BA 777 on fire in Las Vegas
Some comments that the engine on this aircraft sas not subject to the AD referred to earlier in this thread: Failed Engine Type On BA 777 Was Subject To 2011 AD | Aero-News Network
It's not good to have yet another new problem requiring different fixes so that is the news to follow in the future.
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Miracle on the Hudson
@ILS27LEFT, I'm pretty sure there were a similar number of heroes in USAir 1549. An experienced captain, calm and methodical F/O, effective Cabin Crew, responsive and insightful ATC and both a coordinated and ad hoc emergency response comprising multiple agencies and selfless civilians in the middle of a city of 20 million people enduring a horrible snow storm..
This BA crew did a great job, clearly lessons from Airtours learned, but it's ironic that, in the age of LOFT and SBT this very scenario considered laughably simplistic and unlikely. How cheated (relieved) if in your next Sim ride you got an engine fire at 80KIAS in day VMC followed by a first class deadhead home and a book deal :-)
Funny aside; i was riding home in a UPS DC8 a few years ago and #2 let go at 500'.
On hearing the fire bell The F/O flying turned to the FE and said 'Why are you testing that NOW?'!
neilki.
This BA crew did a great job, clearly lessons from Airtours learned, but it's ironic that, in the age of LOFT and SBT this very scenario considered laughably simplistic and unlikely. How cheated (relieved) if in your next Sim ride you got an engine fire at 80KIAS in day VMC followed by a first class deadhead home and a book deal :-)
Funny aside; i was riding home in a UPS DC8 a few years ago and #2 let go at 500'.
On hearing the fire bell The F/O flying turned to the FE and said 'Why are you testing that NOW?'!
neilki.
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Given the residual value of the systems, avionics, and remaining engine it wouldn't take much of a repair bill to exceed the value of the airframe.
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To Be or Not To Be???
For the next few days a group of Boeing engineers and BA reps evaluating the airfroame/hull then it's off to meetings with Lloyds to crunch the numbers.................
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Beyond Economical Repair?
It is a legal term I hadn't run across as a pilot. Well, now that I think about it, an insurance guy used that term years ago to tell me he was giving me a check for my car instead of fixing it.
Thanks again!
See: What does Beyond Economic Repair (BER) mean?
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well having been with some people who arrange the insurance for IAG last week, they said this 777 was insured at about $30m, not a chance is that an economic repair, with a decent lifed GE coming in at over $20m alone.....
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What you have to be aware of in the number crunching for the purposes of whether it is deemed BER or not, is that the costs for the engine damage will almost certainly be excluded.
Much the same as, if the engine in your car breaks down (say due to a piston failure or overheat causing the block to crack), and you coast to a halt at the side of the road, running off into a ditch, your insurers will not pay to fix your engine. Only the resultant damage to the car itself.
Therefore, without knowing the extent of damage to fuselage, pylon, wing etc. you can probably take off something in the region of US$10 to 20 million from the repair costs for the engine, which will be for BA's (or possibly GE's) account. My feeling, this bird will certainly not fly again....
Much the same as, if the engine in your car breaks down (say due to a piston failure or overheat causing the block to crack), and you coast to a halt at the side of the road, running off into a ditch, your insurers will not pay to fix your engine. Only the resultant damage to the car itself.
Therefore, without knowing the extent of damage to fuselage, pylon, wing etc. you can probably take off something in the region of US$10 to 20 million from the repair costs for the engine, which will be for BA's (or possibly GE's) account. My feeling, this bird will certainly not fly again....
What you have to be aware of in the number crunching for the purposes of whether it is deemed BER or not, is that the costs for the engine damage will almost certainly be excluded.
Much the same as, if the engine in your car breaks down (say due to a piston failure or overheat causing the block to crack), and you coast to a halt at the side of the road, running off into a ditch, your insurers will not pay to fix your engine. Only the resultant damage to the car itself.
Therefore, without knowing the extent of damage to fuselage, pylon, wing etc. you can probably take off something in the region of US$10 to 20 million from the repair costs for the engine, which will be for BA's (or possibly GE's) account. My feeling, this bird will certainly not fly again....
Much the same as, if the engine in your car breaks down (say due to a piston failure or overheat causing the block to crack), and you coast to a halt at the side of the road, running off into a ditch, your insurers will not pay to fix your engine. Only the resultant damage to the car itself.
Therefore, without knowing the extent of damage to fuselage, pylon, wing etc. you can probably take off something in the region of US$10 to 20 million from the repair costs for the engine, which will be for BA's (or possibly GE's) account. My feeling, this bird will certainly not fly again....
I would be quite surprised in an event like this where the unexpected consequences went this far that the engine wasn't insured.
Surely the main causal factor for the engine failure will play a part in the calculations or computations - yes.
Hypothetical example: FOD to blading is often absorbed by many (not all) airlines while wear induced part failure may not be insured by most.
The consequences of FOD or most blade failures may not be insured up to the aircraft level like pylons. At that level the insurance may kick in.
There is very little to do with blame other than behind the scene divvy up between multiple insurance risk takers in a consortium. In the end the insurance may go up for both the engine manufacturers (plural) as well as other aircraft manufacturers. It's often too difficult for the insurance carriers to redo risk based on one or two events.
Message:As a manufacturer show diligence and you pay a lower fee than your competitor (its hopefully a very small percentage of your total sales)
In addition there are 14 derelict frames, including two early JAL -300s and four CSN -200s.
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Engine fire
Interesting photo of RR powered B747 rejecting due to engine failure and fire.
Photos: Boeing 747-236BM(SF) Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net
Photos: Boeing 747-236BM(SF) Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net
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Minor point and latest re the "BER"
Sorry, found it already on ASN. Takeoff reported to be at 1612Z so not much of a crosswind.
Still, next profcheck the wind will be on my mind more then before (when we usually get exactly the same scenario).
copy/paste from ASN (they only mixed up UTC/local):
Already lost who posted this way back on page 15 or 16, but FYI, the time of the event was 1413L and being KLAS, that would have been 1613 PDT which translated in to Z, UTC or whatever you call it nowadays, makes it 2313Z.
On another note, after being here all week it looks like the Boeing and BA guys are leaning towards a repair job on the bird...............
Check back.........this is a developing story!
Still, next profcheck the wind will be on my mind more then before (when we usually get exactly the same scenario).
copy/paste from ASN (they only mixed up UTC/local):
Already lost who posted this way back on page 15 or 16, but FYI, the time of the event was 1413L and being KLAS, that would have been 1613 PDT which translated in to Z, UTC or whatever you call it nowadays, makes it 2313Z.
On another note, after being here all week it looks like the Boeing and BA guys are leaning towards a repair job on the bird...............
Check back.........this is a developing story!
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@Yobbo - 747-236 RR Powered Photograph. Nice picture. FYI depending on the situation these flames from the exhaust of the #2 engine can also indicate that the crew have not stowed the reverser before 40kts. Note the reverser of this engine is deployed. At low speed the air being blown forwards causes recirculation/airflow disturbance at the inlet, which in turn causes the engine to suffer a compressor surge, producing flames from the exhaust. The RTO in this case may not have been for a non-engine related issue. Flames from the exhaust can be for more reasons than just an engine failure.