737 veered off landing runway at Arrecife
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I'd say that aircraft is a fair bit further than is shown on the google earth map. Not sure, but at that angle looks like the aircraft had some sort of control inputs from the pilot to make it turn like that, maybe an attempt to drastically slow the aircraft to stop it going into the water.
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I'd have thought that the Comisión de Investigación de Accidentes e Incidentes de Aviación Civil would want to investigate the accident.
No injuries (pax even left simply by the steps).
No significant damage to the airframe.
This is an incident, not an accident.
That said, I agree the CIAIAC would want to look at it. The next occurrence may well be a full-blown accident.
CJ
Last edited by ChristiaanJ; 31st Oct 2008 at 18:22. Reason: speling mistaek
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Something immediately jumps into my mind.
I fly the 737 also and very often ACE.
Could it have been a long landing (after the 1000fts) and a "we'll have it stopped on time, don't worry!"?
Endless discussions... go around IS an option (and not a failure)
We have an internal safety magazine in the company and every time a story is told starting with the title: "Could this happen to you?"
of course not, not to me......not
F.
I fly the 737 also and very often ACE.
Could it have been a long landing (after the 1000fts) and a "we'll have it stopped on time, don't worry!"?
Endless discussions... go around IS an option (and not a failure)
We have an internal safety magazine in the company and every time a story is told starting with the title: "Could this happen to you?"
of course not, not to me......not
F.
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No point in speculating about the cause as usual...
You really can't get closer to coming a cropper at GCRR than that though! I'll bet that had the spotters at the end of the runway running!
You really can't get closer to coming a cropper at GCRR than that though! I'll bet that had the spotters at the end of the runway running!
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Romeo Oscar Golf
Sorry folks but couldn't resist it.
From the BBC webpage report..
"It is reported to have ended up perpendicular to the runway"
Sorry folks but couldn't resist it.
From the BBC webpage report..
"It is reported to have ended up perpendicular to the runway"
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Just watched a little clip on 2100 news in Spain. It would have looked slightly more professional if the aircraft ( filmed long after the overrun) had not been happily flashing the wing strobes for the cameras. 
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Just your usual bad landing, it seems.
The pilot had requested 21 instead of the operational 03 at the time (where MAP's MD83 tookoff clean last year and nearly crashed). Little variable wind. He came in high (there is elevated terrain on that approach) but didn't go around (a very common happening on that situation in this runaway). So he gained speed when he "forced it down".
He hit about the half mark in the runaway.
The airplane had the wheels changed (maybe just for the investigation) and departs tonight, so I guess indeed no damage.
The pilot had requested 21 instead of the operational 03 at the time (where MAP's MD83 tookoff clean last year and nearly crashed). Little variable wind. He came in high (there is elevated terrain on that approach) but didn't go around (a very common happening on that situation in this runaway). So he gained speed when he "forced it down".
He hit about the half mark in the runaway.
The airplane had the wheels changed (maybe just for the investigation) and departs tonight, so I guess indeed no damage.
Last edited by justme69; 31st Oct 2008 at 21:03.
21 Approach to GCRR
Hi Folks,
Some moons ago before giving up aviating for fishing, we used to take our fairly large 3 engined machine into GCRR. OK for any approach on 03, but in my opinion the 21 landing (steep offset descent path nasty terrain close in) gave very little lattitude for any error whatsoever, it was tight even with the 73/75s etc if the touchdown was a little late, nothing then but the sand & the sea. Not knowing the facts of this particular case, I would only assume the landing may have been fairly well down 21 & this did not help the guys at all, but other factors, brakes etc may well have played a part of course.
Perhaps it's time for the powers to be, to have another look at the approach procedures to 21, ask the operators who use GCRR for their opinions.
As in any incident, very glad to see that all on board got out ok, not the best way to start a holiday.
Regards
Some moons ago before giving up aviating for fishing, we used to take our fairly large 3 engined machine into GCRR. OK for any approach on 03, but in my opinion the 21 landing (steep offset descent path nasty terrain close in) gave very little lattitude for any error whatsoever, it was tight even with the 73/75s etc if the touchdown was a little late, nothing then but the sand & the sea. Not knowing the facts of this particular case, I would only assume the landing may have been fairly well down 21 & this did not help the guys at all, but other factors, brakes etc may well have played a part of course.
Perhaps it's time for the powers to be, to have another look at the approach procedures to 21, ask the operators who use GCRR for their opinions.
As in any incident, very glad to see that all on board got out ok, not the best way to start a holiday.
Regards
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That perhaps more true for the PIC than the SLF, Oh forgot, unions are still in fashion in Spain so should be alright then.
Guess, like Spanair, the press will find a way to blame someone other than the Crew. How can they blame that nasty Mr Boeing for this one I wonder ?
Guess, like Spanair, the press will find a way to blame someone other than the Crew. How can they blame that nasty Mr Boeing for this one I wonder ?
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Union has already stated they will not comment until the CIAIAC investigation, but inmmediately added talk about work schedules, how the crew was highly qualified, etc.
