Delta evacuation in Tampa
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Washington DC USA
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Delta evacuation in Tampa
Reuters
Eight slightly hurt in plane evacuation in Tampa
Monday June 23, 11:50 am ET
TAMPA, Fla., June 23, Reuters - Eight people were slightly injured on Monday when passengers, apparently alarmed by seeing flames coming from an engine, inflated emergency slides and evacuated a plane at the Tampa airport, airline and fire rescue officials said.
The plane, a Delta Air Lines (NYSE
AL - News) Boeing 757 (NYSE:BA - News) bound for Atlanta with 167 passengers on board, was pushing back from the gate at Tampa International Airport when it experienced what is known as a "hot start," said Delta spokeswoman Peggy Estes.
Hot start is when fuel condensation forms overnight on an engine and a flame is briefly emitted when it is fired up for the first flight of the day, she said.
"Initial reports indicated that some passengers may have seen flames from (an) engine and some elected to open the emergency exits, automatically deploying chutes," Estes said in e-mailed comments.
Some of the passengers evacuated through chutes, while the rest followed flight attendants' instructions and got out through the normal exits, she said.
Tampa Fire Rescue spokesman Capt. Bill Wade said eight people were taken to a hospital, mostly with soreness, bumps and bruises from landing hard after sliding down the chutes, but there were no life-threatening injuries.
"Subsequently ... you could see no damage to the aircraft, but I don't doubt that seeing fire coming out of the engine caused some concern," he said.
Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Christopher White described the incident on Flight 1036 as "an uncommanded passenger evacuation," and added the FAA was looking into it.
Eight slightly hurt in plane evacuation in Tampa
Monday June 23, 11:50 am ET
TAMPA, Fla., June 23, Reuters - Eight people were slightly injured on Monday when passengers, apparently alarmed by seeing flames coming from an engine, inflated emergency slides and evacuated a plane at the Tampa airport, airline and fire rescue officials said.
The plane, a Delta Air Lines (NYSE
AL - News) Boeing 757 (NYSE:BA - News) bound for Atlanta with 167 passengers on board, was pushing back from the gate at Tampa International Airport when it experienced what is known as a "hot start," said Delta spokeswoman Peggy Estes.Hot start is when fuel condensation forms overnight on an engine and a flame is briefly emitted when it is fired up for the first flight of the day, she said.
"Initial reports indicated that some passengers may have seen flames from (an) engine and some elected to open the emergency exits, automatically deploying chutes," Estes said in e-mailed comments.
Some of the passengers evacuated through chutes, while the rest followed flight attendants' instructions and got out through the normal exits, she said.
Tampa Fire Rescue spokesman Capt. Bill Wade said eight people were taken to a hospital, mostly with soreness, bumps and bruises from landing hard after sliding down the chutes, but there were no life-threatening injuries.
"Subsequently ... you could see no damage to the aircraft, but I don't doubt that seeing fire coming out of the engine caused some concern," he said.
Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Christopher White described the incident on Flight 1036 as "an uncommanded passenger evacuation," and added the FAA was looking into it.
I did not know this!
Hot start is when fuel condensation forms overnight on an engine and a flame is briefly emitted when it is fired up for the first flight of the day, she said.
Better get the books out again and start learning, I obviously missed some very important parts.
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 361
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How did the crew let THE PAX initiate an evacuation??????
Surely there is a chain of command ,and the flightcrew/fa's would be first to start off this (costly)chain of events??
Are not all doors manned by cabin crew during pushback at Delta?
This is mandatory in the UK.
Surely there is a chain of command ,and the flightcrew/fa's would be first to start off this (costly)chain of events??
Are not all doors manned by cabin crew during pushback at Delta?
This is mandatory in the UK.
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: is a point of view
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Anti-ice:
tell me since they have it all better in the UK...duh
how are you going to man the overwing exits ? by having a FA sitting in your lap maybe?
and during pushback arn't the FA's doing all sorts of things? like arming the slides? and taking care of Buisness pax?
