United captain arrested at Edinburgh
Nope, it was the Delta driver [Under The Influence] that was remanded in custody yesterday [i.e. locked up] until sentencing at the Sherriff Court at the end of this month. From previous cases & current trends, this is a probably a fairly strong indication that there will be a custodial part to the overall sentence, or he's regarded as likely to abscond beforehand. If not, he'd more likley be released on bail until sentencing.
Current wherabouts of the United guy [Taser] is not known at this point, but as there was no word of hium being remnded in custody, I suspect he was either released on very large bond & his Company involved in assuring the Court of his return, or passport confiscated & daily reporting to a nominated police station in the locality, accomodation & sustenance being to his own account.
Current wherabouts of the United guy [Taser] is not known at this point, but as there was no word of hium being remnded in custody, I suspect he was either released on very large bond & his Company involved in assuring the Court of his return, or passport confiscated & daily reporting to a nominated police station in the locality, accomodation & sustenance being to his own account.
The Delta Captain was remanded in custody last year.He is still in custody awaiting sentencing following his recent guilty plea before a judge. The ten months on remand will be credited against his sentence
An American airline pilot was caught over the alcohol limit before he was due to fly a Boeing 767 full of passengers from Edinburgh to New York.
Lawrence Russell, 63, was searched by airport security officers at about 08:00 on 16 June last year.
He was found to have two bottles of Jägermeister in his luggage - one of which was half full.
Russell, a captain with Delta Airlines, was later arrested following a failed breath test.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland...-fife-68481282
The pilot was remanded in custody at Edinburgh Sheriff Court after pleading guilty to reporting for duty as a pilot while being impaired through drink or drugs.
He is still in custody awaiting sentencing following the recent court appearance.
The court also heard his alcohol level was over double the legal limit, with his lawyer Pamela Rogers providing the court with a medical report of the treatment Russell has been receiving for his alcoholism.Sentencing has been deferred to later this month for the preparation of reports.
A Delta spokesperson said: “While Delta does not comment on on-going legal cases, Delta’s alcohol policy is among the strictest in the industry and we have no tolerance for violation.”
She added that he was "under no illusion" to the seriousness of the offence.
With time served he will probably be released soon.
However the biggest punishment is the obvious end of his career.
An American airline pilot was caught over the alcohol limit before he was due to fly a Boeing 767 full of passengers from Edinburgh to New York.
Lawrence Russell, 63, was searched by airport security officers at about 08:00 on 16 June last year.
He was found to have two bottles of Jägermeister in his luggage - one of which was half full.
Russell, a captain with Delta Airlines, was later arrested following a failed breath test.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland...-fife-68481282
The pilot was remanded in custody at Edinburgh Sheriff Court after pleading guilty to reporting for duty as a pilot while being impaired through drink or drugs.
He is still in custody awaiting sentencing following the recent court appearance.
The court also heard his alcohol level was over double the legal limit, with his lawyer Pamela Rogers providing the court with a medical report of the treatment Russell has been receiving for his alcoholism.Sentencing has been deferred to later this month for the preparation of reports.
A Delta spokesperson said: “While Delta does not comment on on-going legal cases, Delta’s alcohol policy is among the strictest in the industry and we have no tolerance for violation.”
She added that he was "under no illusion" to the seriousness of the offence.
With time served he will probably be released soon.
However the biggest punishment is the obvious end of his career.
Last edited by Mike Flynn; 7th Mar 2024 at 02:19.
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: LHR
Posts: 556
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The BBC reports suggests that the Captain first aroused the interest of security personnel when liquids were detected in his baggage, presumably at the staff security checkpoint. The suspicion that he was under the influence must have come to light in the ensuing conversation. Perhaps this serves as a reminder to all crew that chronic alcohol abusers are secret addicts and are well practiced at hiding their addiction.
Having met the crew in the hotel lobby over a coffee, and travelled with them in the confines of the crew transport, it seems strange that nobody noticed anything out of the ordinary. What I find most scary is that he attempted to take his alcohol on board, presumably to 'top-up' during flight.
Having met the crew in the hotel lobby over a coffee, and travelled with them in the confines of the crew transport, it seems strange that nobody noticed anything out of the ordinary. What I find most scary is that he attempted to take his alcohol on board, presumably to 'top-up' during flight.
