Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 17,687
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From: Reading, UK
All references to the wing-tip damage incident at Shanghai Pudong involve ANOTHER airframe.
http://pic.feeyo.com/pic/20120810/20...0956203830.jpg
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: Hong Kong
Most civil aircraft reach top of climb approximately 30 minutes after take off, give or take. (Depending on ATC restrictions A/C weight etc)
This aircraft had, apparently, been airborne for a couple of hours, so well into the cruise.
From my experience out of WMKL you are usually pretty close to TOC as you coast out from the east coast of the Malaysian peninsula, depending on the hand over from KL to Singapore ATC.
These guys are quite good and you normally get your requested/filed level shortly after crossing the coast.
This, undoubtedly, sounds like a massive and rapid catastrophic disaster which completely overcame the crew before they could even announce anything on the radio.
Bomb, airframe failure, oxygen, cockpit incursion, meteor strike, something highly, highly unusual for this modern aircraft to simply fall out of the sky and disappear?
This aircraft had, apparently, been airborne for a couple of hours, so well into the cruise.
From my experience out of WMKL you are usually pretty close to TOC as you coast out from the east coast of the Malaysian peninsula, depending on the hand over from KL to Singapore ATC.
These guys are quite good and you normally get your requested/filed level shortly after crossing the coast.
This, undoubtedly, sounds like a massive and rapid catastrophic disaster which completely overcame the crew before they could even announce anything on the radio.
Bomb, airframe failure, oxygen, cockpit incursion, meteor strike, something highly, highly unusual for this modern aircraft to simply fall out of the sky and disappear?
Joined: Dec 2007
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From: London Under EGLL(LHR) 27R ILS
Isn't Malaysia extremely tight on security, along with Beijing bound aircraft checked NSA style by the Chinese Government? I'm no expert in Security but Aviation Terror incidents are not easy, but not impossible for those flights. More importantly why would a terrorist target that city pair.
It is intriguing that the aircraft has been involved with a structural incident In the past; but I'm pretty sure that part of the 777 wing is just aerodynamic and not mainly structural integrity. I suspect wing box and spars were replaced in any repair job. G-BNLL had similar damaged and flew happily - before doing it again.
The fact Boeing tweeted waiting for news reports suggests even they don't know what's entirely happened; suggestive of something happening very quickly with no trace.
It is intriguing that the aircraft has been involved with a structural incident In the past; but I'm pretty sure that part of the 777 wing is just aerodynamic and not mainly structural integrity. I suspect wing box and spars were replaced in any repair job. G-BNLL had similar damaged and flew happily - before doing it again.
The fact Boeing tweeted waiting for news reports suggests even they don't know what's entirely happened; suggestive of something happening very quickly with no trace.
Joined: Apr 2008
Aviation Qualifications: SLF
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From: troposphere
ASN and BEA say it was 9M-MRO that sustained wingtip damage at Shanghai-Pudong
ASN Aircraft accident 09-AUG-2012 Airbus A340-642 B-6050
http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/2012...semaine.32.pdf
ASN Aircraft accident 09-AUG-2012 Airbus A340-642 B-6050
http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/2012...semaine.32.pdf
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 4
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From: London
Depth is divable
If plane is in 100m, this is divable for significant numbers of professional divers and FDR should be recoverable with appropriate equipment.
Recommended technical diving limit 100m. Maximum depth authorised for divers who have completed Trimix Diver certification with IANTD[7] or Advanced Trimix Diver certification with TDI.
So sorry to wake to this news today
Recommended technical diving limit 100m. Maximum depth authorised for divers who have completed Trimix Diver certification with IANTD[7] or Advanced Trimix Diver certification with TDI.
So sorry to wake to this news today
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 500
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From: flying by night
I occasionally run an adsb receiver in South Vietnam, I never hooked it up to publicly transmit anything to the global internets, but I can confirm that "enthusiast" coverage over large parts of SE asia is spotty and random. Most of these gadgets are not online 24/7, not redundant in any way, and a lot of airspace isnt covered. Central Europe is different, but believe me, That the track disappeared but others were tracked says ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
(And for those here who might be interested in looking at the ongoing search operation by tracking ships: publicly accessible martitime transponder - AIS - coverage is much worse. Last time I checked, there was a french electrical engineer working for a shipyard who set up a very capable yagi out of Saigon, but that's about it).