Think before you speak..eh..leap in this case
let me point you the way to happiness...
Pointer
tell me since they have it all better in the UK...duh
how are you going to man the overwing exits ? by having a FA sitting in your lap maybe?
and during pushback arn't the FA's doing all sorts of things? like arming the slides? and taking care of Buisness pax?
Think before you speak..eh..leap in this case
let me point you the way to happiness...
Pointer
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Wet Coast
Posts: 2,335
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
http://aviation-safety.net/airlinesafety/exits/105.html
757-200s come in two flavours. Delta does not have 757-300s.
757-200s come in two flavours. Delta does not have 757-300s.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: EGGW
Posts: 2,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pontious
I Hate to tell you, but you have shot yourself in both feet.
I would say most of the B757-200s flying in the USA have overwing exits. Delta, American, United and Continental to name the 4 big airlines. So thats the three biggest 757 operators in the world. So i would guess that there are more with overwing than without. You have been looking at aircraft operating in europe for to long.
So in all l think you owe Pointer a very deep Apology.
Deck-Cam
Yes you had better start with your reading.
Each pair of over wings has a slide, which comes out of a compartment just above the inboard flap.
I Hate to tell you, but you have shot yourself in both feet.
I would say most of the B757-200s flying in the USA have overwing exits. Delta, American, United and Continental to name the 4 big airlines. So thats the three biggest 757 operators in the world. So i would guess that there are more with overwing than without. You have been looking at aircraft operating in europe for to long.
So in all l think you owe Pointer a very deep Apology.
Deck-Cam
Yes you had better start with your reading.
Each pair of over wings has a slide, which comes out of a compartment just above the inboard flap.
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Manchester.UK
Posts: 394
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh Really....
And there was me thinking that (quote from the Boeing flight crew training manual)
" ...there are 8 emergency exits on the Boeing 757-200 series. They are labelled L/R1,L/R2,L/R3 & L/R4. Exits L/R1,L/R2,L/R4 are positioned at the normal cabin door entry/exit points and Emergency exit L/R3 is situated AFT of the trailing edge of the wing." Unquote. I've never seen a B752 with overwing exits
I only ever flew B752's on the UK register. I positioned around in them often and frequently sat at DOORS 3. I doubt any one could see through an alum-inum wing to witness a transient flash from the tailpipe of a G/E or P&W engine if they were sat at an OVERWING exit. I've had and seen a few Hot-Starts and they are indeed nothing more than momentry flashes. Certainly not a reason for a passenger to initiate an uncommanded evac.
I guess that you learn something new everyday. I wouldn't of believed it if I hadn't seen the safety info. post.
Pointer, We have differant mods and specification fits but I read your post to be a tad anti-Brit. On ALL Brit B752's we have the 8 emerg. exit fits and they are manned (99% of the time ) by a stationed Cabin Crew member. That is probably why Anti-Ice was querying as to how this could happen. I think you jumped on him a little hard.I assumed that 8 door was the norm as did Anti -Ice,just as you thought 10 door was Standard.
I apologise for assuming the B752 in this incident was a Standard Fit but not for responding as I did to Pointer.
Mr@SpottyM
Are you sure there are more 10 exit a/c than 8 door examples?
There are quite a lot of American A/L,United and Delta B752's parked in storage at the minute and there are quite a few large users on the 8 door list. For example ATA,AmeriWest,TWA(I concede part of AA), but also US Airways, Northwest A/L,BA, IBERIA then in addition to the UK and European Charterers you have the Mexican and Chinese Heavyweights.
" ...there are 8 emergency exits on the Boeing 757-200 series. They are labelled L/R1,L/R2,L/R3 & L/R4. Exits L/R1,L/R2,L/R4 are positioned at the normal cabin door entry/exit points and Emergency exit L/R3 is situated AFT of the trailing edge of the wing." Unquote. I've never seen a B752 with overwing exits
I only ever flew B752's on the UK register. I positioned around in them often and frequently sat at DOORS 3. I doubt any one could see through an alum-inum wing to witness a transient flash from the tailpipe of a G/E or P&W engine if they were sat at an OVERWING exit. I've had and seen a few Hot-Starts and they are indeed nothing more than momentry flashes. Certainly not a reason for a passenger to initiate an uncommanded evac.
