The morons on 121.5. Authorities please act!

[LLuCCiFeR]

Get a life!

Better focus on the real dangers in aviation; 1) pay to fly muppets in the cockpit in combination with 2) fatigue!

My educated guess is that once you start focusing on those two issues (i.e. less fatigue and more professionalism in the cockpit) that the number of those 121.5 annoyances will sharply reduce!

Moaning that "the authorities must do something" and set up some kind of triangulation system is a classical case of fighting the symptoms and not the causes.

I guess you can then moan about an "all intrusive and totalitarian micromanaging nanny state" in your next topic?

[Squawk7777]

Hire Delta Airlines to enforce Guard discipline! That's why they are sometimes referred to as the Guard Nazis in the US.

I agree that sometimes 121.5 has a little bit of exaggerated chatter, but let's focus on more important issues in this profession.

Aviate, navigate, communicate. In that order, please. As previously mentioned, fatigue and wannabe exploitation are some of a few more important issues. (Im)Proper R/T procedures have been usually been exaggerated (numerous threads comparing British and US).

[fireflybob]

Undisciplined use of any aeronautical mobile frequency is not a trivial matter - especially an international emergency frequency such as 121.500 MHz.

I believe this is called a Professional Pilots Rumour Network?

[ShyTorque]

Practice Pan X 3 make me furious to be honest. Chose another parallel frequency for these calls.

Whether you like it or not, it's perfectly correct use of 121.5 in UK airspace.
If something like this really does make you furious, I suggest you take advice from a aviation medical practitioner, because it sounds like you aren't coping too well with what is a fairly normal situation.

Alternatively, simply deselect the frequency at critical times and switch it back on a few seconds later when other people have finished talking.

[jack schidt]

To ERR is human! Keeping 121.5 on means that if you dial in a wrong frequency when changed to (eg) Tower (by mistake) then there is a safety net available by having 121.5 on UNLESS it's being blocked by idiots (generally). A call to, or from said tower on 121.5 (for landing clearance) could prevent an accident/incident occurring. Stating anything BUT 121.5 should be left for unusual or emergency situations is pure lack or experience/understanding or professionalism.

[Airbubba]

Can the Authorities please set up a triangulation system (shouldn't be too difficult) to nail these idiots and make sure they have to go through a phsych evaluation. Please don't tell us it is being implemented and just let the fools fall in the trap first!

With the advent of very accurate time sources multilateration techniques are feasible to give a good location on a transmission even with hobbyist equipment:

Multilateration (MLAT)

Multilateration (MLAT) ? FlightAware

I'm guessing VHF multilateration with an analog signal might be harder but the principle is the same.

Also, one of the great proposals years ago was for ATC voice comms to go digital as many other busy forms of communication have done. There would be a tag on each transmission to identify the sender as with many APCO P25 digital police systems. Maybe some of the younger folks here will live to see this happen.

Think what the Authorities and your employer would think if within a few minutes of acting like a moron you happen to experience some sort of technical event which requires the CVR to be read, what would that transcript make you look like and would you be likely to be retained by your employer?

I agree and, as you know, it has happened where even a minor incident or failure makes the entire two hour CVR recording fair game for review. Even if you're in the union, you'll have a lot of explaining to do if the tape shows that you weren't doing your job airborne.

Hire Delta Airlines to enforce Guard discipline! That's why they are sometimes referred to as the Guard Nazis in the US.

Cathay and FedEx MEM crews in Asia often take similar leadership positions in R/T enforcement in Asia from what I've seen.

To some extent this reflects the culture we live in these days - discipline seems to be a thing of the past.

To some degree it is indeed generational. But I've been listening to the whiners say things like 'until they pay me more and give me a week off for my birthday, I'm not going to do my job well' for decades now.

[jackieofalltrades]

I agree, the childish, moronic messing around on 121.5 needs to be clamped down upon. I do wonder how one of the frat boys in the front approaches the subject with the other pilot; "Hey, do you know what will make our job better? Let's belch and play Family Guy clips on Guard!"
"Sure, that sounds like a great idea."
"Oh, was that call for us? I was too busy being a prat on Guard to listen to your instruction."

