jobs in japan ?
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jobs in japan ?
anybody know oif any jobs in japan besides ANA . My wife to be is japanese and really wants to move back to japan in the next few years . As for me about 4.000 hours right now . Twin otter time and now on cessna caravan for a fedex feeder . Any hints would be great
thanks
thanks
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My friend, if the continuation of the marriage is dependent on moving to Japan to work, forget it.
You will be treated like $hit there, regardless of whether or not you're married to one. Marginally better received socially, but professionally, you'll be the end of the line.
The Japanese workers are paid much more, receive more vacation than foreigners, and your opinion will be disregarded even though you're PIC. If you're an FO, you won't even be looked at, let alone consulted.
As KM says on another thread, the Japanese act as though they don't want foreigners there, but they desperately need them. They can't get over their prejudices, regardles of the commerical reality.
I would not encourage anybody to go to Japan to work as a pilot, or anything else for that matter, though my experience is limited to flying there.
For your own mental and physical well being, don't do it to yourself......unless you're into masochism, of course.
You will be treated like $hit there, regardless of whether or not you're married to one. Marginally better received socially, but professionally, you'll be the end of the line.
The Japanese workers are paid much more, receive more vacation than foreigners, and your opinion will be disregarded even though you're PIC. If you're an FO, you won't even be looked at, let alone consulted.
As KM says on another thread, the Japanese act as though they don't want foreigners there, but they desperately need them. They can't get over their prejudices, regardles of the commerical reality.
I would not encourage anybody to go to Japan to work as a pilot, or anything else for that matter, though my experience is limited to flying there.
For your own mental and physical well being, don't do it to yourself......unless you're into masochism, of course.
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why dont you leave if its so bad?
cant you find another job in a better place?
cant you find another job in a better place?
Maybe he has already found a job in a better place.
Japan is just one tiny country in Asia that needs pilots.
If they want to treat their employees like pow's, then they ought to expect a pow mentality in return.
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i think japan and its people are beautiful ,but since i have not worked there yet, i thought i post to get some input.Still nobody has said anything about any jobs maybe ?
My future marriage btw does not depend on me moving to japan or not... we are happy where we are, but my future in laws are getting older and i want to be closer to them ,than an 11 hour flight ...
thanks
My future marriage btw does not depend on me moving to japan or not... we are happy where we are, but my future in laws are getting older and i want to be closer to them ,than an 11 hour flight ...
thanks
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Foreign Worker is right.
If you want/are prepared to be treated like a bit of $hit for bigger $$ then be my guest, but my pride won`t allow it.
I will work for half the $$ provided I`m paid the same as a local. Traditionally, contractors are paid more than locals, and that provides the incentive to get their own troops up and running asap, but I didn`t want more, just the same.
I`m not accustomed to being treated second best, so did not accept it.
I, like most people who go to Japan, had very different ideas about the land of Honda and Sony before going there; hard working, creative people, and as I look out my window at the Honda NSX, the reality doesn`t seem to fit my illusion and becomes a delusion.
Japan is a sheltered workshop, full of sycophants bobbing up and down to please their `superiors` (who seem to be everybody) and sitting in their offices from 6 am till 9 pm so they can arrive before their bosses and go home after, but doing only a couple of hours` work in between.
The hardest workers in Japan are foreign pilots, more hours than locals, less pay than locals, less holidays than locals, MUCH less respect than locals. I could go on, but I`m sure all but the least perceptive get the idea.
Anybody who says Japan is accepting of foreigners is deluding themselves They will cram five to a table for two in a restaurant before sharing with a foreigner, or even stand in preference. I often heard that they were shy people, but it comes from a sense of superiority, and there are a hundred reasons why I have difficulty with that concept.
Please don`t misunderstand me though. I believe there are many decent Japanese people who are accepting of other races, and I have good friends amongst them, but they possess the ants` nest mentality... threaten the nest, and they muster, scampering around like Japanese Mr Beans, working in groups to bring you back in line, or bring you down, and it seems to me they have a distinct preference for bringing you down. Ever seen ants taking on a much bigger adversary? They inevitably win through strength of numbers attacking from every angle.
