EU Pilot certification rules
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: in a hotel
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How weird "Koi" that would would be getting sexually aroused by fellow Pilots losing their jobs. I say this because this is the second time you have mentioned it. Joking or not (and I don't think you are) it's a very disturbing trait that you have.
Your complete lack of respect and loathing for FAA rated Pilots (US nationals or otherwise) is a cause I think for further investigation by people who can determine your real identity from these forums (easily done I'm sure)
Your attitude sickens me
Your complete lack of respect and loathing for FAA rated Pilots (US nationals or otherwise) is a cause I think for further investigation by people who can determine your real identity from these forums (easily done I'm sure)
Your attitude sickens me
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SoCap App
What rubbish you talk man.
No it does not work the same.
The Americans do not /will not allow a UK or European airline to set up an
internal operation employing european citizens domiciled, I say again
domiciled in the USA. Europe however does in the form of two cargo airlines
taking hundreds, yes hundreds of jobs away from european pilots.
FEDEX and UPS: ...''go figure'' as I believe you types are want to say.
Trust you are enjoying the wonderful hospitality of the americas where families in their thousands are handing back the house keys and living under canvass in the californian desert. Grim viewing dont you think> Enjoy.
Now where did I put those keys fella.
Koi
What rubbish you talk man.
No it does not work the same.
The Americans do not /will not allow a UK or European airline to set up an
internal operation employing european citizens domiciled, I say again
domiciled in the USA. Europe however does in the form of two cargo airlines
taking hundreds, yes hundreds of jobs away from european pilots.
FEDEX and UPS: ...''go figure'' as I believe you types are want to say.
Trust you are enjoying the wonderful hospitality of the americas where families in their thousands are handing back the house keys and living under canvass in the californian desert. Grim viewing dont you think> Enjoy.
Now where did I put those keys fella.
Koi
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bear Island
Posts: 598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
no smoke without fire ..
happy days: recollections from my transition from instructor to airline pilot, domiciled at the time in the UK, where I was born ... turbine time would have been very useful, yet for some peculiar reason, most of the equipment I wanted to fly was sat gleaming in the hangar of my local airport with an N registration painted on the tail.
Those with cash to spare went to the States and did their FAA licence, came home and flew, meanwhile, having "squandered" my resources on a UK CPL/IR and type rating, it took some time to find a UK operator, operating the same aircraft, and then to gain employment
Having seen both ends of the aviation roller coaster, I would not wish anybody out of a job, that said, with no reciprocal agreement in place, this one sided arrangement has existed for too long.
Those with cash to spare went to the States and did their FAA licence, came home and flew, meanwhile, having "squandered" my resources on a UK CPL/IR and type rating, it took some time to find a UK operator, operating the same aircraft, and then to gain employment
Having seen both ends of the aviation roller coaster, I would not wish anybody out of a job, that said, with no reciprocal agreement in place, this one sided arrangement has existed for too long.
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Devon
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hmmm, nice lively thread..
makes fun reading, but a serious point here.
This thread does underline very well EASA's determination to make everything as difficult as possible which is not suprising given that they are dominated by pressure from legal and political people.
Regardless of the EU vs USA debate, we are all sleep-walking towards serious grief in April 2012. I have recently heard UK CAA and EASA say "oops we didn't mean/realise that" when questioned on some points recently and have heard warnings from people far more qualified that if some of the current proposals become law as planned the some of us will be permanently bu
ered.
Its a wider issue than just FAA vs EASA, but the original idea behind this thread would no longer be an issue if common sense was allowed to make a comeback.
Although the FAA/EASA does not directly concern me (I don't hold any FAA licences, or should that be licenses??), the bigger situation does concern me.
There are plenty of people who say what they don't like about EASA, but very few who say what they are going to do about it. I have tried writing to UK government and other politicians but felt like I was piing on a house fire.
Short of all large scale revolt against EASA, we will shortly be faced with a lot more hassle at best and perfectly decent organisations not being able to operate legally at worst.
If anybody agrees it would be great to hear from you, because my present intention is to give up my UK(non JAA) licence plus my experience and apply it to something outside aviation.
This thread does underline very well EASA's determination to make everything as difficult as possible which is not suprising given that they are dominated by pressure from legal and political people.
Regardless of the EU vs USA debate, we are all sleep-walking towards serious grief in April 2012. I have recently heard UK CAA and EASA say "oops we didn't mean/realise that" when questioned on some points recently and have heard warnings from people far more qualified that if some of the current proposals become law as planned the some of us will be permanently bu
ered.Its a wider issue than just FAA vs EASA, but the original idea behind this thread would no longer be an issue if common sense was allowed to make a comeback.
