilot's License at the ATO (or CAA or whatever it's called) and was told his license will be ready in 21 days.

The next guy comes and was given the license the same day.

The difference?

A couple of thousand bucks!

:=

Looks like it will take a real massive overhaul to rid the Philippines of corruption...and the prez isn't helping at all...

curious
 

was this couple of thousand bucks from first hand information or hearsay?

owh come on....it's the land of Pinoys...what d u expect?

Oh, yes of course. This is indeed FIRSTHAND info....
And the worse thing is...the first guy is a foreigner...who didn't know how it works here...well, that time...but not anymore...so word gets around...not only in the Philippines...you know how aviation is a small world...

Not really a good image we project to the outside world...

ATO. CAAP. same people, new name... what do you expect? :ugh:

Is there a Guy involved who´s name is Steve Snelson or Scott Michaels by any chance? Just wonder where the Wonderer is now....

Fly safe and land happy

NG

The Philippine regulator is a joke. Bribes are normal, otherwise you just won't get anything done. I'll be surprised if they ever get out of the FAA cat 2!

just wonderin' what you guys, the pilots, can say about the atc service being provided by ato. you always mention in here the corrupt system by the ato (the safety division to be exact) but what about the air traffic division. i heard that with the upcoming caap, things will be better... service-wise. there are still many highly capable controllers left in there and if you, the customers, would only intervene they can provide you with even better service. they've asked for new equipment and advanced technology countless times but nothing new has arrived. maybe you can ask for them. you have the say; afterall, you're paying for the service.

sad to say, sabit din daw ang safety division sa caap. i just dont know how can they improve if they continue to be under the same umbrella as those guys.

my 2 cents worth.

pare

I'm not sure if it infringes on safety, but most MNL ATC controllers are heard to have a "P-F" deficiency.

repapips
 

i totally agree with you. i've been an atc for a period of time now and i still miss on my p & f sometimes. but i never had safety issues. besides, even other atc's have their own problem. the arabs pronounce p as b; the indians pronounce v as w. even the aussies and the kiwis, they pronounce a as i. bottomline here is that every atc in manila is at least level 4 in english.
going back to the topic, the state of philippine aviation, speaking on an atc point-of-view, something is needed to be done asap. last news i heard is that caap is not seen until next year. a lot of controllers are seeing it as the answer but if they continue to delay it, more and more are expected to leave. soon, there wont be enough personnel to man the sectors. this would mean more delayed flights. and don't blame the atc's, they are humans with limitations. we cannot compromise safety.
speaking of safety, we are working our arse off while this division is busy making money. and they even have the guts to include themselves to be part of the authority (caap)!!:D

Even some pilots have P-F deficiencies! With the present state of equipment they have i think the ATC are doing a good job..... although even they say it can be improved.:)

pare
 

You're right pare. (Almost)Everyone has his own particular deficiency.
Sorry if I hit some strings there, no offense meant. It was just an observation and implied with the hope of seeing an improvement in the future.

I just couldn't help it when the other guy asks, "What did he say? Did he just call that traffic, Gulp Air One Payb Por?"

I mean it wasn't a slip. It was his standard way of saying it. Well at least for that particular guy.

Again, this is not an insult but an invitation for improvement.

Cheers!

thats punny
 

sorry fellows..it took myself several readings before i understood and caught on to what this subject was about (p and f). :)

so instead of "park at gate 14..it would be fark at gate 14?"

"roger and good day"

point taken repapips and there's definitely room for improvement. i may have an idea who this person is.
urgood: just to give you a heads-up on what kind of equipment they are using; manila area control still uses the 20-something year-old radar connected to a french system; manila approach's equipment is from japan; clark has an italian system while subic still uses the american one. as a result, there's no automatic interfacing because of the different softwares. in other parts of the world, starting from the most remote tower up to the main trunk, they are using only one system so everything is automated.
more than 50% of the traffic are gps & rnav capable and yet they still need to navigate thru various points. just imagine the fuel and time you can save when, after reporting over the manila-hongkong boundary, you've been cleared to track direct to 10 miles final for the approach. controllers can always do this but because the radar is unreliable they opt not to. and dont get me started with the frequencies. controller ability na lang talaga ang nagdadala. they really need upgrading in there.
where is the government spending those revenues? the airlines are not getting the services they deserve.

pare most line pilots in the philippines are usually venting out their frustration with the state of our atc and traffic handling. comparison with international standards cannot be avoided. thanks for giving us an insight of how prehistoric our equipments are. my guess is still corruption and red tape? or government just doesn't care. im sure you guys are in a high stressed situation most of the time, just wanted to commend our atc for a hard job well done....

