It's possible that the BBC might have learned that there is Doppler information available from the spectrum of the ping signal, which is perhaps possible. *

Then again, on their "what we known" page BBC News - Missing Malaysia plane: What we know their 777s appear to be -300s with 6 doors.

* How big an effect?

It's small - on the 40 degree arc, flying towards the satellite at 200m/s - only of order 1 part in 2 million, so it's not likely to be of any use.

Apologies if it was posted before, I couldn't find it. It amazes me the fact that nobody on TV and other mass-media channels did not mention anything about the Heading Selector knob from the MCP. All the TV "specialists" are talking about some " pre-programmed" waypoints. I speculate it would be a lot faster and perhaps more convenient to disengage the LNAV and change the direction using the Heading Selector instead of reprogramming the flight path on the CDU.

knowns, facts & fallacies
 

@DS, thanks for keeping the timeline updated & re-posting... evidently many posters ignore scores of previous posts entirely & present the same ol' flawed scenarios to feed their own denial & bias. Some of them are "pilots" too! Funny old world.


If anyone bothers to read this before posting yet another smoke filled cockpit electrical fire depressurisation hypoxia type lazy amateur hour version of events, please, for the sake of our collective sanity, please first answer one very simple question:


Why did someone in the cockpit enter a new waypoint into the FMS but subsequently fail to mention this during their conversation with ATC?!?!?

@Pace:
One reason: to avoid try and avoid detection until closer to intended destination. Heading selector seems an easier way, though.
The area ~ 2000 miles west from Australia? Thousands of feet deep, most of it looked to be past the 1000 fathom curve when I consulted an old atlas last night. This pic may help. This has a bit more detail.

@ FE Hoppy. :ok: Thanks, my previous response was binned.

Waypoint Entry Challenged
 

Why did someone in the cockpit enter a new waypoint into the FMS but subsequently fail to mention this during their conversation with ATC?!?!?



Where is the evidence of waypoint entry or even prior waypoint entry? The premise is off. Even the Malaysian pressers have walked that back.

There is absolutely no evidence that a new waypoint was entered other than journalist speculation.

Lonewolf

I would have thought the very opposite as an aircraft which had lost radio and transponder identification the first obvious place to look would be along set airways?

How about a massive electrical failure caused by electromagnetic radiation from an external source. Electrical systems rendered inoperative. Engines continue to run as fadecs shielded and supplied by permanent magnet alternators. FBW Flight controls out but aircraft could be turned with rudder deflection, is that physically connected to the pedals on the 777? But with no way to reduce thrust and cabin alt rising crew would then have had to don masks hampering communication, or may have become hypoxic. So in darkness with no roll or pitch control, no way to reduce thrust, and possibly impaired judgement perhaps they could have ended up in the water south west of Australia 7 hours later when the fuel ran out.

Bull:mad:. There's discussing rumours and there's making them up out of thin air. Big difference.

if they are talking about the theory of pinging I agree with the comments of rubbish, however I like your thinking, they have been told it but don't realise why

Fair point. Guessing the motives of persons unknown is a tricky business. :cool:

Although I appreciate it has been dismissed, does anyone know the location and types of PSR/SSR covering IVAO? Interestingly, the MSA at VRMT is 1500'.

It sank. .....

TDK

You posted
"How about a massive electrical failure caused by electromagnetic radiation from an external source. "

That means an EMP. That cannot be generated so that only one single aircraft was disabled. It would have been widespread and many aircraft, ships and almost anything that had electronic components would have had fried circuits. Its simply not possible.

doppler / pinging
 

doppler would be proportional to the speed of approach or departure by the craft relative to the bird's position. Given the height of the bird, and the very small angle subtended by the beam relative to that height, doppler will be very small, and probably with very high error extents. Velocity times sine of the angle from perpendicular @ beam center to the craft. Doppler might be unmeasurably small, relative to frequency accuracy at bird and craft.

Heli-phile

I question the wisdom of the spokesperson. How do you know the transponder was de-selected? Because if does not reply to a request is not a valid answer. That just means that for whatever reason the transponder does not respond.

How do we know ACARS was logged out? Same as with the transponder.

If the malaysian spokesperson can tell me HOW he KNOWS that these devices were deliberately stopped from transmitting, then I may believe his statement. The statements I remember were carefully worded and left room for uncertainty.

Did it?

I don't know the airway structure here but an early map showed a possible route passing through or near a number of reporting points. It was said, I believe that these did not represent an airway but a flight along the FIR boundary.

I am guessing that the RPs were on the boundary for traffic crossing the boundary not flying along it.

If one wants to confuse then flight along an FIR boundary is a good way of doing it as authorities might assume the aircraft was in contact with the opposite agency.

I just saw on the television news that the Malaysian Authorities are saying that they believe the waypoints must have been pre-programmed because the turn observed on radar was very gradual and looked like it must have been done using the FMC and A/P.

If that's what they are suggesting then this investigation has been doomed from the very beginning.

Hunter58 I completely agree with you. It seems people are far too eager to believe any old BS they hear about this incident. So far all we actually know is that an aircraft has gone missing. That's actually it.

One can also accept the radio message, since it was on a public channel, which adds to the known situation that "an aircraft has gone missing following a seemingly normal handover".

Everything else is just niff-naff until the remains are found and some forensic analysis can begin. Even the "pings".

@Jilted
That hasn't stopped Fox and other mainstream media from stating it as a fact for 2 days.

Meanwhile, the Malaysian officials seem to be backing away from it, saying they've moved on to more relevant stuff... sweeping the pilots under the bus, as MSM asserts that they are almost certainly responsible.

It's a disgrace, from the media and the authorities.

I wouldn't mind betting that these satellite paths are bogus too. If they'd produced circles for various pings, it might be believable.

FWIW: I've seen no retraction by FOX after their breaking news / scoop about the plane heading west at the time of last communication was put in the bin at the presser.