Although the FAA/EASA does not directly concern me (I don't hold any FAA licences, or should that be licenses??), the bigger situation does concern me.
There are plenty of people who say what they don't like about EASA, but very few who say what they are going to do about it. I have tried writing to UK government and other politicians but felt like I was pi
ing on a house fire.Short of all large scale revolt against EASA, we will shortly be faced with a lot more hassle at best and perfectly decent organisations not being able to operate legally at worst.
If anybody agrees it would be great to hear from you, because my present intention is to give up my UK(non JAA) licence plus my experience and apply it to something outside aviation.
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are plenty of people who say what they don't like about EASA, but very few who say what they are going to do about it.
It would appear that in Euroland, the powers that be right and truly will tell you what you can/cannot do, and you (in Euroland, collectively) can....lump it.
So, bring your corporate/private airplanes to America (where we already have more than all other countries) and enjoy our pilot-friendly FAA rules.
As for boofhead, America will not change just to satisfy some looney ICAO edict...get used to it.
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Devon
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maybe too late
411A - you may unfortunately be right about not being able to change things. It is certainly very late. The only way it will get changed is via the EU Commission, which means getting enough euro MPs to get hold of the commission by the short and curlies. The only way to achieve this would be to get hold of the MEPs in a similar manner.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: formally Alamo battleground, now the crocodile with palm trees!
Posts: 960
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So, bring your corporate/private airplanes to America (where we already have more than all other countries) and enjoy our pilot-friendly FAA rules.
IMHO, the best certification one can have are dual licenses (FAA and JAA). It's sad to see this thread having turning into a p!ssing match thanks to ignorant comments made by Koi.
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: in a hotel
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Koi" Wrong again
"Koi" you obviously haven't got a clue what you are talking about. British Airways used to (and probably still do) allow UK Citizens to live permanently in another Country outside of the EU (domiciled) being based and flying from there on 'G' reg aircraft. There are many more examples of this with other Carriers too.
In fact Fedex and UPS haven't "set up and Airline" here as you call it. Rather, they have bases here in Europe that they staff with FAA reg Pilots. Big deal, if we're going to say no to that, then every other Airline with outstations in Europe like say Air New Zealand, Cathay etc etc will have their Aircraft banned from Europe too.
BTW, Fedex and UPS don't ban non US Citizens from flying for them. As they state on their recruitment websites you have to have lived in the US for 5 years. Fair enough really.
As for your ramblings about the state of the US housing market and homeowners handing back their keys, it doesn't really deserve a reply. However, if you think that the UK's market is so rosy then have a look here.
Credit Crunch Forces Homeowners to Hand Back Keys
In fact Fedex and UPS haven't "set up and Airline" here as you call it. Rather, they have bases here in Europe that they staff with FAA reg Pilots. Big deal, if we're going to say no to that, then every other Airline with outstations in Europe like say Air New Zealand, Cathay etc etc will have their Aircraft banned from Europe too.
BTW, Fedex and UPS don't ban non US Citizens from flying for them. As they state on their recruitment websites you have to have lived in the US for 5 years. Fair enough really.
As for your ramblings about the state of the US housing market and homeowners handing back their keys, it doesn't really deserve a reply. However, if you think that the UK's market is so rosy then have a look here.
Credit Crunch Forces Homeowners to Hand Back Keys
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Devon
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"And was called 'revalidation' or, if you’d run out of currency (which was now called ‘recency’), ‘renewal’."
Sorry, but you have got the definition of "currency" wrong. Under the new rules we may all run out of "currency," £ s d that is, because we will have given it all to pay for this nonsense.
If I borrow a book from the library, because I'm a goody-goody I go back and renew it before time is up, so why did "they" decide that a perfectly simple word should mean something different in aviation.
Sorry, but you have got the definition of "currency" wrong. Under the new rules we may all run out of "currency," £ s d that is, because we will have given it all to pay for this nonsense.
If I borrow a book from the library, because I'm a goody-goody I go back and renew it before time is up, so why did "they" decide that a perfectly simple word should mean something different in aviation.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: formally Alamo battleground, now the crocodile with palm trees!
Posts: 960
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thomascl605, well put, but I'd just ignore Koi's rants. Not worth a reply at all, he's just setting new standards in ignorance.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: On the right of the clowns and to the left of the jokers
Posts: 307
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Guys some of the posts completely miss the original point here.