I guess that you learn something new everyday. I wouldn't of believed it if I hadn't seen the safety info. post.
Pointer, We have differant mods and specification fits but I read your post to be a tad anti-Brit. On ALL Brit B752's we have the 8 emerg. exit fits and they are manned (99% of the time ) by a stationed Cabin Crew member. That is probably why Anti-Ice was querying as to how this could happen. I think you jumped on him a little hard.I assumed that 8 door was the norm as did Anti -Ice,just as you thought 10 door was Standard.
I apologise for assuming the B752 in this incident was a Standard Fit but not for responding as I did to Pointer.
Mr@SpottyM
Are you sure there are more 10 exit a/c than 8 door examples?
There are quite a lot of American A/L,United and Delta B752's parked in storage at the minute and there are quite a few large users on the 8 door list. For example ATA,AmeriWest,TWA(I concede part of AA), but also US Airways, Northwest A/L,BA, IBERIA then in addition to the UK and European Charterers you have the Mexican and Chinese Heavyweights.
Last edited by Pontious; 24th Jun 2003 at 08:07.
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 361
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well excuse me Pointer (sister).
Thanks for your delightful reply
I'm well aware most US 757s have o/w exits,and no i wouldn't expect the fa's to sit on anyones lap , but surely they would be monitoring the cabin to some extent? (must've noticed a scene in the cabin before they had a chance to open exits.)?
Maybe we have got it better in the UK, cos every Delta flight i ever took was lousy.
Thanks pontius, yeh he is anti-brit obviously ,but i don't rise to infantile behaviour.
Get a life2
Thanks for your delightful reply
I'm well aware most US 757s have o/w exits,and no i wouldn't expect the fa's to sit on anyones lap , but surely they would be monitoring the cabin to some extent? (must've noticed a scene in the cabin before they had a chance to open exits.)?
Maybe we have got it better in the UK, cos every Delta flight i ever took was lousy.
Thanks pontius, yeh he is anti-brit obviously ,but i don't rise to infantile behaviour.
Get a life2
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hmmm, ain't good, these passengers leaping out of their seats to rush out exits without being told to do so.
Wonder if any decided to exit on the side with the hot-starting engine...
Still not as bad as what madam 411A witnessed about 10 years ago in BKK.
NWA 747, during the start of the takeoff roll, a Japanese pax decided he wanted off, pronto.
Lept up, opened the L4 door and tried to jump out...grabbed by two burly guys in aisle seats close by...120 pax then wanted off when the aircraft, chute flapping in the breeze, parked at a remote stand.
Wonder if any decided to exit on the side with the hot-starting engine...
Still not as bad as what madam 411A witnessed about 10 years ago in BKK.
NWA 747, during the start of the takeoff roll, a Japanese pax decided he wanted off, pronto.
Lept up, opened the L4 door and tried to jump out...grabbed by two burly guys in aisle seats close by...120 pax then wanted off when the aircraft, chute flapping in the breeze, parked at a remote stand.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: EGGW
Posts: 2,112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pontious.
Yes they do have 10 exits, but due to the overwing type they do not have an L3 or R3 drop down door.
It is only high Density config that have the #3 door fit.
By the way you have not been at Britannia since the start of 757 operation or you would have seen the leased aircraft they operated from GLA. This aircraft had overwing exits and was
G-BTEJ leased from Icelandair.
As they would say, Have a nice day now!!
Yes they do have 10 exits, but due to the overwing type they do not have an L3 or R3 drop down door.
It is only high Density config that have the #3 door fit.
By the way you have not been at Britannia since the start of 757 operation or you would have seen the leased aircraft they operated from GLA. This aircraft had overwing exits and was
G-BTEJ leased from Icelandair.
As they would say, Have a nice day now!!
