Korean Air Expat Contract
Join Date: Dec 2000
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Capt Chambo thankyou for that info, much appreciated.
I have been asked to pay for my type rating for the B777. I have a command on the B757/767, and looking at starting as a DEC. Just want to as, is this a usual process of the employer asking for the payment of the rating, and if so how does the company want this payment made? what are the options for payment plan if any? and finally how much is it?
Thankyou
I have been asked to pay for my type rating for the B777. I have a command on the B757/767, and looking at starting as a DEC. Just want to as, is this a usual process of the employer asking for the payment of the rating, and if so how does the company want this payment made? what are the options for payment plan if any? and finally how much is it?
Thankyou
Join Date: Aug 2002
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hi 987
what is it the <If you have not signed the "5-year-no-other-agent" with Richworthless,> could you explain .i could come for A330 in november the sim test will be on the the same type rating what you apply for a position?
regards
SV4l
what is it the <If you have not signed the "5-year-no-other-agent" with Richworthless,> could you explain .i could come for A330 in november the sim test will be on the the same type rating what you apply for a position?
regards
SV4l
TCPILOT.
The way this works is as follows...... you actually work for your agency who in turn contract you out to KAL. KAL want a qualified B777 Captain. They will interview you and assess you in a B777 simulator. If they think you are up to the job then they will offer you a position (via your agency) subject to you getting the B777 on your licence. It's now up to you to go away and get a B777 type rating, and when you have it KAL will employ you. I don't know how much it will cost you as it will depend where you do it. Also you may well find that you run into problems with CASA trying to put a type on your licence that is not on the Australian register yet! It may prove quicker and easier, but not necessarily cheaper, to do an FAA ATPL at the same time and putting the rating on that licence. Perhaps someone who has already done it might leap in here, and answer the question for you.
The only financial commitment you will have to KAL is that if you leave within your first year they require you to pay back a training bond of $15000 (IIRC). This covers the cost of your induction course, simulator, licence issue, uniform and manuals etc.
You may want to give some thought to the following.
Your sim. assessment will be done in a B777, you cannot assume that they are giving you any allowance for never having flown the 777 before. The sim. ride forms a large part of the whole selection process, so if you underperform they may not be interested in the fact that you haven't flown the 777 before.
If you do join up you will only get 8 sectors (with a possible 4 more extension) to show that you can fly a B777, that you can fly using the KAL SOP's, that you can operate competently to a number of destination, and in airspace that may be new to you! No pressure just remember that you have left your B767 command and shelled out c$20K for this job!
The way this works is as follows...... you actually work for your agency who in turn contract you out to KAL. KAL want a qualified B777 Captain. They will interview you and assess you in a B777 simulator. If they think you are up to the job then they will offer you a position (via your agency) subject to you getting the B777 on your licence. It's now up to you to go away and get a B777 type rating, and when you have it KAL will employ you. I don't know how much it will cost you as it will depend where you do it. Also you may well find that you run into problems with CASA trying to put a type on your licence that is not on the Australian register yet! It may prove quicker and easier, but not necessarily cheaper, to do an FAA ATPL at the same time and putting the rating on that licence. Perhaps someone who has already done it might leap in here, and answer the question for you.
The only financial commitment you will have to KAL is that if you leave within your first year they require you to pay back a training bond of $15000 (IIRC). This covers the cost of your induction course, simulator, licence issue, uniform and manuals etc.
You may want to give some thought to the following.
Your sim. assessment will be done in a B777, you cannot assume that they are giving you any allowance for never having flown the 777 before. The sim. ride forms a large part of the whole selection process, so if you underperform they may not be interested in the fact that you haven't flown the 777 before.
If you do join up you will only get 8 sectors (with a possible 4 more extension) to show that you can fly a B777, that you can fly using the KAL SOP's, that you can operate competently to a number of destination, and in airspace that may be new to you! No pressure just remember that you have left your B767 command and shelled out c$20K for this job!