As for a separate frequency for learner pilots to do their practice Pans on, that is a good idea in my opinion. I have no idea what spare frequencies there are across the UK that could provide a universal frequency. But I imagine it wouldn't be too hard to set up.

[Out Of Trim]

As for a separate frequency for learner pilots to do their practice Pans on, that is a good idea in my opinion. I have no idea what spare frequencies there are across the UK that could provide a universal frequency. But I imagine it wouldn't be too hard to set up.

It's not so much the difficulty; It's the cost! The Auto Triangulation system in the UK has existed for many years on 121.5 and 243.0. Another Military UHF frequency was set up some time later to accommodate Practice Pans etc.

The UK Distress And Diversion Cells ( Military ) need the practice also, to maintain their own proficiency. They aid many GA pilots unsure of their position often in marginal VMC or worsening conditions and prevent them becoming major emergencies.

If the Airlines need another frequency to be covered; then, the industry will have to pay for it to be added to the system and pay for it to be maintained.

[Una Due Tfc]

Why isn't 123.45 used for practice pans etc?

[crwkunt roll]

Why do practice Pans need to be done at all? Do it in the classroom or while you're sitting on the throne.

[ShyTorque]

To ERR is human! Keeping 121.5 on means that if you dial in a wrong frequency when changed to (eg) Tower (by mistake) then there is a safety net available by having 121.5 on UNLESS it's being blocked by idiots (generally). A call to, or from said tower on 121.5 (for landing clearance) could prevent an accident/incident occurring.

My own experience says that most "blocking" of 121.5 actually comes from airline co-pilots inadvertently transmitting on the frequency when trying to contact handling agents and having failed to select and check their switches. Recently, in a two hour flight I heard three examples of this (I routinely listen to 121.5 on my secondary radio when it's not being used for obtaining ATIS etc, even though my present operation is not mandated to do so).

[Capn Bloggs]

Whether you like it or not, it's perfectly correct use of 121.5 in UK airspace.
If something like this really does make you furious, I suggest you take advice from a aviation medical practitioner, because it sounds like you aren't coping too well with what is a fairly normal situation.

Alternatively, simply deselect the frequency at critical times and switch it back on a few seconds later when other people have finished talking.

Seriously?

[Major Cleve Saville]

Can anybody tell me the regulation that made the Antipodean Pilots the worlds 'Guard Police'. I have heard a real emergency (smoke in the cockpit) being stepped on by 'you're on guard mate' and even the guard police then being told they are on guard.

The one time in 35 years I have used 121.5 after a loss of comms during descent (power failure at the ATCC) the 'Guard Police' kindly told me I was on the wrong frequency. I personally find the 'Guard Police' more intrusive than the odd animal noise, and also a misuse of the frequency.

Morons who transmit animal noises on The Aircraft Emergency Frequency know exactly what frequency they are transmitting on they do not need to be told "Mate you're on guard".

[I-AINC]

I totally agree.

And I agree with Jack aswell, when you are approaching an airport in the UK and you listen all this planes got lost and asking for a practise pan to hide it and get a fix to come back home.

Lack of discipline in the air these days.

[737er]

Livin the Dream part II covers it!


At the 3:12 mark. http://youtu.be/YoZE0nE60sk

[dudubrdx]

I usually don't care if some want to pollute the frequency.
But I do care during night flights when one of us have a bit of controlled rest and turn up box 2 just in case the other one falls asleep.
That's usually when some think it's okay at night to start chatting. And this doesn't always happen in dodgy countries, it's happening more and more in Germany for example

[Aluminium shuffler]

The regularity and specific locations involved in some of this - the "deux bierres" over eastern central France and the kiddies "cow-can" over western Germany, for example, make me thing it is ground stations perpetrating some of these things. I know an individual whom I had a lot of respect for until I heard he was often making the exact comments in Chesty Morgan's post. Shame.

[Private jet]

More evidence that it is not the gentleman's profession it once was. Inevitably with increasing numbers comes riff raff.

[pudoc]

But it's ok when the world cup is on and people want to know the football scores!

[Martin_123]

in Ireland we do practice pans without pushing the ptt button, you just have to demonstrate that you're doing it as part of your PFL, but you don't transmit. I'm surprised that this isn't a practice across the EU