At Delta all crew luggage goes onboard. No crew bags are checked. Pilot bags go in the cockpit and one designated storage area in the front galley within view of passengers. Captains bag always goes in the cockpit and you are never alone. It would be next to impossible to top off. It can be very difficult to detect a long term alcoholic who is under the influence. They are very adept at hiding it.
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Village of Santo Poco
Posts: 869
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I havent a clue whether he really is an alcoholic or is using the claim as part of his defence, but assuming there is some truth in his claimed addiction I am concerned at your attitude to mental illness. However my main concern is how he passed repeated medicals and escaped detection if he was really under medical treatment for addiction.
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: MUC
Posts: 107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: GLASGOW
Posts: 1,289
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I havent a clue whether he really is an alcoholic or is using the claim as part of his defence, but assuming there is some truth in his claimed addiction I am concerned at your attitude to mental illness. However my main concern is how he passed repeated medicals and escaped detection if he was really under medical treatment for addiction.
And then bingo, one alert security person pulls him at EDI? Mmmmmmm...
Agree entirely. He was 63, nearing retirement. So he pitches up at hotel reception, musters and shares a ride to the airport, navigates pre flight, navigates to the aircraft, time and time again, and no one, not one, over his career stretch, knew? The AME that conducted his medicals, and his SIM rides???
And then bingo, one alert security person pulls him at EDI? Mmmmmmm...
And then bingo, one alert security person pulls him at EDI? Mmmmmmm...
Avoid imitations
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 14,573
Received 422 Likes
on
222 Posts
It’s well over twice the legal limit.
That seems incredibly low. Where I live it's not even close to the legal limit (for auto drivers, dunno about airplanes).
>> The legal blood alcohol limit for fully licensed drivers in Ontario is 0.08% or 80 mg of alcohol for every 100 ml of blood. Any higher and you can face criminal charges
I'll wager one beer would take you pretty close to 49mg.
>> The legal blood alcohol limit for fully licensed drivers in Ontario is 0.08% or 80 mg of alcohol for every 100 ml of blood. Any higher and you can face criminal charges
I'll wager one beer would take you pretty close to 49mg.
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: uk
Posts: 74
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Is it legal for flight crew to carry alcohol in their carry on/flight bags? This captain had a bottle and a half of jaegermeister in his bag and this is what brought him to the attention of security? There was another just before Christmas where the pilot got to security, chickened out and dumped a bottle of vodka in the toilet, this alerted security and resulted in his arrest for a FUI
Avoid imitations
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 14,573
Received 422 Likes
on
222 Posts
The blood/alcohol limit for flying is set lower than for driving. It was reduced to 20mg /100ml quite some time ago and was well publicised.
The driving limit is 80mg in many places in the world but only 50mg in Scotland.
The driving limit is 80mg in many places in the world but only 50mg in Scotland.
It is difficult to argue that a stiff drink before aviating should be allowed, however the hoopla and publicity is very disproportionate to the actual risk. If the pilot in question was a tee-totaller who didn’t get a great night’s rest (time zones, busy roster, noise, etc.) but felt kind of OK after a cup of coffee, very few would be questioning his fitness to fly but, as countless accident reports have detailed (including the recent one from Pakistan), tiredness, fatigue, hypoglycaemia, worry and stress are far more potent performance degraders than a BAC only detectable by sophisticated equipment.
If 1% of the effort put into alcohol screening and security theatre was instead concentrated on the real dangers above, the aviation world would be a safer place. Yes, don’t drink and fly but even if no-one ever did, it’s not going to do anything to improve the accident statistics. For those with real issues, peer intervention and employer support work much better than anything else.
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 83
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To put it in perspective,. the drink drive limit in England is 80Mg per 100Ml of blood.
The much more restrictive limit in Scotland is 50Mg per 100 Ml of blood, which amounts to about a half pint an hour prior.
49Mg per 100ml blood is really very low indeed. He almost certainly consumed the alcohol well before and probably was neither impaired or smelling of alcohol.
It's not ok, the law is the law and to be honest drinking at all while down route isn't wise or necessary but has been vastly blown out of proportion by the media.
It's a shame he's lost his career over this but the law is the law and it should be a warning to all of us that the limit is so low.
The much more restrictive limit in Scotland is 50Mg per 100 Ml of blood, which amounts to about a half pint an hour prior.
49Mg per 100ml blood is really very low indeed. He almost certainly consumed the alcohol well before and probably was neither impaired or smelling of alcohol.