A good friend of mine worked at the maritime rescue coordination centre in Vung Tau, and now works for the central SAR coordination in VN. He's a hard-working, highly dedicated professional, a ships officer by training (just like me, originally, before I found myself in aviation), he once spent a half a year working at Solent MRCC as part of an exchange and professional development program. His father was a professional mariner, before him, I attended his funeral. He sometimes complains about being underfunded, compared to the armed forces in VN, but I'm very impressed with the capabilities of vnese Search and Rescue. They have some state of the art equipment, patrol aircraft, very modern vessels, and most importantly, highly dedicated and motivated professionals. They have a tough job, with no opportunities for financial gain.
I wont disturb him with any questions now, but my thoughts are with him, and all the others involved in this massive search operation. Let them do their job.
(And for those here who might be interested in looking at the ongoing search operation by tracking ships: publicly accessible martitime transponder - AIS - coverage is much worse. Last time I checked, there was a french electrical engineer working for a shipyard who set up a very capable yagi out of Saigon, but that's about it).
A good friend of mine worked at the maritime rescue coordination centre in Vung Tau, and now works for the central SAR coordination in VN. He's a hard-working, highly dedicated professional, a ships officer by training (just like me, originally, before I found myself in aviation), he once spent a half a year working at Solent MRCC as part of an exchange and professional development program. His father was a professional mariner, before him, I attended his funeral. He sometimes complains about being underfunded, compared to the armed forces in VN, but I'm very impressed with the capabilities of vnese Search and Rescue. They have some state of the art equipment, patrol aircraft, very modern vessels, and most importantly, highly dedicated and motivated professionals. They have a tough job, with no opportunities for financial gain.
I wont disturb him with any questions now, but my thoughts are with him, and all the others involved in this massive search operation. Let them do their job.
Last edited by deptrai; 8th March 2014 at 10:39.
Joined: Jul 2009
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From: Location Location
If you've flown in that area of the world you'll realize how congested the waters are. As earlier comments have pointed out, there must literally be thousands of vessels at sea, and hundreds in the area of the last known a/c location. It just boggles the mind that aside from the a/c disappearing without a trace, there have been zero reports that one might expect in such an event from eye/ear witnesses on the ground or at sea.
Puzzling. Sympathies to all the crew and passengers and their loved ones anxiously waiting for any shred of news.
Puzzling. Sympathies to all the crew and passengers and their loved ones anxiously waiting for any shred of news.
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 53
Likes: 25
From: China
I have not got he full information. How many flightcrew members in this flight? I know the missing time is the very early moring during flight. Only two men crew for such a long and mostly nigh flight? I mean that will be very tired for oly two man crew. Or two of three, like AF447, and one of them was on his/her rest during cruise phase? What I heard is 53 years old captain with a 27 years old young FO. Too deep rank?
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,093
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From: UK
194 posts already and no real substance - please calm down guys.
All we know is that the aircraft vanished from radar and no radio communication was received.
We have a very approximate location involving thousands of square miles of sea and it could take a long time for the first debris to be seen. If the aircraft met the water in one piece this will narrow down the search area, If the aircraft broke up in flight the main wreckage including the flight recorders could be a hundred miles from a piece of lightweight debris.
Sadly the reality is that the flight recorders are unlikely to be recovered for a long time, weeks or even months.
Until then all speculation is pointless.
All we know is that the aircraft vanished from radar and no radio communication was received.
We have a very approximate location involving thousands of square miles of sea and it could take a long time for the first debris to be seen. If the aircraft met the water in one piece this will narrow down the search area, If the aircraft broke up in flight the main wreckage including the flight recorders could be a hundred miles from a piece of lightweight debris.
Sadly the reality is that the flight recorders are unlikely to be recovered for a long time, weeks or even months.
