Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

British Airways Centenary Becomes A PR Nightmare

Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

British Airways Centenary Becomes A PR Nightmare

Old 9th Sep 2019, 12:08
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 761
In the British Army, up until a few years ago, the first response to a mutiny was to sack, punish, or otherwise deal with the mutinous unit's officers, on the certain grounds that it was their fault.

Now, while we can all say with total truth that what BA has is a bunch of whingeing, overpaid Nigels cynically using their muscle to screw BA for more than they are worth by making hundreds of thousands of their customers (aka "salary payers") suffer, the blame for allowing the situation to get this far lies fairly and squarely in the IAG boardroom, who evidently have no clue about how to deal effectively with the said Nigels, who seem unable to understand that profits, just like losses, are for shareholders (aka "investors taking risks") to share, as opposed to Directors and other employees whose share of the gross profits is called "remuneration". Mind you, the Directors don't seem to understand that either.

Last edited by old,not bold; 9th Sep 2019 at 13:11.
old,not bold is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2019, 12:26
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 6,241
Here at London City we have BA, as in Cityflyer (not that many pax would know) with little of the above. The drinks and snacks are free on board. The crew are always great. And above all there is NO STRIKE today and they are carrying on just as normal. Doubtless with 100% loads on many routes. And yet the BA PR team seem to have been quite unable to push this fact out to the media. There must be a good few who think their LCY flights are not operating.
WHBM is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2019, 12:38
  #43 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: my cockpit
Posts: 172
Way to go, BA guys and gals !! I'm all with you on this one.
FRying is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2019, 12:43
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 711
Originally Posted by Bueno Hombre View Post
We can imagine that the huge increase in the profitability of British Airways is almost entirely due to the fall in the value of the pound.
You keep peddling this but seeing as most expenses in aviation are denominated in USD (fuel, maintenance parts etc) and the GBP:USD exchange rate is at historic lows then how can this possibly be true?
RexBanner is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2019, 13:40
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: London
Posts: 4
BCAL

Remember your history...BA was financially featherbedded by Thatcher pre-privatisation in order to kill British Caledonian. BA was never really a great carrier. BCAL was. A truly great airline, first 402 certificate in history, invented business class, devoted employees, fantastic, dedicated cabin crew and pilots.
pittsspecialguy is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2019, 17:09
  #46 (permalink)  

"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: England
Age: 72
Posts: 2,945
"I wish they all could be Caledonian Girls". Super cabin crew (at least on shorthaul; can't speak for longhaul). When BA had the "Shuttle" service Aberdeen to Heathrow, Caledonian ran the "Subtle" service to Gatwick. Far, far better.
Herod is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2019, 17:29
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: FL390
Posts: 304
. Now, while we can all say with total truth that what BA has is a bunch of whingeing, overpaid Nigels cynically using their muscle to screw BA for more than they are worth
Just a bunch but I'm guessing you didn't get the job at BA when you applied...
Fursty Ferret is offline  
Old 9th Sep 2019, 19:32
  #48 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: London
Posts: 8
I'm not clever enough to know whether the pilots are either whinging or overpaid. What I am convinced about is that the fallout from this dispute has been disproportionately heightened by the incredible stupidity surrounding communication with passengers and the media. Whatever you think of the pilots' position, Balpa gave plenty warning. Management, once again, messed up. Will Mr Cruz never pick up on the point that cheap does not always mean good.
Icerefugee is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2019, 11:03
  #49 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 49
Extreme cutbacks are suffocating BA

The poor communications with pax (not for the first time) and the totally inadequate data resilience after the outage last year rather supports the pilots' contention that BA has lost the plot by curtting back infrastructure costs to such an extreme that the business is suffering. There is always a time lag between cutting costs to the bone (immediate benefit to the bottom line) and declining activity and reputation (disaster for the bottom line) which allows directors to take handsome bonuses in the interim. Sorry to say that BA seems to be on that curve now. Nice if someone could correct me.
oscarisapc is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2019, 18:42
  #50 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: WILTSHIRE
Posts: 82
Originally Posted by Old King Coal View Post
Wrt removal of 'travel perks' from striking flightcrew... two can play at that game.

Given that a Captain's word is final, i.e. as to who's allowed to travel, a Captain is perfectly within their rights to deny travel to any passenger.
The simple phrase of "I do not consider that your presence onboard is conducive to good order and accordingly you must leave the aeroplane" would be enough to have a passenger removed and no further reason or explanation is required of the Captain. The Captain's word is always the final arbiter.