Yes indeed pare

Bravo to our Air Traffic Controllers!!! :D
With all these outdated & insynchronizable equipment, they're the last line of defense.
I guess that's where the priority should go. To equipment upgrade.

Well if GMA gets her wish and Clark becomes the gateway airport there is alot that needs to be done. Dont think they will be able to run the approach control freq out of the tower forever.

you can also add the ground control to the workload of the Clark tower.

Kudos to the ATC for doing a good job inspite of their old equipment. :ok:

Thanks
 

the ATCs thank you for your sentiments.
KAchicas: im sure we're no different from our foreign counterparts. they have sophisticated equipment and far more advanced system that make them sound good and really confident. plus they are motivated. when it comes to skills, we are equally able as they are. i say this coz i've seen it. albeit, i think we are better because we continue to work eventhough we don't know if we're gonna get paid or not (unpaid claims/overtime dating back to 2 years).
becoming an authority (privatization is better) was good news at the beginning but nothing has changed so far. it is evident that they are just using this to get out of the faa cat 2.

pare
 

What does "becoming an authority" mean?
You mean there are people unpaid for 2 years there? I didn't realize this could happen in a government entity.

ato becoming caap (civil aviation AUTHORITY of the philippines).
with ato, the collected revenues go straight to the national treasury. the government gives back to ato a fraction of it as their annual budget. this budget is used for employee salaries, airport and navaids maintenance, personnel training, etc. the budget is really small and it doesn't make ends meet.
you might ask, why go on overtime when it is not being paid? well, if they dont do it, shifts will be under compliment. as a result, radar sectors are combined; towers will be working a single position instead of 2 or 3. this means delays and limited operations for all flights.
with caap, the authority will be in-charge of the revenues.

Ok, so with an authority, they keep their revenues and sees fit what to do with it? Without submitting the same to the national treasury as opposed to being ATO?

Hmmmm...so that's good then. Better than before?

Thanks for the enlightenment pare.

mapi mushkula habibi.
as i said, pangalan lang ang nagbago. they keep on delaying everything. people are still leaving, most of them to the ME.

Pare,

I read in the local press that the politicos in Davao are using the recent sad loss of the PAF C 130 as a tool for getting 'radar' at Davao.

What's your take on this?

That is good news for the ATCs and also to the pilots but bad news for the government...gastos yan eh.
Although it could have not prevented the accident, but (Davao ATC) having radar could have issued a much earlier alerting service and notification of search-and-rescue. when you see a target on radar suddenly disappears, you initiate something. without radar, ATCs cannot see the aircraft and will rely only on pilots' reports.
Its a sad fact that the government will only act on something only when accidents happen and lives are lost. :(

Yup!

Too late the hero...
Well, better late than later! hahaha

2 months to add C-152 rating
 

I remember when I was trying to add a C-152 rating in my SPL.

I asked the guy at the counter and he gave my SPL to a clerk. Then the clerk said.. "Bwisit mga estudyante na yan.. Sabihin mo.. 2 buwan balikan!!!"

Tsk tsk.. Poor Philippine Aviation.

Checking RP pilots: ‘Comedy of errors’
 

