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SAS close to bankrupcy

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SAS close to bankrupcy

Old 15th Nov 2012, 07:45
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Circa 1987, all SAS staff received a booklet from CEO Jan Carlson restating the core values of the airline and warning them of these very outcomes, namely a few mega-carrier amalgamations, and a drastic increase in competition. And the possible consequent demise of SAS.
'One of five in '95'. I remember it well. He was right about the five (or will it be six?), just the year and that SAS would be one of them.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 09:42
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Originally Posted by His dudeness
Short term profit. Works for while, then the big bang comes. A creative manager can always create profits from year to year, but a healthy company can´t be build without a long term strategy
True. A general rule of business management, as far as I know.

Last edited by LS-4; 15th Nov 2012 at 09:42.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 11:39
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I think you have things mixed up slightly. Business managers get paid salaries, bonuses etc and shareholders dividend.

If a company pays a dividend that cannot be supported by its profits then it is technically insolvent and the Dividend is unlawful.

So Kjos gets paid ONLY when Norwegian can make a profit but the CEO of SAS can technically get paid as much as he likes, or has agreed with the board.

However, SAS will then post a loss and has to go to the board (which gets no dividend, unless shareholder) and ask for support.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 11:58
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What if......

What happens if they do go to the wall????

Who provides the future transportation - will Ryan/Easy move further into the market, is there somebody standing in the wings (so to speak) to do a mega expansion??... Those of you in the picture, how's about some "sculpture on clouds" with your best guesses.....

Chears and thanks in advance from a "more southern european"
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 12:07
  #45 (permalink)  

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Err... Why do you think Norwegian ordered 222 aircraft last January?

Norwegian Air Orders $21.5 Billion in Boeing, Airbus Jets to Squeeze SAS - Bloomberg

SAS' failure is part of their business plan.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 12:41
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In a recent interview, MoL was asked about Ryanair Transatlantic & he said it would be 3 -4 years before that would happen.......so be warned boys, it's def on the cards.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 13:05
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Ref NAS's business plan & Ryanair long-haul. . . . low-cost long haul starts next Spring with Red-nosed Dreamliners.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 16:06
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It looks just like the sort of opportunity Flybe Nordic are waiting for.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 22:16
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Can't see any opportunity for Flybe Nordic - 16 aircraft, 14 of them ATRs and two E170s. Ah, maybe you think about Flybe buying Widerøe? Hardly not, with their finances they have to concentrate on staying aflot themselves.

Last edited by LN-KGL; 15th Nov 2012 at 22:16.
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Old 15th Nov 2012, 22:24
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FlyBe expanded after 9/11 on the strength of the maintenance cash cow of Bombardier aircraft, have (and I dare say I have) missed something here?

My money is Norwegian becoming the new SAS as DAT and Crossair?
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Old 16th Nov 2012, 14:35
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If Scandinavian airlines goes to the bankruptcy can you imagine how many pilots enter the market ?
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Old 16th Nov 2012, 14:52
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We are talking about 1500+ pilots, many with 10 000+ hrs.
Most 737 rating, many A 34/33/32. Worth anything??
Let's hope
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Old 16th Nov 2012, 15:29
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Scandinavian governments must let SAS die. It can't drag forever. Also SAS crews and employees need a reality check.
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Old 16th Nov 2012, 18:26
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SAS heading into bankruptcy?

Maybe Scandi could squeeze a few more years out of their female cabin personnel and up the age of retirement from 85 to 95?
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Old 17th Nov 2012, 10:28
  #55 (permalink)  
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The real purpose of todays plan is union-busting in modern day scandinavia.
How true, SAS can't be saved if everyone worked for free. They desperately need to do a "Swiss" in order to get on the right track. If the pilots agree to these cuts, it would be like pissing in your pants to keep warm.
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Old 17th Nov 2012, 10:36
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Rabina, you want to try the US airlines. Most are well past the 100 mark
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 08:56
  #57 (permalink)  
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Tomorrow we know if SAS will keep on flying. And for how long...

I will change now! And this time I mean it. This is the addicts repeated promise to everyone. But unless the person is willing to undergo a complete mental metamorphosis the value of these insurances quickly decreases to zero. About the same principle applies to companies.

The difference is that the promises in the corporate world has cool names rather than saying "I will never drink again". SAS Turnaround 2005, Core SAS, the SAS Group Strategy 2011 are examples. This week it was time for yet another vision of the future, the almost Star Trek-sounding: 4Excellence Next Generation.

We have, in other words, heard it before.

Maybe SAS instead an example of a phenomenon called "disruptive innovation". To cut the b/s it could be translated to "a very good idea".

An important reason for the change in the airline industry is that pioneers as Ryanair came to an important insight: airplanes are actually buses that operate at high altitude. No people getting on the regular crowded morning bus to work expects curtains, steaming towels and complimentary champagne for outrageous prices. This observation changed a business model, and the rest is history.

The concept of "disruptive innovation" was coined in the 90s by Harvard professor Clayton Christensen. It's about ideas that change the rules of the game in whole markets.

Clayton Christensen was fascinated by how even apparently successful and well-run companies could be reduced to mediocrity or even eliminated by this concept.

Are you as fascinated?
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 09:18
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Wise words. I would contest that SAS was a "Disruptive innovator" itself in 1983/4. The guiding principle being "make the customer happy through punctuality, motivated staff, and decent service, and they'll come back for more". Back then, this was a radical concept among the mainly nationalised airlines of Europe. BA borrowed much from the SAS success story.

But times change.

Circa 1987, in one of Jan Carlzon's communications, one of the possible threats he outlined was that of budget carriers serving unusual city pairs, and hence syphoning traffic from a small market base.

Hamar-Aberdeen was one of those quoted. We all thought this was ludicrous and utterly unlikely, added for amusement alone.

Now, as I browse Flightradar 24, I find aircraft serving the most unlikely places. Such as Oslo(?! Rygge) - Liverpool, Billund-Edinburgh, and Stockholm(?! Skavsta)-Dublin.

The whole game has changed, much as SAS's former leader and visionary warned it would.

"I have a feeling that we're not in Kansas any more"

Or, "I have a feeling that we're not in 1988 any more". It's one thing knowing what to do, but it's another doing it.

One of the nicest smells on board in that period was decent fresh coffee from the galley. Sadly, SAS needs to wake up and smell some.

Last edited by Midland 331; 18th Nov 2012 at 09:30.
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 09:31
  #59 (permalink)  
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I remember that, Midland.

I have no interests whatsoever in FR. But I have used them hundreds of times. No problems.

I think they are geniuses. But I still hear the echoing from the caves, RYRbashing, RYRbashing...

Last edited by paparomeodelta; 18th Nov 2012 at 09:32. Reason: Spelling
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 09:49
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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SAS ordering FULL TANKS on flights today - crew advised to have money available to get home on their own....

Norwegian news - E24 Næringsliv (try Google Translate)
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