So, BA Management types (whom have kept their 'travel perks') might find that those perks are not worth a jot when they're not allowed onboard because the BA Captain says "No" to their presence, and maybe also a similar implementation for Management staff whom are travelling on duty might help to focus some BA Management minds?
Sadly , therein lies one of the reasons for the strike. It is not really about the 11.5% at all. That Captains word is not final in BA. There would follow a person to person interview with a manager - perhaps just a telephone interview if you are lucky - inorder for them to assess your judgement call and take what they feel is appropriate action. Bullies
red9 is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2019, 18:46
  #51 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 121
Originally Posted by RexBanner View Post


You keep peddling this but seeing as most expenses in aviation are denominated in USD (fuel, maintenance parts etc) and the GBP:USD exchange rate is at historic lows then how can this possibly be true?
BA generates dollars and other currencies by selling tickets to London in other countries. Converted to pounds to pay salaries they buy more. Simplistic but you get the drift.
ciderman is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2019, 18:54
  #52 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: uk
Posts: 49
It only requires a continuous 4 or 5 days strike and no simulator checks being completed and there is a tipping point when there are not enough crews in check but I’m sure management are aware of this as will BALPA be
Phantom4 is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 09:07
  #53 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Right hand seat
Posts: 91
An earlier poster stated ...”its a damned sight better than Vueling/Air Malta/Ryanair/Eurowings/Wizz etc.”. I am afraid that really says it all - you are comparing BA (known as Budget Airlines in my circle), with the exception of Air Malta perhaps, with low cost carriers. We should be comparing BA with Lufthansa, whom I fly with regularly, KLM & Air France. Having flown recently on Turkish in economy, I was stunned to receive a menu with 2 choices of hot meal on the flight from Instanbul to Munich.
Mike Oxbig is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 10:06
  #54 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: The South
Posts: 69
Originally Posted by Icerefugee View Post
I'm not clever enough to know whether the pilots are either whinging or overpaid. What I am convinced about is that the fallout from this dispute has been disproportionately heightened by the incredible stupidity surrounding communication with passengers and the media. Whatever you think of the pilots' position, Balpa gave plenty warning. Management, once again, messed up. Will Mr Cruz never pick up on the point that cheap does not always mean good.
Short answer NO. It was he who cut and expanded Vueling at the same time and presided over total chaos as the system fell over and the result was that he got BA to play with. This is standard MO in BA where managers are paid bonuses for coming in under budget with no penalty when the result of cuts is collapse. They are all in thrall to Mr O'Leary and of course having to compete with him. They have learned that everyone hates Ryanair, pax, staff et al but the profits keep rolling in.

Sure BA jocks earn plenty but in truth when you take responsibiity and skill levels required that should be the norm, not the exception.
Timmy Tomkins is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 10:36
  #55 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 761
Originally Posted by Fursty Ferret View Post
Just a bunch but I'm guessing you didn't get the job at BA when you applied...
Ah, but I did. OK, it was then BOAC, and the job was with an Associate Company. But we still had to undergo the full recruitment process with BOAC.
old,not bold is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 13:51
  #56 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: LHR
Posts: 415
Apparently the spin given by the BA management easily persuades some simpletons here. The average salary of a BA pilot is 160k p/a! Really!!! Therefore anyone that gets paid more than me is an overpaid sponger.....

The Atlantic Barons on the old contract big bucks are either gone or close to retirement. The company comprises many new pilots who have either trained with BA and have the $$$$ obscene debt from the experience or the direct entry guys who have moved on from Easy or Ryanair. The ab-initios earn around 26k before deductions and the direct entry guys 45-50 with all new hires going on the new contract.

They want a pay rise linked to RPI, not one that might just keep pace with inflation. By the looks of it BA want this strike more than the pilots. Top of BA's wish-list is BALPA out of the picture. Then BA can get of with slashing costs and squeezing employees without union interference. It's all about profit, profit and more profit.
Magplug is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 14:36
  #57 (permalink)  
Paxing All Over The World
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hertfordshire, UK.
Age: 63
Posts: 8,906
Yes, it is Magplug but as is always the case - everyone loses. The mgmt have failed in the last 20 years (as countless others have done) to manage their business for the true long term. Flight and Cabin crew are scrunched by it all and nothing helpful will come of this. Strikes rarely bring good things - especially when the public does not see the employee's problem.

We can blame who we like but it is another nail in the coffin.
PAXboy is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 14:52
  #58 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Ireland
Age: 46
Posts: 150
This is just boring.

It is a race to the bottom. An eternal one. You do it faster, cheaper, better. Tomorrow a compeditor will do it slightly more effectively. Management will work out a new method to do it faster, cheaper, better! Why? Well consumers want cheaper, faster.....and aspire to better! And it is a vicious circle. Because we've all less pay, we need cheaper, better, faster! Management at BA most likely wish they had the "Worlds fave airline". This won't change anytime soon - so it will be a continuous erosion of service standards until we are all standing up in the cabin, eating from paper boxes ........in an argument it is better for the environment etc. But it will be dressed up as Club class or whatever..........
Shamrogue is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 16:44
  #59 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 10,785
Originally Posted by Shamrogue View Post
Management will work out a new method to do it faster, cheaper, better!
As the old saying goes, pick any two.

DaveReidUK is offline  
Old 11th Sep 2019, 17:22
  #60 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: uk
Age: 51
Posts: 89
Icanseeclearly is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.