An amateur driver appraising the chops of a veteran chauffeur, or perhaps a weekend rower rating the skills of a ship captain.
When the country’s fliers unwind, talk is rife about the “comedy of errors” that is the country’s pilot inspection and licensing system, one that the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) found flawed along with other air safety requirements the country flunked during an American audit last year.
“Imagine, a helicopter pilot checking a (Boeing) 747 pilot?” said an aviation insider privy to pilot check practices by government flight inspectors.
“All the flying experience they have is ‘bunk’ flying. They fly in their dreams,” another sky veteran said before breaking into laughter.
Nine months since falling into Category 2 under FAA’s two-grade safety rating scale, seven of eight check pilots of the Civil Aviation Authority of the Philippines (CAAP) failed the very same test they were supposed to administer, aviation sources told the Inquirer in interviews last month.
Pressed to win an FAA upgrade following a presidential directive, the CAAP sent eight longtime officials to Korea and Hong Kong in July for certification using Airbus widebody simulators, sources privy to the compliance process told the Inquirer.
The FAA had found in its audit that the government check pilots—those tasked to assess the skills of already qualified airline fliers—lacked simulation training and thus questioned their qualifications to conduct the pilot inspection.
The International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) requires check pilots to have 5,000 flying hours as pilot-in-command of civilian or military aircraft, roughly 10 years worth of flight as captain. They must also know how to fly the type of aircraft to be used in a particular check ride and be familiar with the flight route they are inspecting.
The CAAP’s check pilots are, however, mostly rated to fly light planes and helicopters, not today’s jets of high-tech avionics, the sources said. In their view, no more than weekend pilots of single-engine propeller planes checked the skills of airline-certified pilots of wide bodies and jumbo jets.
“They are pilots of light planes or washouts of the Air Force who couldn’t make the grade in airlines,” the source said, adding that the government could not attract qualified pilots into its plantilla as it offered much lower pay than commercial service.
Odd man out
Documents obtained by the Philippine Daily Inquirer showed that one of the check pilots had zero skill in flying the Airbus A-340, a single-aisle widebody used in long-range flights.
The proficiency test report graded the check pilots’ skills in preflight procedure, takeoff and approach, in-flight skills (climbing, cruising and navigation) and emergency procedures.
“Candidate was not ready for the evaluation check. Maneuvers and procedures below standard,” said the longtime airline pilot who assessed the CAAP check pilot.
Another flunker succeeded only in the preflight steps; the simulated takeoff, climb, approach and emergency flight procedure were all problematic.
The odd one out, the check pilot who passed, was given a “standard” or passing rate during the Airbus A-320 simulation. His checker however noted, among other shortcomings, his “unstabilized approach.”
‘They got personal’
CAAP Deputy Director General Daniel Dimagiba, the official in charge of the agency at the time of the downgrade, confirmed that seven of eight check pilots indeed failed their July test rides.
“We admit that of the eight, there were seven check pilots who were not qualified. But there were some who were given a hard time by the pilots who checked them ... These airline pilots got back at them because of their experience when our check pilots assessed them,” Dimagiba said.
While the tests heavily depended on rig-proof simulators, Dimagiba said the checkers “got personal” with CAAP check pilots.
Dimagiba, however, conceded that the CAAP’s check pilots were proficient only in flying single-engines and propeller planes.
CAAP Director General Ruben Ciron had different figures. Ciron told the Inquirer that 12 check pilots underwent retraining and seven passed their tests.
“The rest (five others) are in various phases of retraining,” Ciron said.
“We have also recruited five widebody Airbus and Boeing check pilots who don’t need anymore training, just recurrency. And more of them have signified [their intention] to join us because of increased pay under a corporate entity, [that is the] CAAP.”
Retired pilots aboard
Dimagiba called this “Plan B,” the CAAP’s way of reaching the standards, for lack of qualified personnel.
He said retired airline pilots, aged 55 to 60 with around “10,000 flying hours of experience,” had come aboard the agency as check pilots “who will make the FAA type-rating.”
With the virtual lack of check pilots, airline check pilots have been deputized to do the job for the CAAP, Dimagiba said.
“For instance, the Boeing 747 pilot of this airline will check the pilot of the same airline graduating from a widebody to a jumbo jet. That is allowed until the CAAP meets the rating,” Dimagiba said in an interview in September.
But doesn’t that defeat the purpose of check and balance? Dimagiba answered: “No, because airlines have very strict policies in checking their pilots. They can’t cheat.”
The ICAO Philippine consultancy project also noted the CAAP’s below-par pilot check system in a document laying down its recommendations for the upgrade of CAAP’s Flight Standards Inspectorate Service (FSIS), the office concerned with pilot inspection and licensing.
“The current standards for ‘check pilot’ in ATO (the former Air Transportation Office, which is now the CAAP) do not comply with the minimum qualifications and experience required to be hired for a position as a flight operations inspector for small or large aircraft,” ICAO flight safety consultant James Hooker said in a document dated April 8 of this year.
Light planes to jumbos
Hooker noted that the CAAP lacked the means for its check pilots to graduate from flying light planes to jumbo jets, as required by the ICAO.
“There is no reasonable method available where a ‘general aviation inspector’ could gain the experience needed to move from ‘little aircraft’ to the large turbo jet aircraft,” Hooker said.
In an apparent reference to the CAAP’s roster of pilot inspectors, Hooker said that “a check pilot holding only a commercial pilot license cannot perform a certification function on an airline transport pilot license holder for a proficiency check.”
The document also noted the questionable aircraft type ratings—the qualification to fly particular types of planes—of the CAAP’s check pilots that FAA inspectors found during its audit.
The US auditors were given presentations showing that the then ATO’s check pilots “had ‘type ratings’ in several or many aircraft,” according to Hooker.
But he said: “These type ratings could not be supported by an examination of the records of the FAA that resulted in [its] comments concerning a lack of technically qualified personnel.”
Hooker added: “These ‘type ratings’ were based on a false belief that one only had to have computer-based instruction to become ‘type rated’. Nothing could be further from the truth.”

