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SAS Q400 gear collaps CPH 27/10

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SAS Q400 gear collaps CPH 27/10

Old 28th Oct 2007, 09:41
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For the operators no immediate impact then.
Unless PAX elsewhere decide to vote with their feet...
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 09:59
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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"There appears to be no relationship between this incident and previous SAS Q400 main landing gear incidents"

If you groud the fleet for weeks, and concentrate 100% on the landing gear, and now this..

Something is seriously wrong, if they have no clue what it is, then how fix it?

A completely new gear, designed from scratch?
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 10:02
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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That would take at least a year or maybe 2. I can't see that really being an option at the moment.

What a head ache they must be having in the SAS and Bombardier boardrooms.
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 10:17
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Well, for sure the Bombardier guys are trying to downplay this issue. With 22 recent orders for the Q400, I'm not surprised.

This is not an incident, it's an accident.
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 11:29
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is cold weather a problem or as mentioned before the de-icing gear
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 13:26
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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Waveman - as far as I'm aware Flybe is the only 400 operator that recommends flap 35 landings as the standard, and this is due to the larger proportion of shorter runways on the their network.
I think you'll find that it's more to do with a historical incident from the early days of the operation involving a tail strike at flap 15.

Well handled evacuation though from this incident. Would be intrigued to know if they used both sets of doors on the LHS. Not easy to tell from the video, but the rear left exit seemed to be slightly lower to the ground than on a 'normal' landing.
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 13:30
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Is it just me who finds it slightly odd that the last two SAS Q400 incidents have been captured on video camera?
They haven't all been caught on camera as far as I know, only 1st and 3rd unless somebody has some footage of the accident in Lithuania?
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 15:25
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SAS removes Dash 8 Q400 from service permanently

From http://www.sasgroup.net/SASGroup/default.asp

2007-10-28 SAS removes Dash 8 Q400 from service permanently


Following the recent period of events involving aircraft of the Dash 8 Q400 type, SAS's management, following an unscheduled meeting of the Board of Directors held today, has decided to immediately discontinue the use of this type of aircraft.

"Confidence in the Q400 has diminished considerably and our customers are becoming increasingly doubtful about flying in this type of aircraft. Accordingly, with the Board of Directors' approval, I have decided to immediately remove Dash 8 Q400 aircraft from service," says Mats Jansson, President and Chief Executive Officer of SAS.

In January 2000, SAS was the first customer to use the Dash 8 Q400 in its traffic operations. The aircraft have accounted for approximately 5 percent of the Group's passengers. The aim is to replace traffic based on the Q400 by reallocating current aircraft in the SAS Group's fleet and by means of leasing.

"The Dash 8 Q400 has given rise to repeated quality-related problems and we can now conclude that the aircraft does not match our passengers' requirements concerning punctuality and regularity. SAS's flight operations have always enjoyed an excellent reputation and there is a risk that use of the Dash 8 Q400 could eventually damage the SAS brand," says John Dueholm, Deputy CEO of SAS.

Due to the decision, SAS's traffic services will be affected by flight cancellations in the period immediately ahead. The customers concerned will be given an opportunity to either rebook or have their tickets refunded. For detailed information about traffic services, reference is made to the airlines' various websites (www.sas.se www.sas.dk www.wideroe.no)
SAS Group Corporate Communication
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 15:31
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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SAS have decided today to cease all Q400 operations forever.

That deciscion could not have been an easy one, but I think, at least for SAS as a product, it was a very wise one.
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 15:48
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it's not only sas

Few weeks ago there was one similar accident with Lufthansa subsdiary. Their landing gear collapsed.
Also Flybe has had problems with landing gear. I work behind a radar screen and have witnessed when Flybe Dash 8's fly a sector landing gear down. No accidents yet.
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 16:30
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Also Flybe has had problems with landing gear. I work behind a radar screen and have witnessed when Flybe Dash 8's fly a sector landing gear down. No accidents yet.
Flybe have had no recent issues with the gear not extending. Some of the fleet were flown to major engineering bases with the gear locked down (pins in) for precautionary checks in accordance with Bombardiers recommendations.
Hopefully there won't be too many jobs lost at SAS with this announcement
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 16:46
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What is going to happen now is anyones guess - I just hope my colleagues in SC dont loose their jobs over this farce - they have really done a great job in these 3 accidents, and they do not deserve to become the victims of all this.
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 16:51
  #53 (permalink)  
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Unhappy

Add Wideröe, who got 4 of them. The airline is owned by SAS, I wonder if
that airline keep their other 25 Dashes or dump them on the market quietly?
All the airplanes are going back to Bombardier along the lawyers and sueing notes....
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 17:27
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I've just fired off a quick Email to Luxair (my local Flag-carrier, who made a great fuss about these 'planes which they have just purchased...)-

But seriously, just to get this in perspective:

How many of these machines are in service?
With how many airlines?
Since when?
How many landing "incidents" have occurred, and since when?

All answers "roughly" of course, but just to get an idea- Are we talking 10 'planes and 6 landing problems, or 1000 'planes over 3 years, with X-thousand cycles?

Cheers,
Maxbert
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 17:30
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Regarding feathering the right prop - is that standard procedure on the Dash-8 if same side main gear does not extend?
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 17:46
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"Landing Gear Issues
On 12 September 2007, Bombardier recommended all Q400s with over 10,000 landings to be grounded for inspection of their landing gear after two non-fatal accidents within 3 days involving the landing gear of a Q400 series aircraft. Both aircraft operated by Scandinavian Airlines, who were an early operator of the type.[6] This affects about 60 aircraft in total, out of a total of 140 Q400s in service. Totally seven Q400s have had landing gear failures while landing during 2007: four in Denmark, one in Germany, one in Japan, one in Lithuania and one in South Korea.
Following the latest incident at Copenhagen Airport, October 27th, Scandinavian Airlines System (SAS)'s executive board decided to cease operation of the Q-400 model, fearing for customers' safety".
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 17:49
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Many thanks!
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 18:05
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In 2007...

As far as I know, another two in Japan involving All Nippon (2004 and 2006).
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 18:11
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Quite a dramatic decision - SAS were clearly very worried about their brand.

I can't think of another instance when a single airline voluntarily took a type out of service on safety grounds without having experienced a fatal accident first. Can anyone?

This is a nightmare for Bombardier - especially as the fault will probably be traced to one of their subcontractors...
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Old 28th Oct 2007, 18:16
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alexmcfire:
Perhaps we could fill the a/c with the lawyers, and get rid of them all at once?
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