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Farnham, UK
Posts: 323
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This still begs the question as to how, as flight crew, we should deal with a situation such as this. As we are locked in the flight deck it is impossible to know what is happening in the cabin and if passengers are going to commence emergency evacuations for what they perceive as danger there is a potential for serious injury. Imagine if the crew had started to taxy just as the first pax hit the slide..........
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: is a point of view
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well well ......
So Anti-ice and Pontious.... without me saying anything wrong you both made the effort of putting each others 'foot in mouth'.
Thank you very much .... much appreciated.
Just so you know... i'm not anti British but more anti Island dweller mentality By phrasing your remarks the way you did you show absolutely no professional courtesy to your fellow Pilots and FA's.
Why don't you make this a lesson in "how unpredictable pax can be", should do fine on your next CRM refresher.
you might think about this the next time the pax pull a rabbit out of your hat.
So don't be a
and accept the fact that there are more configurations than the one you call home.
See ya
pointer
So Anti-ice and Pontious.... without me saying anything wrong you both made the effort of putting each others 'foot in mouth'.
Thank you very much .... much appreciated.
Just so you know... i'm not anti British but more anti Island dweller mentality By phrasing your remarks the way you did you show absolutely no professional courtesy to your fellow Pilots and FA's.
Why don't you make this a lesson in "how unpredictable pax can be", should do fine on your next CRM refresher.
you might think about this the next time the pax pull a rabbit out of your hat.
So don't be a
and accept the fact that there are more configurations than the one you call home.See ya
pointer
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 2,044
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My 2ps worth...
The best part of this post is the number of know-alls who have posted "facts" that are easily shown as rubbish...
Anyway, we spend all our time preaching to the PAX to listen to the safety demo, and we complain when they don't. In that demo, we tell them how to open the door (we don't say wait for the cabin crew to do so), how to deploy the side (if it doesn't do it automatically) etc. etc. And that's before the special requirements for overwing exits not manned by Cabin Crew. So its hardly surprising that once in a while some actually do listen to that demo, and when they perceive a fire, they do what we have told them...
<<I've had and seen a few Hot-Starts and they are indeed nothing more than momentry flashes. Certainly not a reason for a passenger to initiate an uncommanded evac.>>
I'm glad you were there, and can categorically state exactly how THIS hot start looked. I have seen a few, varying from a small flash, to a number of seconds worth of 20-30 feet of flames (usually after a "wet start"). Not dangerous, but to a PAX probably looks so.
This is one of those incidents that is probably inevitable from time to time. It is worth investigating, to try and minimise a recurrence. However, lets not blow it out of all proportion....
<<Imagine if the crew had started to taxy just as the first pax hit the slide>>
Well - I hope they would stop when they got the door open indication!
<<Chutes on an overwing exit? My god I gotta read the AOM some more>>
Another "know all" !! B742? A320? Sounds from someone here B757 as well....
NoD
The best part of this post is the number of know-alls who have posted "facts" that are easily shown as rubbish...
Anyway, we spend all our time preaching to the PAX to listen to the safety demo, and we complain when they don't. In that demo, we tell them how to open the door (we don't say wait for the cabin crew to do so), how to deploy the side (if it doesn't do it automatically) etc. etc. And that's before the special requirements for overwing exits not manned by Cabin Crew. So its hardly surprising that once in a while some actually do listen to that demo, and when they perceive a fire, they do what we have told them...
<<I've had and seen a few Hot-Starts and they are indeed nothing more than momentry flashes. Certainly not a reason for a passenger to initiate an uncommanded evac.>>
I'm glad you were there, and can categorically state exactly how THIS hot start looked. I have seen a few, varying from a small flash, to a number of seconds worth of 20-30 feet of flames (usually after a "wet start"). Not dangerous, but to a PAX probably looks so.
This is one of those incidents that is probably inevitable from time to time. It is worth investigating, to try and minimise a recurrence. However, lets not blow it out of all proportion....