What if I say that it's not only CAAP, it's the case with Philippine government. It took me 6 months to receive my special study permit and SPL. even I still don't have the SPL, but hoping to receive it next week.
And what's the reputation of Philippines aviation on international base, so what other countries think about Phil. aviation? I mean apart from US/FAA.

Comedy of Errors; read that one last October, Philippine Daily Inquirer. There was even a part 2, about the dilemma of our tower controllers.

10 months after being CAAP, what has changed so far? Virtually NOTHING!!!

Salary is still an issue and will not be resolved anytime soon. The poor technical personnel (controllers, technicians and communicators) are still poor. The reason, safety division is asking for a whopping 0.5 million annual allowance (allowance pa lang yan). Some of them aren't even check pilots and yet demanding flying pay of 500k. Yes, those nice, friendly and efficient people behind the desk who you ask about your license will be earning big money :D

To think, the main reason of changing from ATO to CAAP is to upgrade the technical services.

'Wanderer' Steve Snelson Found !
 

I've found this dubious and deceitful character....who wants to know?:D

CAAP??
 

the hell with RP-ATO even if they changed their names they're still the same corrupt people there..

I am personally ashamed of what they are doing.. as usual "pera pa rin ang importante sa kanila" (money is whats important to them)

corruption as always is rampant there .. i think the only person you cant bribe there are the security guards.

I even thought.. and I doubt that 80% would pass if they were to be audited by an international body..

I do have a license from them. but I'm proud to say that I didn't pay anybody to obtain it. even the interview for me to get my license were 2 days. and the inspector on the other side of the table even told me and I quote "you should just give him 500 pesos and that's it."

come on!!!:mad:

KAKAPAL NG MGA MUKHA....

Sub.! are you sure you didn't pay. Because I wonder how you got it then?

Regulations.
 

Can you advise me where I can obtain a copy of the current RP regulations, or do they use FAA rules?
Thanks.

Emergency Locator Transmitters
 

Can anyone advise if it is mandatory for light aircraft operating with Philippines airspace to carry an impact or self activated Emergency Locator Transmitter.
I note that two aircraft are currently missing; a BN2 and a Bell 412.

Another recent device that would/could assist in determing a downed aircraft position is the SPOT Satellite Transmitter. At some $200, a great buy for one's safety.

"Wanderer" Steve Snelsen
 

If you REALLY found him...

The FBI wants to know where he is, for one.

'Wanderer' Steve Snelson's Location
 

Have the Bureau Lead on this case against Stephen Melvin Snelson contact me and soon....Snelsons' days are numbered.

Missing BN 2
 

I saw the other Chemtrad BN 2 at Tuguegarao airport RP-C27

I flew the Cyclone Air BN-2 - also based at Tuguegarao, and was quite impressed with their Moving MAP GPS, and was feeling safe, when we flew into clouds and the pilot approached the Batanes Runway with precision.

I wonder if the Chemtrad plane had the same fit.

BTW, the BN 2 is a tight fit for 8 pax, and not sure if they did carry any ELTs, and weight and balance is critical for such a small aircraft

Bit wierd that the missing 412 also disappeared in the north Luzon area.

Let's pray for the good news.

Glad to know this thread is still alive.

Sharpie, the Philippine aviation is governed by ICAO documents, SARPs (Standard and Recommended Practices), Annexes, etc. We are a member of ICAO as most countries are. They do auditing on us but it's the FAA's audit that stir the top execs. They are always concern on what Uncle Sam have to say which is ironic coz I don't remember if we ever pass their audits and yet there is no improvement being done. No wait- they changed the name nga pala from ATO to CAAP.

Furthermore Mr Sharpie, I assume you want to fly your light aircraft VFR, low-level and outside controlled airspace. But if you plan to fly IFR in controlled airspace it is mandatory to have a radio on board, required navigational equipment, an operable transponder and TCAS (ACAS). ELT, like GPS, may not be required but for your own benefit, it would be best to have one.

Pare
 

No longer flying. Did enough of that for 30 + years in Papua New Guinea to last me a life-time. Just interested in the Local regs etc and will track down same on the net.

With two recent aircraft missing(one found) I wondered if more modern technology would/could help in early detection of downed aircraft. Someting better than a ELT.

What comes to mind is a Satellite Tracking Device coupled to a GPS which can be used on light aircraft and cost around us$200. plus a yearly fee. I believe that the unit is manually activated but should be impact activated for better results where there are no survivors or ocupants too injured.

The Unit is used to track yacht positions during ocean races and seems to work very well.

have a look at SPOT SATELLITE MESSENGER :: HOME PAGE

Cheers.