Until then all speculation is pointless.
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 73
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From: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted by The Ancient Greek
Until then all speculation is pointless.
Mysterious circumstances will always draw great interest.
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Florida and wherever my laptop is
It is technically very simple to have 5 second updates on every aircraft anywhere in the world. It is possible to have continual real time feed of important data, shortly it will be possible to have real time FDR/CVR upload 'to the cloud'.
The best we can expect though from operators is an ACARS messaging system that reports maintenance issues - not necessarily in order of occurrence, ADS-B transmissions to ground stations - when in range, ADS-C satcom around every 10 - 20 minutes or on vector changes (dependent on contract). The reason that
Is due to accountants not wanting to spend the extra even on more ADS-C transmissions (you know they are a $2 a pop?) and some not wanting real time capability for the company to be able to watch FOQA or listen in to flight crew. All these discussions were 'hamster wheeled' for AF447.
AF447 also showed how long it takes to get from FL350 to sea level. The fact that the crew did not 'communicate' means that whatever happened was extremely fast and prevented communication. This indicates an event more like PanAm 103 than AF447.
If there were that many fishing boats out and as it was a clear night anything approaching TWA800 in magnitude would have been seen by hundreds of people. I suspect we will start getting eyewitness reports soon.
The best we can expect though from operators is an ACARS messaging system that reports maintenance issues - not necessarily in order of occurrence, ADS-B transmissions to ground stations - when in range, ADS-C satcom around every 10 - 20 minutes or on vector changes (dependent on contract). The reason that
AF447 also showed how long it takes to get from FL350 to sea level. The fact that the crew did not 'communicate' means that whatever happened was extremely fast and prevented communication. This indicates an event more like PanAm 103 than AF447.
If there were that many fishing boats out and as it was a clear night anything approaching TWA800 in magnitude would have been seen by hundreds of people. I suspect we will start getting eyewitness reports soon.
Last edited by Ian W; 8th March 2014 at 10:30. Reason: format
Joined: Mar 2014
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From: Italy
Italian network Retequattro reported an hour ago that the italian citizen in the passenger list had called home from Thailand telling his father he is alive and well and has never been on that flight.
Journalist speculated about a false/stolen passport.
Journalist speculated about a false/stolen passport.
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 52
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From: In the room next to the lift
I dont know, but MAS is reporting this position,
Even though they got the lat/long muddled up.
Sepang, 8 March 2014: Malaysia Airlines is still unable to establish any contact or determine the whereabouts of flight MH370. Earlier today, Subang ATC had lost contact with the aircraft at 2.40am. The last known position of MH370 before it disappeared off the radar was 065515 North (longitude) and 1033443 East (latitude).
Even though they got the lat/long muddled up.
Sepang, 8 March 2014: Malaysia Airlines is still unable to establish any contact or determine the whereabouts of flight MH370. Earlier today, Subang ATC had lost contact with the aircraft at 2.40am. The last known position of MH370 before it disappeared off the radar was 065515 North (longitude) and 1033443 East (latitude).
Joined: Dec 2013
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From: OKC
Originally Posted by deptrai
I occasionally run an adsb receiver in South Vietnam, I never hooked it up to publicly transmit anything to the global internets, but I can confirm that "enthusiast" coverage is spotty and random. Most of these gadgets are not online 24/7, not redundant in any way, and a lot of airspace isnt covered. Central Europe is different, but believe me, That the track disappeared but others were tracked says ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: Leeds
Another very unusal thing with this particular flight is the person listed on the passenger list, but whom definitely was not on the plane, if this is not a simple mixing of name error.
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 13
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From: London
Just read this:
Flight Track Log ? MAS370 ? 08-Mar-2014 ? WMKK / KUL - ZBAA / PEK ? FlightAware
Look at the course change and altitude change in seconds, strange.
Flight Track Log ? MAS370 ? 08-Mar-2014 ? WMKK / KUL - ZBAA / PEK ? FlightAware
Look at the course change and altitude change in seconds, strange.