Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

Balpa to challenge ID cards

Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

Balpa to challenge ID cards

Old 10th May 2009, 13:43
  #41 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Tracey Island
Posts: 1,496
"People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both"....Benjamin Franklin.

Those who want a National Identity database have no idea what they are getting into....
YouTube - No2id video 2
YouTube - Take Jane
call100 is offline  
Old 10th May 2009, 21:19
  #42 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 1,923
Unfortunately, nearly all the posts here, both for and against, make the mistake of sensibly and logically assessing the merits or otherwise of the new card system. That is something the goverment has never done. Logic has nothing to do with this. This is a desperate grasp at saving face by the discredited home secretary of a floundering government.

This wouldn't have prevented ANY of the recent terrorist attacks but that isn't going to stop them playing their bogus security card for all it's worth.
ShotOne is offline  
Old 11th May 2009, 01:30
  #43 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Usually Oz
Posts: 733

From the other side of the globe, if this ID card doesn't do away with the ludicrous UK system of individual airport ID cards, then bin it!!

In a country the size of the UK, to have each a/p with its own ID card is just a joke.

Feather #3 is offline  
Old 11th May 2009, 09:29
  #44 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: UK
Posts: 105
Quite right, Feather #3 .... but as you fear, the new government ID card is simply an 'extra layer' of bureaucracy that will not address this problem.
It IS being touted by the government as the way of solving this particularly British, stupid problem; but this is because they want to introduce their ID card for their own self-indulgent reasons, and are coming up with all kinds of new justifications. There are other ways of solving this which are consequently not being pursued.
At the very least, we will have to wait until every UK airport worker has an approved government ID card - and don't forget, many are not UK citizens so can't have one even if they want one - before they even begin to address the problem. Don't hold your breath.
jshg is offline  
Old 11th May 2009, 10:51
  #45 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: UK
Age: 58
Posts: 317
+1 for what Feather #3 says, ditto ShotOne.

What a pity the media don't take as great an interest in threads on this topic, as they do in the ones involving people having a bad day. Good ammo for Paxman, Humphrys and Naughtie, I'd've thought...
Sepp is offline  
Old 11th May 2009, 13:52
  #46 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Chumphon Thailand
Age: 49
Posts: 16
I would not have a problem with an ID card containing the following information-





If it would make my life easier, but I simply do not trust the Government not to balls up the whole scheme.... Perhaps expense accounts should be added too or locations of WMDs?
Big mustache is offline  
Old 12th May 2009, 15:02
  #47 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Here Today, Gone Tomorrow
Posts: 221
learn from the colony..

India has an airport pass system which is for all airports in the country and is very well implemented..

takes time to renew cards though
condorbaaz is offline  
Old 12th May 2009, 16:57
  #48 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Bucks, England
Age: 53
Posts: 96
India has an airport pass system which is for all airports in the country and is very well implemented..

That's very nice for them but this is NOT a pass system for all UK airports, in fact this is NOT a pass system for a single airport.
Diedtrying is offline  
Old 12th May 2009, 18:42
  #49 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 1998
Location: Where the job is!
Posts: 440
The pilot scheme is being implemented at some busy airports that have many international flights. Each week thousands of foreign pilots and cabin crew have to use these airports to do their jobs. Presumably all of these foreigners do not qualify for UK national ID cards. If they can be allowed to access the secure areas at UK airports without the new UK ID cards then it is impertinent to impose the requirement upon UK citizens going to work at airports within their own country. That would also show how unnecessary the requirement is. There’s obviously a hidden agenda!
Carrier is offline  
Old 15th May 2009, 06:31
  #50 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: British Isles
Posts: 201
The Manchester Evening News clearly thinks ID Cards ara good idea:

Opinion: Angela Epstein - News - Manchester Evening News

>>The cards offer clear, unequivocal proof of who you are. As a massive bonus they'll help the fight against illegal workers, identity fraud, even terrorist activity.<<

A few local letters from pilots would not go amiss!

[email protected]

Last edited by Spartacan; 15th May 2009 at 07:26.
Spartacan is offline  
Old 15th May 2009, 12:50
  #51 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: not a million miles from old BKK
Posts: 494
Silly cow!
If I could be bothered I'd get a log-in to the MEN to tell her so in more detail. If it's as simple as she suggests then why is it going to cost billions of taxpayers money to set up at a time when the world is in desparate financial trouble and no-one trusts computers let alone MP's anymore anyway.
I repeat - silly cow!
Xeque is offline  
Old 15th May 2009, 15:54
  #52 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Abroad
Posts: 1,173
As a massive bonus they'll help the fight against illegal workers, identity fraud, even terrorist activity
What is amazing is that, in the past, I have come across people who actually believed this

Clearly those three issues are totally unique to the UK, as none of the countries where ID is compulsory have any irregular workers, cases of mistaken identity, or freedom fighters amongst their populace. Or do they?

The intellectual level of this so-called "debates" really beggars belief.
LH2 is offline  
Old 16th May 2009, 10:34
  #53 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: The Land of Beer and Chocolate
Age: 52
Posts: 794
Anyone here now think the ID card database is still a good idea? And can someone tell me why you should have to produce an ID card to buy a TV in the first case?