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Georgia (formerly Seoul, Korea)
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Asiana Airlines (Seoul, Korea)
Beware of Asiana and hiring agency contracts:
Could not start a new thread titled Asiana Airlines, so tagged on here -
Asiana Airlines has been overly aggressive at docking pay for missed flights due to illness (no sick leave) or transportation problems after vacations – including docking the already scheduled successive and intervening days off. Put another way, they not only deduct for the lost flight time, but deduct the scheduled days off after the missed flight until the next flight flown. Contractual issues have been a problem with both Asiana and the airline service agencies. 6 Positive Space tickets on the Asiana system were part of the contract, but it turned out to be space available unless expat employees could compete with ALL Asiana employees on up to two seats per airplane a year in advance for reservations. That proved impossible, especially with flying schedules that often were unilaterally made and changed by Asiana. Parc Aviation and World Airline Services agencies have talked about resolving such issues, but nothing has ever been done.
From January 2006 until July 2007 I was an Asiana B-777 foreign Captain based in Seoul. Asiana improperly terminated my contract 7 months before I was to turn age 60, and incorrectly attributed the termination for a cured medical condition even though I was declared ready to return to work from a granted medical leave of absence. Asiana repeatedly asked about my expected return date and physical condition during this 6 week leave which was dutifully provided by me and my doctor. Only after I was medically cleared to return to duty did Asiana decide reinstatement was not worth the remaining time on my contract with an overdue 6 month recurrent training. The contractual 60 days notice of termination with pay was denied, as well as my request for transportation to collect belongings still in Seoul. I went on my own, and several middle management personnel apologized for the bad decision and treatment.
World Airline Services (W.A.S.) was my agent collecting monthly commissions, and they didn’t attempt to resolve this issue. W.A.S. also was 6 months late in sending contractually included medical insurance information after many requests both in 2006 and 2007. Contractually there was no deductible for such medical insurance, but in 2007 they unilaterally applied a $650 deductible. Beware of these pimp agencies once you are hired - they aren’t interested in you or your contract once they get on the commission bandwagon.
This isn’t sour grapes – I was not going to renew my contract even if age 60 were to be increased – enough of expat flying for me, although I left behind some good friends. It was no big deal leaving 7 months early, but thought this might help those looking at this job – caveat emptor.
Could not start a new thread titled Asiana Airlines, so tagged on here -
Asiana Airlines has been overly aggressive at docking pay for missed flights due to illness (no sick leave) or transportation problems after vacations – including docking the already scheduled successive and intervening days off. Put another way, they not only deduct for the lost flight time, but deduct the scheduled days off after the missed flight until the next flight flown. Contractual issues have been a problem with both Asiana and the airline service agencies. 6 Positive Space tickets on the Asiana system were part of the contract, but it turned out to be space available unless expat employees could compete with ALL Asiana employees on up to two seats per airplane a year in advance for reservations. That proved impossible, especially with flying schedules that often were unilaterally made and changed by Asiana. Parc Aviation and World Airline Services agencies have talked about resolving such issues, but nothing has ever been done.
From January 2006 until July 2007 I was an Asiana B-777 foreign Captain based in Seoul. Asiana improperly terminated my contract 7 months before I was to turn age 60, and incorrectly attributed the termination for a cured medical condition even though I was declared ready to return to work from a granted medical leave of absence. Asiana repeatedly asked about my expected return date and physical condition during this 6 week leave which was dutifully provided by me and my doctor. Only after I was medically cleared to return to duty did Asiana decide reinstatement was not worth the remaining time on my contract with an overdue 6 month recurrent training. The contractual 60 days notice of termination with pay was denied, as well as my request for transportation to collect belongings still in Seoul. I went on my own, and several middle management personnel apologized for the bad decision and treatment.
World Airline Services (W.A.S.) was my agent collecting monthly commissions, and they didn’t attempt to resolve this issue. W.A.S. also was 6 months late in sending contractually included medical insurance information after many requests both in 2006 and 2007. Contractually there was no deductible for such medical insurance, but in 2007 they unilaterally applied a $650 deductible. Beware of these pimp agencies once you are hired - they aren’t interested in you or your contract once they get on the commission bandwagon.
This isn’t sour grapes – I was not going to renew my contract even if age 60 were to be increased – enough of expat flying for me, although I left behind some good friends. It was no big deal leaving 7 months early, but thought this might help those looking at this job – caveat emptor.
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Asiana or Korean Air
Important caveat for anyone thinking of going to Korea no matter which
airline you want to work for. It seems not just from your post but many previous posts regarding KAL aw well that they can and will manipulate the contract if it suits them. Regardless of you or your family.
It's one way to the big jets but not exactly the best way.
airline you want to work for. It seems not just from your post but many previous posts regarding KAL aw well that they can and will manipulate the contract if it suits them. Regardless of you or your family.