But Shenlin, in answer to your question, I believe there are plenty of jobs on offer, particularly for 737 Captains. My former colleagues tell me that both PARC and IAC are desperate to fill the Air Do contract, Skymark will be starting their 737 operation in about six months, Skynet is desperate for foeign Captains, and JALEX is seeking MD80 Captains. A couple of operators are also after trubo prop pilots, so there is plenty of work there.
BUT, remember that before you check out, you absolutely MUST know the thickness of a snowflake, because you`ll probably be asked by one of the intellectual giants from JCAB, with a couple of thousand hours instructing on Bonanzas. It might not be a pass/fail question, but you will be humiliated by being told that you must study harder. Don`t forget the number of active volcanoes either (by name, and maybe, or maybe not including the submarine ones); that`s a big one.
If you want/are prepared to be treated like a bit of $hit for bigger $$ then be my guest, but my pride won`t allow it.
I will work for half the $$ provided I`m paid the same as a local. Traditionally, contractors are paid more than locals, and that provides the incentive to get their own troops up and running asap, but I didn`t want more, just the same.
I`m not accustomed to being treated second best, so did not accept it.
I, like most people who go to Japan, had very different ideas about the land of Honda and Sony before going there; hard working, creative people, and as I look out my window at the Honda NSX, the reality doesn`t seem to fit my illusion and becomes a delusion.
Japan is a sheltered workshop, full of sycophants bobbing up and down to please their `superiors` (who seem to be everybody) and sitting in their offices from 6 am till 9 pm so they can arrive before their bosses and go home after, but doing only a couple of hours` work in between.
The hardest workers in Japan are foreign pilots, more hours than locals, less pay than locals, less holidays than locals, MUCH less respect than locals. I could go on, but I`m sure all but the least perceptive get the idea.
Anybody who says Japan is accepting of foreigners is deluding themselves They will cram five to a table for two in a restaurant before sharing with a foreigner, or even stand in preference. I often heard that they were shy people, but it comes from a sense of superiority, and there are a hundred reasons why I have difficulty with that concept.
Please don`t misunderstand me though. I believe there are many decent Japanese people who are accepting of other races, and I have good friends amongst them, but they possess the ants` nest mentality... threaten the nest, and they muster, scampering around like Japanese Mr Beans, working in groups to bring you back in line, or bring you down, and it seems to me they have a distinct preference for bringing you down. Ever seen ants taking on a much bigger adversary? They inevitably win through strength of numbers attacking from every angle.
But Shenlin, in answer to your question, I believe there are plenty of jobs on offer, particularly for 737 Captains. My former colleagues tell me that both PARC and IAC are desperate to fill the Air Do contract, Skymark will be starting their 737 operation in about six months, Skynet is desperate for foeign Captains, and JALEX is seeking MD80 Captains. A couple of operators are also after trubo prop pilots, so there is plenty of work there.
BUT, remember that before you check out, you absolutely MUST know the thickness of a snowflake, because you`ll probably be asked by one of the intellectual giants from JCAB, with a couple of thousand hours instructing on Bonanzas. It might not be a pass/fail question, but you will be humiliated by being told that you must study harder. Don`t forget the number of active volcanoes either (by name, and maybe, or maybe not including the submarine ones); that`s a big one.
Last edited by JapJok; 9th Feb 2005 at 22:50.