ID cards: taxman allowed access to personal data - Telegraph
hellsbrink is offline  
Old 16th May 2009, 12:06
  #54 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 17,418
The way I look at it is if these things were designed to stop terrorism, then it fails at the first hurdle as the London Tube bombers as UK citizens and unknown prior to their attacks would have been perfectly legally entitled ID card carriers....

I would rather sign on and become unemployed than pay for this.
NutLoose is online now  
Old 16th May 2009, 12:52
  #55 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: not a million miles from old BKK
Posts: 494
Given all the shlt thats going down about MP's expenses at the moment, I would have thought that anything that willfurther put them in a bad light (whatever their colour or persuasion) would have been well and truly shelved by now. Not so it seems. We still have the crass stupidity of the proposed ID cards and various 'security' databases not to mention the 'Jobs for failed Traffic Wardens' scheme at our airports where cretins of dubious education or mental ability lord it over law abiding citizens at (so-called) security. Just how far do we have to go before the British finally get off their collective arses and put a stop to this [email protected]
This constant picking away at peoples basic privacy against the excesses of those who would claim to be our elected representatives is something that the British, as a nation, should stand up to - once and for all - and say a resounding NO!!!
I'm not against ID cards per se. As a long term expatriate in various countries around the world I have been required to carry one for many years. However, there is a big difference between a credit card sized piece of plastic that simply gives your name, current address, passport details, a photograph and signature and the invasive, intrusive, big-brother control that is proposed by the 'Expenses Fiddlers' in Britain today.
I renewed my 5 year Thailand drivers licence yesterday. I contains the same basic identification information that I listed earlier. It is regularly used here as an ID card. It cost the equivalent of £9.
Now ask me why I choose to live in Thailand.
Poor Britain!
Xeque is offline  
Old 19th May 2009, 19:38
  #56 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Riga
Posts: 244
I wonder if Gordon will try to coerce the airport authorities over here at Riga, Liepaja and Ventspils to demand an ID card from me when I pass through? Hope not, because as it stands I have no intention of ever holding one at the whim of the inept UK system.

My ID over here is valid for all three international airports (in addition to the domestic airports and airfields we have). Why do the intelligent individuals left in the UK simply not cull the cretins who repetatively vote for the muppets that are bringing you this mess?

Good to hear that BALPA are taking a strong stance, I just hope they can build enough momentum to keep it out until the least popular prime minister ever (and his cronies) are voted out.

Romeo India Xray is offline  
Old 1st Jun 2009, 10:00
  #57 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 3433N 06912E
Posts: 389

Network of 1.9 Million Malware-Infected Computers Controlled by Cybercriminals - Corporate and Government Computers Are Included

Finjan - Finjan Discovers a Network of 1.9 Million Malware-Infected Computers Controlled by Cybercriminals - Corporate and Government Computers Are Included

Just as well the government wants the data on the entire population, including professional people that work airside on a database then !
Bruce Wayne is offline  
Old 1st Jun 2009, 11:06
  #58 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 17
Sorry - this is Balpa mouthing off again about taking legal action.
It's pathetic. I have been at the end of the trail of Balpa legal action where they said it was a dead cert for us all to win. Cloud Cuckoo Land. It was laughingly thrown out of court. Thanks for nothing Balpa. Yet again wasting all those hard earned 1%'s.

I hate the idea of being forced to carry a National ID card, but what we really do need is some form of Government National AIRSIDE ID card. So we can dispense with these stupid airport IDs such as BAA, BRS, BHX, HUY, and EMA. They all refuse to really acknowledge another airports' ID, but we all have to jump through exactly the same hoops for whichever one we require. For example BRS security should not be allowed to say they will hand search any person who is not a BRS ID holder.

Some form of Government National ID Airside pass would be desirable.
Don't waste time or money with Balpa.
Ellie Vator is offline  
Old 1st Jun 2009, 15:32
  #59 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 3433N 06912E
Posts: 389
The *point* is Ellie, is that NO Government National ID is desirable.

Less than desirable.
Bruce Wayne is offline  
Old 1st Jun 2009, 21:10
  #60 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 152
It doesnt bother me if they keep my DNA on their database forever. It also doesnt bother me if they keep any other info on me too. I havent done anything that has ever warranted the police to need any of my details and never intend too
A fine argument if we had a government we could trust not to lose our personal information or sell it to the highest bidder. Also if we had a police force we could trust not to manufacture evidence when under pressure to solve crimes.

Sadly, we have neither.

Im sure being woken up at 6am wouldn't be a pleasant experiance by the police, but if the system has got flawwed data on it then when the person was arrested and re-tested it would be obvious it wasnt that person. Then look on the positive side....... A serious crime/rape/murder etc happens and they look on the system. Low and behold the computer says it was x, y or z and the person is duely arrested quickly before commiting several more offences.....
All very well until the police are tempted to over rely on DNA evidence rather than putting in the effort to solve crimes properly. Then, of course, all a criminal requires to fit someone else up for his crimes is a sample of DNA in some form or other to leave at the scene of the crime. Ever read, "Presumed Innocent" by Scott Turow?
GearUp CheerUp is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.