It's one way to the big jets but not exactly the best way.
Join Date: Jan 2006
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I have a question.
Why not start up your own airline hiring company based out of the Cook Islands or somewhere similar. You will be hiring one pilot only, YOU.
What if the Expat Pilot’s at KAL got together and formed their own company to hire expat pilots and not have those big commissions. Just have some good KAL blokes, say 10, to do some admin stuff. More money for your pockets. Would it not be better for all involved?
Can you just do it all yourself?
KAL will pay the hiring company who will then pay you, lets say 2000 USD a month. The rest will go to an offshore bank. You pay tax on 2000 USD a month? Could you not have the hiring company two company’s deep? The KAL pilots set up a company to hire everyone and then the individual have his own company (basically his or her to be politically correct) and his company pays him/her as an individual ($2000 USD). The rest goes into the individual’s company’s bank account set up in a tax free country.
The KAL Pilots Company will be paid by the Individuals Company a commission, somewhat smaller than the others.
What is KAL paying the hiring companies at the moment and what are the hiring companies paying the pilots they hire? Why is it so different?
Too Hard?
How hard would it be to solve contractual problems? Just a thought.
Why not start up your own airline hiring company based out of the Cook Islands or somewhere similar. You will be hiring one pilot only, YOU.
What if the Expat Pilot’s at KAL got together and formed their own company to hire expat pilots and not have those big commissions. Just have some good KAL blokes, say 10, to do some admin stuff. More money for your pockets. Would it not be better for all involved?
Can you just do it all yourself?
KAL will pay the hiring company who will then pay you, lets say 2000 USD a month. The rest will go to an offshore bank. You pay tax on 2000 USD a month? Could you not have the hiring company two company’s deep? The KAL pilots set up a company to hire everyone and then the individual have his own company (basically his or her to be politically correct) and his company pays him/her as an individual ($2000 USD). The rest goes into the individual’s company’s bank account set up in a tax free country.
The KAL Pilots Company will be paid by the Individuals Company a commission, somewhat smaller than the others.
What is KAL paying the hiring companies at the moment and what are the hiring companies paying the pilots they hire? Why is it so different?
Too Hard?
How hard would it be to solve contractual problems? Just a thought.
Join Date: Jan 2007
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Mapleleaf.I LIKE THE WAY YOU THINK . Now someone is thinking out of the box. Why not !!! pilots looking after pilots. As long as no one gets greedy. You might find though that KAL or Aseana have a "clause" stating the contract agency has to be allready established for "x" years and/or cannot be owned /run by KAL / Aseana employees etc. Who knows , but look into it. Might be a good sollution.
Ha , pilots getting organised .Must be snowing in the sandpit !!!!
Ha , pilots getting organised .Must be snowing in the sandpit !!!!
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Not owned by KAL Pilots? That’s easy. Form a company (ABC company) in some offshore region.
Being established for an x number of year may be different.
If ABC Company says to KAL that they have 20 or more pilots willing to join and no one is with the other companies, KAL may waive that rule if they are the only contract company that has pilots willing to join(say 10 777 Captains and 10 747-400 rated pilots).
The idea is there, will anyone with entrepreneur skills willing to act on it?
Being established for an x number of year may be different.
If ABC Company says to KAL that they have 20 or more pilots willing to join and no one is with the other companies, KAL may waive that rule if they are the only contract company that has pilots willing to join(say 10 777 Captains and 10 747-400 rated pilots).
The idea is there, will anyone with entrepreneur skills willing to act on it?
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You can purchase a pre-registered 'off the shelf' company in a tax friendly jurisdiction, which has been aged for many years already. Eg you could just buy out a shelf corporation which is ten years old, and repurpose it. Many incorporation services in Hong Kong, Dubai etc can handle this for you 
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Looking for any information on the KAL hiring process and any recommendations on the company to use as the"agent".My understanding is that you must go thru an agency with KAL.Also,is their any requirement that an American pilot hold a Canadian pilot liscense to work for Kal?
Thanks ,
Sundowner 111
Thanks ,
Sundowner 111
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Hello. I have an interview with KAL coming up in a few weeks. I applied through their website in Korean and got the email a few days ago. Does anyone know how the schedule's like for 737? I'd love to commute, if I can, from Canada. thank you very much.