<<Imagine if the crew had started to taxy just as the first pax hit the slide>>
Well - I hope they would stop when they got the door open indication!
<<Chutes on an overwing exit? My god I gotta read the AOM some more>>
Another "know all" !! B742? A320? Sounds from someone here B757 as well....
NoD
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 361
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Gee thanks Pointer HA HA HA vv funny, rather have my mentality than 10 of yours M8 ,anyday.
And i believe you were the first to show your incongruence in professional courtesy in your initial reply to me.
( as pointed out by others).
As i said before ,i've know for years that many US 75's have OW's.
I merely pointed out that there would be a hell of a scene in the cabin before people started flipping exits open - surely some crew would have been nearby to prevent this if it was unwarranted ???
After all , Americans in general, are reasonably vocal.
A perfectly reasonable point of view.
Also, i am not an island dweller,as you seem to think but part of a union of countries , who i believe i have more in common with, than many of you guys do state-to-state.
Alot of people were humble-ized by recent events ,you obviously missed out somewhere.
I didn't come on here for a slanging match, but to offer some salient points, i have worked on 757's for 16 years now.
Another point from this - Does everyone not think that TOO MUCH information is given in onboard safety video's?
Most graphically demonstrate how each type of exit is opened , and again this week another pax has tried to open an exit inflight on ironically . . a 757!
I think that no mention of exit operation should be mentioned in the pre-flight video , as it is readily apparent when you get to the door anyway.( A dam great handle on most airliners, with an arrow pointing to 'open').
And i believe you were the first to show your incongruence in professional courtesy in your initial reply to me.
( as pointed out by others).
As i said before ,i've know for years that many US 75's have OW's.
I merely pointed out that there would be a hell of a scene in the cabin before people started flipping exits open - surely some crew would have been nearby to prevent this if it was unwarranted ???
After all , Americans in general, are reasonably vocal.
A perfectly reasonable point of view.
Also, i am not an island dweller,as you seem to think but part of a union of countries , who i believe i have more in common with, than many of you guys do state-to-state.
Alot of people were humble-ized by recent events ,you obviously missed out somewhere.
I didn't come on here for a slanging match, but to offer some salient points, i have worked on 757's for 16 years now.
Another point from this - Does everyone not think that TOO MUCH information is given in onboard safety video's?
Most graphically demonstrate how each type of exit is opened , and again this week another pax has tried to open an exit inflight on ironically . . a 757!
I think that no mention of exit operation should be mentioned in the pre-flight video , as it is readily apparent when you get to the door anyway.( A dam great handle on most airliners, with an arrow pointing to 'open').
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: London, UK
Posts: 75
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NigelOnDraft makes some sensible points. Now I've never seen a Hot Start (never heard of them before this thread), but as a mere fare paying punter I think that if I did - and especially if it was one of those 20 foot dragon types NOD mentions - then there would be a certain amount of trouser clenching going on.
I'm not sure I'd be doing my "I'm a a passenger, get me out of here!" thing though I may mention it to the CC. So are they briefed/knowledgable on these things to mop fevered brows? And is there a given set of circumstances whereby you may well be expecting a burp as you start up and would it make sense for the drivers to make a PA on the matter? Or would that be more likely to get the unwashed masses in a flap?
I shall obviously now spend my time begging for slightly rear-of-wing seats when flying in order to witness this phenomenon and then be able to show off my vast knowledge of all things aviation to assuage my fellow travellers! Well done PPRuNe ...
Duncan
I'm not sure I'd be doing my "I'm a a passenger, get me out of here!" thing though I may mention it to the CC. So are they briefed/knowledgable on these things to mop fevered brows? And is there a given set of circumstances whereby you may well be expecting a burp as you start up and would it make sense for the drivers to make a PA on the matter? Or would that be more likely to get the unwashed masses in a flap?
I shall obviously now spend my time begging for slightly rear-of-wing seats when flying in order to witness this phenomenon and then be able to show off my vast knowledge of all things aviation to assuage my fellow travellers! Well done PPRuNe ...
Duncan