BALPA BA Ballot 94% In Favour

[M.Mouse]

cjd A320

Care to explain where BALPA should have found the time to not respond to the company's demands for savings?

WW is taking the golden opportunity to take on the dinosaur unions and deal with their obstructiveness and lack of realism once and for all.

Fortunately it is plain that he realises the pilots usually have a career long commitment to BA, are intelligent and are represented by people of intelligence. Hence the way it was left to the pilots to decide HOW the savings were made with the AMOUNT set by the company. Both WW and Keith Williams, the Chief Financial Officer have both given numerous presentations in person to the pilots.

In recent years hard and prolonged negotiations over work coverage issues and the pension deficit and now lower pay and higher productivity have resulted in changes acceptable to both sides. Long may it continue and I wish all the BA unions were as able and resourceful as BALPA.

[gdiphil]

Ancient Observer.
You are absolutely spot on. I am flying everyone (well almost) other than BA since the difference in price in economy is huge compared with other carriers. For example on Monday I'm flying with my family with Etihad to SYD for £619 return, booked 6 weeks ago. BA at the time wanted almost a thousand pounds each! They don't want my business evidently. BA's current business model based on business passengers does not work any more, and who knows for how long. So, put in more Y seats and fill them up. The planes are going to wherever anyway so I say BA should make the effort and make me an offer I can't refuse. My mother is off to SYD next March for £425 return with SQ. Can she fly with BA for that? Pick a figure that BA want, it is isn't remotely near SQ.

[Ancient Observer]

Same experience

My experience is the same. If a BA "campaign" co-incides with our travel needs, then fine, but they seem to want to maintain the "rack" rates and the integrity of their price list. They need to get real - that was yesterday's model, it won't work again until the global economy picks up - and it might not work then.

[TheKabaka]

I think most aircraft are full at the moment, certainly the ones I am flying around. So I assume the pricing is spot on- if the tickets are cheaper elsewhere the cabin is full and BA has maximised the revenue for that flight. I agree more economy seats may be a good idea, but it takes a long time to change that.

[Flap62]

Load factor in economy last month was over 99%. You might decry BA for charging more than other carriers but people are prepared to pay the price. If you can fly from UK to SYD and back for less than £700 the airline are making no money from that (it barely covers fuel cost for the sector!) so why should BA try to compete with those prices?

[PC767]

Bit of a shame the rest of BA staff won't do the same!

Offer the rest of BA staff a similar deal, rather than an opportunistic smash and grab of their livelihoods and all will be peace and tranquility.

[Flap62]

PC767,

Your location is strangely apt.

[JazzyKex]

PC767 wrote:

Offer the rest of BA staff a similar deal, rather than an opportunistic smash and grab of their livelihoods and all will be peace and tranquility.

From the AGM:

British Airways AGM: as it happens - Telegraph

12:37: This is a bit feistier. An employee asks why BA is refusing to do the same deal with cabin crew as with the pilots. "You are showing disrespect to the cabin crew," he says to loud cheers.

12:42: Walsh counters: "Our cabin crew and pilots do not have the same agreement. They have been different for many years. It would be beneficial if we did have the same agreement."

[manrow]

Flap62 and others posting on BA seat pricing.

I can assure you that BA may seem to stick rigidly to their quoted prices as far as retail sales direct to the public are concerned. However under many circumstances travel agents can buy-up a block of seats at considerably below retail price and sell them at whatever value they can achieve, much closer to the low cost airline model than you would realise.

Hence quotes about full aircraft will not reveal anything about the true revenue achieved. All airlines need to be achieving high load factors to survive, and to do this requires fast footwork by the airlines/agents such that the actual price the airline receives per seat is very similar.

[Flap62]

I accept that revenue may not be great just because a flight is full but if BA have full economy cabins with higher straight up ticket prices then their revenue is probably still slightly stronger than someone selling a ticket to OZ (before the bucket shops take their cut) for an amount that barely covers the fuel costs.

It's also a slightly more positive sign that the cabins are fuller than some of BA's close compeditors who are going through the same cycle of huge discounts to travel agents and corporate clients. They are slashing prices too and still can't fill the aircraft!

[pinkaroo]

So here we have the deal, the big earners take a slight hit in return for a share deal which will pay off handsomely in a couple of years when those pesky teamakers have all had their cumuppance and the likes of M.Mouse sneer about his immense mekon-like brain being the secret weapon that won the day. You may get to keep your Golf membership but those working days will be interesting if you need a cup of tea and display an attitude like that.

[JazzyKex]

Is that a threat Pinkaroo?

edited to add:

At what stage in this are you actually going to look at the proposals yourself and stop relying solely on the BASSA rhetoric?

If you can find time to do that and have the ability to apply some basic arithmetical ability you may wish to re-write your above comment.

The power of independent thought is one which is occasionally valuable!

[pinkaroo]

Jazzy, pleeease! Just think about it before you jump. This matter is a disaster for crew family relations.

[pinkaroo]

I was reading a financial article today comparing past performances of equities where companies in similar situations had bounced back, tripling in two years and by as much as six times in four years. Your turn to reach for the pencil and paper. Oh, no need, Just read your BALPA memo.

[JazzyKex]

Please post a link or reference to the article Pinkeroo.

I'd love to hear about another company with a similar cost base and business model, recovering in that time frame.

As much information from valuable and reputable sources is always greatly appreciated.

Cheers

[overstress]

Pinkaroo, that was an interesting posting, I quote it in full:

So here we have the deal, the big earners take a slight hit in return for a share deal which will pay off handsomely in a couple of years when those pesky teamakers have all had their cumuppance and the likes of M.Mouse sneer about his immense mekon-like brain being the secret weapon that won the day. You may get to keep your Golf membership but those working days will be interesting if you need a cup of tea and display an attitude like that.

(my bold) - what could you possibly mean?

[Carnage Matey!]

So pinkaroo if you're so sure that BAs share price is going to increase three or even six fold you'll be ploughing every penny you've got into BA shares, won't you? Or are you less willing to put your money where your mouth is?

[stormin norman]

BALPA have shown they have been correct on Open Skies (Even though the association is rumoured to have lost in excess of £1m taking it to court).

The cut of 2.6% in pay and allowances is going to pale into insignificance in comparison to the loss in future and past pensions for pilots if Walsh doesn't get a move on and get the financial position under control.

Lots of talk but no action.

[Re-Heat]

pinkaroo:

those working days will be interesting if you need a cup of tea and display an attitude like that.

So, are you advocating interference with the food and drink of the flight crew, operating in a safety-critical function and holding your life in their hands?

Please, do make yourself clear on this point once and for all.

[Dutchjock]

Pinkaroo:

So here we have the deal, the big earners take a slight hit in return for a share deal which will pay off handsomely in a couple of years

I can't be bothered to get the agreement out and copy paste it here, but let me highlight a few facts bassa have forgot to tell you.

We only get all of these shares if the company is making a profit margin of 10% and on time performance is within certain targets.


So if you keep working with that attitude I'm shure you don't need to worry about us getting any shares