Re broken aerial feeds it appears the AD re structural problems did not impact this a/c. Maybe it should have? I also have had a reply that the power source/ feeds for a lot of the comms. VHF HF TSPDR ACARS but not the SATCOM shared a common path. That's hard to believe but it would lead to extra workload for the crew just at the point when they were sorting out a major problem. Any initial calls would be dead & a crew trying to sort out a major emergency would not waste time on this extra minor problem. They would probably believe they had just left VHF range. It also appears the A/P uses a different source which could explain why the a/c made a turn etc.

Bono

Yes, but two caveats: 1) Even narrowed down, the search area is the size of Texas and Oklahoma combined. 2) There still remains the possibility that they are NOT in fact searching in the right place. In fact the only piece of "stuff" even remotely resembling debris is the fire bottle/mine/breathing gear in the Maldives. I know - very tenuous link indeed, but it's the only thing to come out of the water so far.

That was mostly cleared up about 200 pages ago. To sum up: absent a certain airframe mod, the bulletin would not apply to this hull. That's the info available to the public so far.

@minimaman: The Indian Ocean isn't some smooth, unruffled surface where an airliner could skim the surface before coming to rest - even if it were being flown by a great pilot, rather than just relying on its natural stability as you're suggesting. An aircraft hitting water at 200kts is not going to remain intact, it will be smashed to pieces. Imagine what a truck would look like after hitting a motorway bridge at 60mph, then scale that up by a factor of 10 for the higher energy of the aircraft speed you're suggesting. The only large pieces remaining intact will be those torn off at the root by the impact, such as wings and tail surfaces.

Where Is Debris?
 

1. Big passenger plane hits water, breaks apart and spews debris of all kinds
2. Roaring forties will spread debris far and wide within days
3. Satellites looking across hundreds of miles will spot atleast some debris within a few days using Inmarsat data
4. Aircraft and ships will be notified and regular search and investigation will follow.


It sounds all logical but nothing, absolutely nothing has been spotted, so cross off #3. If they do not find anything in a week's time, start looking underwater.

Actually they did mention the turbulence and told the rear crew that the pax should be strapped in. However, it is always like that flying through the ITCZ. The CVR and DFDR showed the LOC was almost certainly due to lack of experience/practice in limited panel manual flight at altitude with unreliable speed indications when in Alternate Law.

Good point. lots of stuff ends up in the indian ocean from launches in the US and South american launch sites.

AFAIK MAS do not allow non crew to be in the FD but just like anything else there are rules written on paper and then there is real life. I'll leave it at that.

Did not the Tristar land in the Florida Everglades.
T7 crash in San Fran bounced around a fair bit, just check out the videos on YouTube there should be plenty to choose from. Remainder of Aircraft stayed in tact. Bits of flaps missing.

Anything is possible and actually having some waves to cushion the impact so less chance of a breakup.

Chances are some of the flaps and other control surfaces came off and these are what is likely the debris, if it is actually from MH370.

Please give one example of a wide body attempting to land and breaking up!

I've wondered about that. If the crew were conscious and wanted to communicate, even if the radios and ACARS were out, they should still be able to use the phone. Unless that had somehow become disconnected from the SATCOM terminal by whatever affected the radios.

Ditching
 

I know what you're saying but it does beg the question why the safety briefing for trans-ocean flights doesn't include a caveat something like, "there's no way we can land this thing safely in the ocean but for your comfort and convenience, .....". But let's not go there ;)

Maybe if they allowed it and someone was in the FD, possibly 200+ persons would still be alive.

Where Is debris?
 

There is nothing that can be tied to MH370 that has been spotted visually by any ship. South Indian ocean has plenty of debris otherwise (Google Indian Ocean Garbage Patch).


The two arguments go against each other:
1. Big fully loaded aircraft "crashes" and breaks apart
2. Practically no debris located


One of them CANNOT be right if Inmarsat data is correct.

Opportunity
 

I am considering setting up an "E@Humble-Pie" store, with discount for registered site posters.

I suspect there will be quite a demand when we do find out what happened, hopefully sooner rather than later.

You really have no sense of scale - in a post way back at the beginning of the thread the problem was described as looking for a green grain of sugar in Central Park.

Now some debris has been sighted and marker buoys dropped - and even then ships cannot get to that area easily to check out what has been found.

If someone had wanted to find somewhere to 'lose' a widebody aircraft so it could not be found they would have chosen the South Indian Ocean in the 'roaring forties'.

Had it not been for the maintenance of low level SATCOM connectivity, and, the capability of communications scientists to calculate from simple handshakes where an aircraft could be - the location of the aircraft would be completely unknown and the assumption would have been a crash close to Malaysia.

SAR info
 

For BONO and the others who keep on about debris, bear in mind what the Australian military have said. " We have to find the haystack"

As I said in a post several days ago, I've been there, in the haystack, and still couldn't find what we were looking for. Even with modern radars, sea clutter is a major problem, particularly when looking into the swell. If the object in the water is moving relative to the swell you may be able to electronically isolate it. If on the other hand it is drifting with the swell I don't see how you can reduce the sea return without killing the return from the object.

So back to Mk 1 eyeball!

Info from current SAR types would be helpful.

Post# 8267

Where is Debris
 

U.S. hardware designed to help with that task arrived Wednesday in Perth, the western Australian city that is the base for the search efforts.
The United States sent a Bluefin-21 autonomous underwater vehicle, which can search for submerged objects at depths as low as 14,700 feet (about 4,500 meters), and a TPL-25, a giant listening device that can help pinpoint the location of pings from the flight data recorder. Towed behind a ship, the TPL-25 can detect pings at a maximum depth of 20,000 feet (about 6,100 meters).

-From Above CNN Article

Great!, looks like NTSB is as baffled as I am regarding no worthwhile debris from crash of a fully loaded giant aircraft.

The search area has not ballooned it has simply moved around based on drifting models as mentioned by AMSA briefings. The area if anything has become narrower, a fact you can verify by looking at daily search maps published by AMSA on its media site. From the initial area given to them by NTSB, AMSA has essentially factored in only drifting models and satellite sightings. None of these searches have been fruitful. In any case it defies logic that while search area is become narrower, yet there have been zero debris sightings.

CNN certainly is NOT the source to reference for anything to do with this Aircraft Disappearance. They being of the every conspiracy and lunatic theory there is.:ugh::rolleyes::=

Please give an example of a wide body landing in 15' swells and NOT breaking up.

EA 401 landed in the Glades at a gentle descent rate in smooth surface and most were killed. The 'Miracle on the Hudson' was 99% about still surface conditions and landing at a controlled rate. IF MH 370 flamed at fuel exhaustion, as seems most likely, it hit either barely controlled (pilots still alive, which then begs why were they there) or uncontrolled after the A/P tripped off following loss of AC power.