Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

GA aircraft to be equipped with autoland

Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

GA aircraft to be equipped with autoland

Old 6th Nov 2019, 08:22
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Relocating at present.
Age: 62
Posts: 115
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
GA aircraft to be equipped with autoland

A passenger activated auto land system; what could possibly go wrong? It basically, transmitting blind, grants itself permission to enter controlled airspace and attempt a landing at what could be a major international airport.

Garmin Autoland to Permit Emergency Touchdowns for General Aviation Planes

"Once activated the system calculates a flight plan to the most suitable airport, initiates an approach to the runway and automatically lands the aircraft without pilot or passenger intervention,"
https://www.aviationtoday.com/2019/1...iation-planes/
OPENDOOR is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 08:27
  #2 (permalink)  

Avoid imitations
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 14,550
Received 388 Likes on 201 Posts
As a helicopter pilot I doubt it will ever do me out of a job.
ShyTorque is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 08:50
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Below transition level
Posts: 363
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Much like the CAPS system in Cirrus aircraft this is a tool to be used in exceptional circumstances. Probably better than a passenger with no experience of handling a GA aircraft or radio-telephony sticking it into a smoking hole in the ground.

If I was a controller at a busy airport with a GA aircraft with an incapacitated pilot in the zone, I would much rather that an auto-pilot was flying a published arrival to the airfield and making radio calls, even if those calls were blind. That way the aircraft is flying in a stable and known approach and everyone else can be vectored out of the way!
Fostex is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 09:26
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: FNQ ... It's Permanent!
Posts: 4,278
Received 161 Likes on 82 Posts
Originally Posted by OPENDOOR
A passenger activated auto land system; what could possibly go wrong?
Typical knee jerk reaction! You haven’t been following this in the aviation media have you!
A potential life saving device. Hopefully it will not be needed.
Capt Fathom is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 09:27
  #5 (permalink)  
BRE
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Europe
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Wouldn't that require the GA airplane to have servos for control surfaces and throttle?
BRE is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 09:40
  #6 (permalink)  
JRK
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Europe
Posts: 75
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I am of a view, that these kind of things will lead to further pilot skill deterioration and more poor quality decisions. These hyper safety drives underestimate an important psychological aspect: if you know you have a failsafe like this on your aircraft - a magic bail out button - you are more likely to make reckless decisions and have a slack approach to your flying. Same thing with the GA aircraft parachute systems. Just my opinion.
JRK is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 09:41
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: FNQ ... It's Permanent!
Posts: 4,278
Received 161 Likes on 82 Posts
Probably not so JRK.
In my case, despite still holding a Class One Medical, I am not prepared to fly single pilot in light aircraft, especially with family onboard.
Access to an aircraft with CAPS or Autoland could change my mind, but unfortunately not available to me at present.

Garmin Video.
It requires the aircraft to be equipped with the Garmin 3000 Avionics and Autothrottle.

Capt Fathom is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 09:59
  #8 (permalink)  
Pegase Driver
 
Join Date: May 1997
Location: Europe
Age: 73
Posts: 3,674
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Great stuff for those who can afford it. Because unlike a ballistic parachute that can be fitted relatively cheaply in a Cirrus or any ultra light for less than 10.000 $ , according the website this kit is 300.000 $ on new and possibly over half a million as retrofit,
But I guess it is more PR to offer something different to new buyers, than actually a need that will be saving lots of lives . How many such cases are there per year of incapacitated single pilot in Business GA aircraft ? , not talking about C172 or PA28s.., those will never get this gadget..
ATC Watcher is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 11:01
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Below transition level
Posts: 363
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Keep in mind that a £400 DJI drone one can purchase from an Apple Store has more sophisticated inertial, GPS and computer vision based guidance than a multi-million missile from 10-20 years ago. These systems will come down in price.

The only paradox is that, as ATC Watcher pointed out, the aircraft most likely to suffer single pilot incapacitation, e.g. small GA aircraft with Class 2 certified PIC, are the aircraft least likely to be fitted with this system.
Fostex is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 11:19
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Home
Posts: 1,019
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
BRE
Read the article RTFQ. It only applies to a/c with full Garmin 3000 A/P and A/T at moment.
Tested on Cirrus Jet and Piper M600.
cessnapete is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 11:46
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Near Stuttgart, Germany
Posts: 1,093
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by cessnapete
It only applies to a/c with full Garmin 3000 A/P and A/T at moment.
Tested on Cirrus Jet and Piper M600.
Yes. What is the probability that one of these aircraft and an incapacitated pilot share the same moment in space and time? It may never be used in real life. Unless the pilots of these aircraft use it for their normal landings as well...
Still, it I could afford to fly around in a 2M$ aircraft privately it would probably give me some extra peace of mind to know that my passengers are cared for in the best possible way just in case.

what next is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 12:07
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Europe
Posts: 453
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Posted this yesterday in the tech log section: True 100% Autoland. No Crew Input needed.
733driver is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 12:19
  #13 (permalink)  
c52
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Surrey
Posts: 2,258
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Would have stopped the Germanwings disaster.
c52 is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 12:23
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Outer ring of HEL
Posts: 1,648
Received 189 Likes on 84 Posts
Originally Posted by c52
Would have stopped the Germanwings disaster.
Can't see that, but would've saved Helios.
Beamr is offline  
Old 6th Nov 2019, 12:30
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Usually on top
Posts: 176
Received 15 Likes on 5 Posts
Add auto takeoff and we can do away with all those knobs and buttons. And the persons claiming to fly the things.
physicus is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2019, 05:25
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Connecticut, USA
Age: 64
Posts: 252
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Beamr
Can't see that, but would've saved Helios.
Would have saved the plane, but what condition were the passengers in by that point?
jugofpropwash is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2019, 05:29
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Outer ring of HEL
Posts: 1,648
Received 189 Likes on 84 Posts
Originally Posted by jugofpropwash
Would have saved the plane, but what condition were the passengers in by that point?
In better condition than in current outcome?
Beamr is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2019, 05:58
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Confusio Helvetica
Posts: 311
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
On loss of cabin pressure, it automatically kicks and requires being overridden. It also does so if it thinks the pilot is acting all VFR-in-IMC. Just hope that the guy who emergency autolanded ahead of you has a greater stopping distance.
DingerX is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2019, 23:54
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 222
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
My company had a nasty TCAS experience when a Corp Jet ‘auto descended’ following a loss of cabin pressure... as an active Cirrus instructor I love the technology but hopefully the airport it chooses has the capacity to handle HAL inbound...
neilki is offline  
Old 9th Nov 2019, 02:11
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Canada
Posts: 602
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Automatic autoland but I sure hope it also communicates with ATC etc......
Longtimer is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.