Currently, you can fly an EASA reg on an EASA (only) licence in the US as a US resident, and you can fly a US reg on a US (only) licence in EASA land as an EASA land resident. EASA are trying to change the latter part of that which I feel nobody in their right mind could reasonably support. there is no one sided arrangement on the particular issue being challenged by the proposed legislation
Koi's stance seems to be a fundamental objection to US citizens working in EASA land, but need to realise urgently that to challenge that the way is through immigration policy not Flight Crew Licensing policy that will penilise countless EASA land citizens to the extent that they will probably loose their livlihoods. Personally and having found some of the remarks overtly racist I'd say that better still would be to just go away, but thats just my two cents.
I also found Teddy Robinson's comments a bit hard to take. I did a JAA licence first and then an FAA, most of my work is now derived from the FAA. I don't see how I could hold it against the guys who went the direct FAA route, effectively saving themselves time and money just because their research was better than mine!
The important point of note is that this is now merely shelved until December and it is therefore vital as an industry to keep up the pressure on the authorities to drop these ludicrous proposals.
Currently, you can fly an EASA reg on an EASA (only) licence in the US as a US resident, and you can fly a US reg on a US (only) licence in EASA land as an EASA land resident. EASA are trying to change the latter part of that which I feel nobody in their right mind could reasonably support. there is no one sided arrangement on the particular issue being challenged by the proposed legislation
Koi's stance seems to be a fundamental objection to US citizens working in EASA land, but need to realise urgently that to challenge that the way is through immigration policy not Flight Crew Licensing policy that will penilise countless EASA land citizens to the extent that they will probably loose their livlihoods. Personally and having found some of the remarks overtly racist I'd say that better still would be to just go away, but thats just my two cents.
I also found Teddy Robinson's comments a bit hard to take. I did a JAA licence first and then an FAA, most of my work is now derived from the FAA. I don't see how I could hold it against the guys who went the direct FAA route, effectively saving themselves time and money just because their research was better than mine!
The important point of note is that this is now merely shelved until December and it is therefore vital as an industry to keep up the pressure on the authorities to drop these ludicrous proposals.
I don't know if this was posted already but here it goes...
New Euro Flight Crew Licensing Rules Put on Hold...
The European Commission (EC) has postponed until mid-December a vote on EASA draft rules regarding flight crew licensing. As proposed, the rules have no provisions for the conduct of pilot initial, re-validation and renewal of class and type ratings from outside European Union member states, according the European Business Aviation Association (EBAA). The new EASA rules are proposed to go into effect in April 20102. In an October 6 letter to the EC, EBAA, NBAA and the International Business Aviation Council (IBAC) warned that the proposed rules would reverse long-standing reciprocal acceptance policy for pilot credentials between the U.S. and the EU and adversely impact safety. The organizations also said the draft rule would have “a highly negative impact on the safety of business aviation operations” as “many European operators rely on simulator training conducted in Canada or in the U.S.” Because most business aircraft are manufactured and operated in North America “to expect the relocation of such activity to Europe to comply with the rules is completely unrealistic.” Representatives of European member states and the EC discussed the proposal at an October 14 meeting at which the EC insisted that a vote on it be delayed until year’s end to allow more time for revisions.
The European Commission (EC) has postponed until mid-December a vote on EASA draft rules regarding flight crew licensing. As proposed, the rules have no provisions for the conduct of pilot initial, re-validation and renewal of class and type ratings from outside European Union member states, according the European Business Aviation Association (EBAA). The new EASA rules are proposed to go into effect in April 20102. In an October 6 letter to the EC, EBAA, NBAA and the International Business Aviation Council (IBAC) warned that the proposed rules would reverse long-standing reciprocal acceptance policy for pilot credentials between the U.S. and the EU and adversely impact safety. The organizations also said the draft rule would have “a highly negative impact on the safety of business aviation operations” as “many European operators rely on simulator training conducted in Canada or in the U.S.” Because most business aircraft are manufactured and operated in North America “to expect the relocation of such activity to Europe to comply with the rules is completely unrealistic.” Representatives of European member states and the EC discussed the proposal at an October 14 meeting at which the EC insisted that a vote on it be delayed until year’s end to allow more time for revisions.
Having experienced the joys of both the FAA and EASA/JAA programs, I have some mixed views. There is nothing trivial about FAA standards, and the training organisations offer quality training and additionally check to a high but fair standard.
EASA/JAA could have been a benefit to Europe, however, the nonsense of license validation from one member state to another confounds rationality.
Both FAA and EASA are supposed to be aligned to ICAO requirements under the annexes, but apparently that is insufficient to have a harmonised program.
EASA/JAA could have been a benefit to Europe, however, the nonsense of license validation from one member state to another confounds rationality.
Both FAA and EASA are supposed to be aligned to ICAO requirements under the annexes, but apparently that is insufficient to have a harmonised program.