It looks like maybe it's being rigged to indicate the pilot didn't have time in his work schedule to make the go around, so he landed "as soon as possible" and hence ....
What are the regulations regarding work schedules if a flight is delayed, say for weather reasons while on a long haul etc and the pilots cross their schedule limit (obviously by an hour or two at worst)?
And about the strobe lights ... in a situation like this when an object is obstructing a runaway in an "unusual" circunstances, wouldn't it be better to leave the lights on? What is the usual protocol if you can't vacate the runaway? Turn everything off, set the parking brakes and leave the lights on?
It looks like maybe it's being rigged to indicate the pilot didn't have time in his work schedule to make the go around, so he landed "as soon as possible" and hence ....
What are the regulations regarding work schedules if a flight is delayed, say for weather reasons while on a long haul etc and the pilots cross their schedule limit (obviously by an hour or two at worst)?
And about the strobe lights ... in a situation like this when an object is obstructing a runaway in an "unusual" circunstances, wouldn't it be better to leave the lights on? What is the usual protocol if you can't vacate the runaway? Turn everything off, set the parking brakes and leave the lights on?
Last edited by justme69; 31st Oct 2008 at 21:20.
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OK, the hook's there with a big fat juicy worm and I can't help biting
As my old, not bold instructor said "The amount of runway behind you at the point of touchdown is of no consequence whatsoever"
Sorry, I'm weak and was drawn into saying this.
Sir George Cayley
As my old, not bold instructor said "The amount of runway behind you at the point of touchdown is of no consequence whatsoever"
Sorry, I'm weak and was drawn into saying this.
Sir George Cayley
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justme69, no pax in sight (already on their 3rd beer if it came from Glasgow) & loads of people in yellowjackets wandering round scratching their heads. Given that ATC knew the RW was blocked , not too many reasons to walk away from it leaving the lights merrily flashing away. If they let someone else land & he overan & hit AE there is rather more wrong than a set of strobe lights will solve. Just looks a bit gash to see an uncrewed aircraft sitting there obviously not "secured" following a deplanement as opposed to evacuation.
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Thanks, captPS, just wondering if there was a regulation about having the lights on at all the time while in the runaway, even if for a couple of hours 
There was some footage on a TV station of the guys doing the investigation with a theodolite taking measures and marking the floor, but as I was typing it was removed and superseeded by some other news. Can't find a link now, I think it's gone.
The press also "confirms" the same version rumored here at the airport: nothing wrong with the airplane or the weather (although the weather was a bit messed up and variable). Pilot chose to land that approach and he landed late and fast.
Some local press talks about that being the orientation (opposite to normal) at the time, but that wasn't the case. The preferred orientation is 03 usually, and it was so at the time, but the weather permited either. The pilot requested and was authorized the closer from the north, direct-but-trickier approach to 21.
There was some footage on a TV station of the guys doing the investigation with a theodolite taking measures and marking the floor, but as I was typing it was removed and superseeded by some other news. Can't find a link now, I think it's gone.
The press also "confirms" the same version rumored here at the airport: nothing wrong with the airplane or the weather (although the weather was a bit messed up and variable). Pilot chose to land that approach and he landed late and fast.
Some local press talks about that being the orientation (opposite to normal) at the time, but that wasn't the case. The preferred orientation is 03 usually, and it was so at the time, but the weather permited either. The pilot requested and was authorized the closer from the north, direct-but-trickier approach to 21.
Last edited by justme69; 31st Oct 2008 at 22:42.
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Quiet in the Canaries
A worrying factor in my view was that the aircraft was carrying only 74 pax and crew to the Canary Islands during what is traditionally a busy time for holidaymakers (usually better weather than mainland)
I work for a tour operator and whilst loads like this were unheard of a two years ago they are becoming (for our sins) so much more commonplace now..... bad times!!!
From Travel Weekly
No S*!&t Sherlock
I work for a tour operator and whilst loads like this were unheard of a two years ago they are becoming (for our sins) so much more commonplace now..... bad times!!!
From Travel Weekly
A spokesman for Air Europa said "There was a problem on landing"
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Lets stop all this "lets not jump to conclusions" nonsense. Anyone who has been to aACE knows that this guy was a smart ass who sprogged his approach to 21, continued to land, and broke it.
Professional solidarity my arse. Macho culture evident daily operating down there. Encouraged by complicit atc. You know who they are.
Professional solidarity my arse. Macho culture evident daily operating down there. Encouraged by complicit atc. You know who they are.
Last edited by wee one; 1st Nov 2008 at 02:34.
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Load Factor
my thoughts exactly
had the a/c had a full load of pax what would the stopping distance increase by
or did the pilot assume he could pull up short because of the light load ?
had the a/c had a full load of pax what would the stopping distance increase by
or did the pilot assume he could pull up short because of the light load ?
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If he factored the weight as perfectly as he factored the rate of descend ...
I'd love to see the FDR for this ... spoilers and everything.
They indeed calculated it down to the meter. Literally.
I'd love to see the FDR for this ... spoilers and everything.
They indeed calculated it down to the meter. Literally.