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wow
it seems thats harder (or at least
they make it harder) to get a job in japan
than in cathay or emirates or lufthansa
je je je je
and its true what you say japkok
a in the end, their all bookgeniuses
but flying, habndling a plane!!!!!
ive seen that and its scary
and the other part of being treated like
nothing or ignored, ive been flying now
for 2 years out of my native country
and i can relate a lot, believe me
they make their samll little groups
to screw you in any possible way
but, I hang in there
hard sometimes
but what the heck
well see
hope that better times will come
it seems thats harder (or at least
they make it harder) to get a job in japan
than in cathay or emirates or lufthansa
je je je je
and its true what you say japkok
a in the end, their all bookgeniuses
but flying, habndling a plane!!!!!
ive seen that and its scary
and the other part of being treated like
nothing or ignored, ive been flying now
for 2 years out of my native country
and i can relate a lot, believe me
they make their samll little groups
to screw you in any possible way
but, I hang in there
hard sometimes
but what the heck
well see
hope that better times will come
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One of the things I did like about Japan was the Marco Poloish, or maybe Neil Armstrongish feeling you get as you taxy out.
All the ground crew and mechanics are lined up, perfectly in line with the longitudinal axis of the aircraft (they wouldn`t dare be anywhere but exactly in line, because there is probably a law against it), waving goodbye, as if they are never going to see you again.........maybe they know something the gaijin bit of ****e captain doesn`t. Just maybe.
All the ground crew and mechanics are lined up, perfectly in line with the longitudinal axis of the aircraft (they wouldn`t dare be anywhere but exactly in line, because there is probably a law against it), waving goodbye, as if they are never going to see you again.........maybe they know something the gaijin bit of ****e captain doesn`t. Just maybe.
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I've talked to some expat pilots of Japanese operator, generally they are happy with what/where they are... some even say maybe the best job for contractor.
yes I think expat pilots are paid 70-80% of locals but maybe still higher than what u are making now.
but one thing u have to think of, basing---most of them are no based in Japan.
yes I think expat pilots are paid 70-80% of locals but maybe still higher than what u are making now.
but one thing u have to think of, basing---most of them are no based in Japan.
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Thanks everybody for the input . I did not realise man of the things that were brought up , but then this is what this forum is all about ....Maybe i should reconsider and look elsewhere .time will tell i guess.
thanks again
thanks again
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
yes I think expat pilots are paid 70-80% of locals
This has NOTHING to do with the pilots, and everything to do with the recruiting agencies, and the airline schedulers, however the gross inequalities of the aforementioned probably creates an uneasiness between the two pilot groups.
It's not unreasonable to assume that the Japanese pilots look at the contracted foreign pilots as a threat to their conditions - work more for less - just as it is not unreasonable for the contract pilots to assume they are being exploited, as foreigners often are in Asian countries...usually the citizens of third world countries.
And so the tag of "cheap foreign labour" is one that comes to mind.
JapJok mentioned the "Ant mentality" - the "Group think", that runs through the heart of Japanese culture - and it is not difficult to imagine that the attitudes of the Japanese pilots extends through, and permeates the thoughts and feelings of the rest of the nest.
I believe it is up to the agencies to behave more mindfully when negotiating contracts for foreign pilots - I don't believe that the Japanese are responsible for dictating the (relative) cut throat conditions of the contracts.
The differences in conditions are poles apart at the moment, and it's NOT making for happy campers on BOTH sides!
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Well put KM. I don't blame the Japanese entirely, but some of the blame rests with them for expat pay and conditions. They don't offer to up them to locals conditions minus agency commissions, and they easily could.
The agencies go in there tearing each other to bits to get the business, and seldom telling the complete truth, like the AirDo contract for example. Looks like taxation is paid on only some of the gross.
Chap I know emailed for clarification, and an agency previously beating his door down with emails every day, has become strangely, or perhaps not so strangely, silent, so it looks as though there may have been a little deception involved in the presentation.
I can't imagine the locals being happy with expats coming in and undercutting either. They must be able to see their conditions reducing as a result..unions don't have much pull in Japan.
The agencies go in there tearing each other to bits to get the business, and seldom telling the complete truth, like the AirDo contract for example. Looks like taxation is paid on only some of the gross.
Chap I know emailed for clarification, and an agency previously beating his door down with emails every day, has become strangely, or perhaps not so strangely, silent, so it looks as though there may have been a little deception involved in the presentation.
I can't imagine the locals being happy with expats coming in and undercutting either. They must be able to see their conditions reducing as a result..unions don't have much pull in Japan.
