IATA concerned about increase in problem passengers

[rotornut]

?We?re having to be bouncers?: More problem passengers flying, industry says - The Globe and Mail

[ExXB]

So when they say.

Alcohol or drug intoxication was identified in 23 per cent of cases, but the “vast majority” of these instances involved the consumption of alcohol or drugs before boarding or from “personal supply without knowledge of the crew.”

Are they talking about the vast majority of 23%, or the vast majority of all cases?

So what's the other 77% then?

[Piltdown Man]

As an organisation we have suffered from only a few disruptive passengers. They vary from drunks in the cheap seats to bolshy individuals in the front. Alchohol has been a factor in most of the cases and the very worst are groups who have had too much. The remainder were "difficult" people, the sort who will not take no for an answer, especially from a girl. Others had personal problems and one or two had psychological problems. And the rest, who knows.

The strangest thing is that when (if) the troublesome muppets face the authorities, rarely they do they think they have done anything wrong. They think you are over-reacting and they tell you that they were only having a bit of fun. And I can see why. Over the past few years we have put with this type of behaviour. Only when it is made totally clear such behaviour is not acceptable will things change. And that will take at least one generation to fix. Until then, my company will bounce these people off in ones and twos and the charter/LoCos will chuck them off in 10s and 20s.

Solutions: The threat of fines and imprisonment appear not to work. So something else is required. A good start would be a mandatory fine and imprisonment. Then full recovery of costs. Then a permanent passport ban would top it off nicely. For foreign nationals a lifetime exclusion would be imposed when they leave prison.

Not very progressive or left-wing I know, but their methods have been shown to be useless.

[ZFT]

It might help if carriers started life bans for these idiots. Pooling of information would prevent them repeating on other carriers.

[Hotel Tango]

Piltdown Man, I'm not convinced that your solution would work either. Most of these offenders come to terms with what plonkers they were once sobered up. Punishment after the event is not preventative with the exception maybe of that particular person. The greatest problem is people simply not knowing to what extent drink will affect them. If they're in a group some will find themselves drinking well in excess simply trying to keep up with their less affected peers. Once they've crossed the line they are no longer aware of what they're doing or saying. The solution is not punishment but education and thus prevention. Yes, I agree, easier said than done.

[Fire and brimstone]

I am not sure IATA are correct - what do they base this claim on?

I've seen assorted press releases by the media trying to stir this up into an industry wide issue. Almost every time the airlines say that it is a small - even rare - event.

I am absolutely certain airline staff are encouraged to report bad passengers (drunk / abuse / violence) back to the company. Based on so little information, as these incidents are rare, how can this claim be made.

Lets be honest: there is no serious problem with lots and lots of drunk or abusive air passengers, so there must be some other agenda.

Someone said above that these 'idiots' should be banned.

How can an airline ban someone when the problem does not really exist?!!

[SMT Member]

The problem is, in 99 out of 100 cases, alcohol. Some people just can't handle it and, I'm sorry to say, but the LCC world of today has brought some less desirables into the cabin, who wouldn't have had the opportunity before. It is, as good as always, males in the age 18-50, who've had a drink or two before leaving home, then a couple more in the bar and a swig off the something in the plastic bag on the way out to the gate.

This is where my staff meet them, and they've got a very, very difficult job on their hands. We hire and train them for their friendly and serviceminded personality, whilst trying to dress them up for the odd idiot passing their way. But it's service and friendly we're mostly looking for, the exact same thing psychopaths are looking for in a victim. And, yes, we do have to serve psychopaths; no booking machine are yet to ask 'are you a complete moron or suffering from any disturbing psychological trauma?'

We do our best to keep them off the aircraft, sometime to the physical or verbal detriment of our staff. It is, you understand, entirely their fault the aircraft left on-time and you didn't make it, because there were Jägerbombs on sale in the bar. We see the worst kind of verbal abuse, and on very rare occasions also violence. It must be a big man indeed, punching a 60kg, 160cm, girl out because she was doing her job.

We've also had our female staff stalked, including one particularly nasty person sneaking up on her back as she was walking down the pier, promising to do the nastiest of things to her, attempting to grab and chasing her into a toilet where he stood outside and basically promised to rape and kill her. That girl, by the way, is still receiving psychological help and is unlikely to return to work. Because a drunken passenger couldn't behave himself and threatened other passengers in the departure lounge, upon which he was denied boarding.

How to stop it? Only by making the rest of us 'suffer' for the actions of a, relative, few: By banning the sale and consumption of alcohol in airports and onboard commercial aircraft. It was possible with smoking, surely it's possible with alcohol as well.

As for duty-free booze: Can only be bought on arrival and never brought onboard an aircraft as carry-on.

[aterpster]

SMT Member:

How to stop it? Only by making the rest of us 'suffer' for the actions of a, relative, few: By banning the sale and consumption of alcohol in airports and onboard commercial aircraft. It was possible with smoking, surely it's possible with alcohol as well.