It's not ok, the law is the law and to be honest drinking at all while down route isn't wise or necessary but has been vastly blown out of proportion by the media.
It's a shame he's lost his career over this but the law is the law and it should be a warning to all of us that the limit is so low.
Last edited by Boabity; 10th Mar 2024 at 14:59.
FW I agree. In addition, Aviation in the USA and UK leads the world with CRM, good attitudes and behaviours. The further east of London that you go, problems become quite serious. It is not pretty.
Medicine is still water skiing about 20 years behind aviation in this respect. Both industries have their problems with drink drugs etc. Spot checks are the way forward. Already in use in USA. The innocent have nothing to fear, as always
Medicine is still water skiing about 20 years behind aviation in this respect. Both industries have their problems with drink drugs etc. Spot checks are the way forward. Already in use in USA. The innocent have nothing to fear, as always
Yes. Alcohol and flying shouldn’t be mixed, but the practical effect of 49mg is zero, although a line has to be drawn somewhere.
It is difficult to argue that a stiff drink before aviating should be allowed, however the hoopla and publicity is very disproportionate to the actual risk. If the pilot in question was a tee-totaller who didn’t get a great night’s rest (time zones, busy roster, noise, etc.) but felt kind of OK after a cup of coffee, very few would be questioning his fitness to fly but, as countless accident reports have detailed (including the recent one from Pakistan), tiredness, fatigue, hypoglycaemia, worry and stress are far more potent performance degraders than a BAC only detectable by sophisticated equipment.
If 1% of the effort put into alcohol screening and security theatre was instead concentrated on the real dangers above, the aviation world would be a safer place. Yes, don’t drink and fly but even if no-one ever did, it’s not going to do anything to improve the accident statistics. For those with real issues, peer intervention and employer support work much better than anything else.
It is difficult to argue that a stiff drink before aviating should be allowed, however the hoopla and publicity is very disproportionate to the actual risk. If the pilot in question was a tee-totaller who didn’t get a great night’s rest (time zones, busy roster, noise, etc.) but felt kind of OK after a cup of coffee, very few would be questioning his fitness to fly but, as countless accident reports have detailed (including the recent one from Pakistan), tiredness, fatigue, hypoglycaemia, worry and stress are far more potent performance degraders than a BAC only detectable by sophisticated equipment.
If 1% of the effort put into alcohol screening and security theatre was instead concentrated on the real dangers above, the aviation world would be a safer place. Yes, don’t drink and fly but even if no-one ever did, it’s not going to do anything to improve the accident statistics. For those with real issues, peer intervention and employer support work much better than anything else.
You have no evidence of this, zero.
How many taxiway incursions, runway incursions, almost accidents, ATC clearance deviations (may) have been the result of impairment?
Neither one of us could provide evidence for either side of the argument as testing is only required after an accident or incident with significant damage.
However the truth might be hiding in plain sight.
Peer intervention? Peer pressure you mean?
People are pack animals and ‘group feel’ is strong. Being the odd one out for not going out to dinner with fellow crew as drinking is somewhat expected? The don’t-worry-we’re-all-drinking attitude?
Cabin crew that gets absolutely hammered on overnights?
That maybe I’ve had one to many feeling in the morning?
Calling in sick and self disclosure of an issue is something else entirely then getting caught while attempting to gain access to an aircraft with the intention of ‘getting away with it again’ which is criminal.
Last edited by B2N2; 10th Mar 2024 at 15:24.
Neither one of us could provide evidence for either side of the argument as testing is only required after an accident or incident with significant damage.
However the truth might be hiding in plain sight.
However the truth might be hiding in plain sight.
Peer intervention? Peer pressure you mean?
People are pack animals and ‘group feel’ is strong. Being the odd one out for not going out to dinner with fellow crew as drinking is somewhat expected? The don’t-worry-we’re-all-drinking attitude?
Cabin crew that gets absolutely hammered on overnights?
That maybe I’ve had one to many feeling in the morning?
Calling in sick and self disclosure of an issue is something else entirely then getting caught while attempting to gain access to an aircraft with the intention of ‘getting away with it again’ which is criminal.
Cabin crew that gets absolutely hammered on overnights?
That maybe I’ve had one to many feeling in the morning?
Calling in sick and self disclosure of an issue is something else entirely then getting caught while attempting to gain access to an aircraft with the intention of ‘getting away with it again’ which is criminal.