In the case of smoking the issue was second hand smoke, not disruptive passengers. That ban came in stages: first, the smoking and non-smoking sections, followed a few years later by a total ban.

Alcohol normally does not affect other passengers either medically or otherwise. The airlines, at least as a group, will not ban alcoholic beverages. It simply won't happen.

[wiggy]

It simply won't happen.

Just imaging the scene on first Long Haul airline to do it makes me wince......I guess would be fine for a hour or two and then ......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxvDCx-ILhk

[maxred]

I've seen assorted press releases by the media trying to stir this up into an industry wide issue. Almost every time the airlines say that it is a small - even rare - event.

I won't bore you with the detail, but I, and my fellow pax, endured a hen party going berserk at 36000 feet. EZY. Malaga to Glasgow. Emergency descent into Brest, at 10.30 at night. June this year. three carted off, eventually, by firemen and police. Not reported, as are a huge number of these incidents. A number of kids on the flight witnessing - One of our customers has taken unwell with a medical problem......-. It was truly disgraceful. You place the great unwashed into an aeroplane, get them drunk pre flight in the shopping malls, and what do you expect. This lot cannot behave out in the street on a Friday night, let alone travel....sorry. This is an ever growing issue, and it is NOT the airlines fault.

[SMT Member]

Alcohol normally does not affect other passengers either medically or otherwise

Don't know about you, but getting knocked out or requiring psychological help would certainly qualify as having been affected in my book, medically and otherwise.

The airlines, at least as a group, will not ban alcoholic beverages. It simply won't happen.

The airlines, as a group, will do whatever their regulator tells them to do. Just like some airlines were never going to voluntarily ban smoking, but regulations eventually made them.

[aterpster]

SMT Member:

Don't know about you, but getting knocked out or requiring psychological help would certainly qualify as having been affected in my book, medically and otherwise.

That's exactly why I said "normally."

[SWBKCB]

SMT Member has it right - remove alcohol from airports and aircraft. It's only there to subsidise airlines (and their passengers) who aren't prepared to pay "the going rate".

It has no place in safety conscious environment - and don't forget, "the safety of our passengers is our first priority".

[bullfox]

alcohol and altitude

Since increased altitude increases the effects of alcohol consumption I wonder if the pressure altitude inside modern airliners is different from previous generations of airliners?

[Noxegon]

I've been enjoying a glass of wine when I fly for almost two decades. I'd hate to see that privilege taken away because some people can't control themselves.

[45989]

Dear oh Dear what's new here. Knackers and drink..........

[Jorge Newberry]

I was on a Ryanair flight recently during which this guy (about 25) spent most of his time doing some kind of mad dance in the aisle punctuated by the occasional bit of loud "singing". He also hammered on the toilet door a couple of times "for a laugh". The FAs sidled past him and asked him to move aside for the trolley when they needed to pass him, and he complied readily enough, apart from that they and everyone else completely ignored him. Lunatic behavior completely normalised.

[Local Variation]

.......eventually he calmed down, stopped dancing and returned to the flightdeck.

Seriously though, an airport must be the only place you can get served a pint or two at 6am in the morning. And there in lies the problem.

[Chronus]

"Alcohol normally does not affect other passengers either medically or otherwise. The airlines, at least as a group, will not ban alcoholic beverages. It simply won't happen."
So says Aterpster.
What if the inebriated Mr. ,Ms.or Mrs. attacks another passenger who ends up requiring hospital treatment. Would that not be classified as "affecting medically". What if the sozzled vomiting all over another passenger, would that not be classified as "no effect otherwise". Is it normal or abnormal for alcohol not to have an effect. I would say it would be abnormal for it not to have an effect. Some who have an enormous tolerance to its effects would just consume vast quantities to achieve its effects. Until of course they attain the ultimate goal of alcoholism.
Airlines will not ban alcohol, it will not happen ! Are you really so certain. What do you think the outcome will be when and not if, an airliner is downed as a result, direct or contributory, of drunk passenger(s). Should we wait and see until it happens, then sit back with a glass of wine in our hand and listen to the retinue of shrinks and chat about human factors and similar nonsense afterwards.

[maxred]

My nephew got a part time job at Weatherspoons, EGPF. His busiest shift? Early morning, 5-9. Extra staff required then. Who in their right mind, tanks up for a 7.00a.m flight? Plenty by the sounds of it. For what it's worth, my EZY story above. The prime culprit, the others all 14 of them, spent the entire flight, throwing up into sick bags, and threatening other passengers, was trying to kick the windows out. After full hyperventilation, she was administered oxygen, at my request, although frankly I would have hit her over the head with the canister, calmed down for ten minutes, then headbutted a cabin crew member. That's when we headed to Brest. No, sorry, it is just totally unacceptable. Oh, and had I decided to wade in, guess who's fault it would have been? Certainly not the customer with the medical problem.