Heavy Landing at YMEL?
"The INTRODUCER"
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 437
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From: London
Wiley,
the only editors who do that are the ones who are in the unfortunate position of having reporters who write boring, factual accounts. In which case they need new reporters.
And...reporters' factual accounts - boring or otherwise - can only ever complement, not substitute, for the direct accounts of people involved in or witnessing the events.
Same as when you get told a story in the pub. Just the way world is.
the only editors who do that are the ones who are in the unfortunate position of having reporters who write boring, factual accounts. In which case they need new reporters.
And...reporters' factual accounts - boring or otherwise - can only ever complement, not substitute, for the direct accounts of people involved in or witnessing the events.
Same as when you get told a story in the pub. Just the way world is.
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 153
Likes: 0
From: Melbourne
ATIS YMML W 260029
+ RWY: 27 FOR ARR. RWY 34 FOR DEP NE,
RWY 27 FOR ALL OTHER DEP
+ OPR INFO:
+ WND: 310/8-18,
MXW 14KTS RWY 27
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
CLD: BKN035
+ TMP: 20
QNH: 999
+ SIGWX:
ATIS YMML X 260120
RWY: 27 FOR ARR. RWY 34 FOR DEP NE,
RWY 27 FOR ALL OTHER DEP
+ WND: 290/8-18,
MXW 12KTS BOTH RWYS
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
+ CLD: BKN045
+ TMP: 21
QNH: 999
ATIS YMML Y 260130
+ RWY: 27
+ WND: 230-280/18-30,
MXW 14KTS
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
CLD: BKN045
+ TMP: 19
QNH: 999
ATIS YMML N 260209
RWY: NOT AVBL
SFC COND: ALL RWYS OOS DUE PAVEMENT DAMAGE
WND: 230-280/18-30
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
CLD: BKN045
TMP: 17
QNH: 1000
I don't know why it went from Y to N instead of A but N appears to be the next ATIS.
+ RWY: 27 FOR ARR. RWY 34 FOR DEP NE,
RWY 27 FOR ALL OTHER DEP
+ OPR INFO:
+ WND: 310/8-18,
MXW 14KTS RWY 27
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
CLD: BKN035
+ TMP: 20
QNH: 999
+ SIGWX:
ATIS YMML X 260120
RWY: 27 FOR ARR. RWY 34 FOR DEP NE,
RWY 27 FOR ALL OTHER DEP
+ WND: 290/8-18,
MXW 12KTS BOTH RWYS
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
+ CLD: BKN045
+ TMP: 21
QNH: 999
ATIS YMML Y 260130
+ RWY: 27
+ WND: 230-280/18-30,
MXW 14KTS
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
CLD: BKN045
+ TMP: 19
QNH: 999
ATIS YMML N 260209
RWY: NOT AVBL
SFC COND: ALL RWYS OOS DUE PAVEMENT DAMAGE
WND: 230-280/18-30
VIS: GREATER THAN 10 KM
CLD: BKN045
TMP: 17
QNH: 1000
I don't know why it went from Y to N instead of A but N appears to be the next ATIS.
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
From: Australia
From the Video that i saw on channel 9 it just looks like the plane was hit by a gust!
I was in tears laughing while channel nine were interviewing some passengers, some saying the plane was " spinning out of control" and one passenger saying "i saw the engine hit the ground two times" Bulls...!!!
Congrats to the captain and FO for keeping it on the centre line
.
flyboycoxy:
I was in tears laughing while channel nine were interviewing some passengers, some saying the plane was " spinning out of control" and one passenger saying "i saw the engine hit the ground two times" Bulls...!!!
Congrats to the captain and FO for keeping it on the centre line
.
flyboycoxy:
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 494
Likes: 0
From: not a million miles from old BKK
The forward facing camera is great but to see the runway disappearing off to left or right of the screen during strong crosswind landings must be very scary for passengers who don't understand that this is all quite normal.
A friend who flies A330's for a well known middle east airline says that he occasionally turns the camera off in such circumstances.
The video certainly provides a visual on what must have been a very strong and gusty crosswind at Melbourne.
Well done the lads up front
A friend who flies A330's for a well known middle east airline says that he occasionally turns the camera off in such circumstances.
The video certainly provides a visual on what must have been a very strong and gusty crosswind at Melbourne.
Well done the lads up front
Evertonian
Joined: May 2000
Aviation Qualifications: Non-Aircrew
Posts: 13,471
Likes: 278
From: #3117# Ppruner of the Year Nominee 2005
Never mind the nose camera, I recall landing at YMML in a strong crosswind & seeing the full width of the runway from row 2!
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,525
Likes: 6
From: In Frozen Chunks (Cloud Cuckoo Land)
ALGY
what i mean by LAZY JOURNALIST IS Lazy Journalists Plane Story Generator
Basically cause this web site creates exactly the same stories so called 'qualified' journalists create.
what i mean by LAZY JOURNALIST IS Lazy Journalists Plane Story Generator
Basically cause this web site creates exactly the same stories so called 'qualified' journalists create.
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 175
Likes: 0
From: Germany
A/C landed on Rwy 16 leaving skid marks to the left (where it nearly departed the runway) and then to the right of centreline
Congrats to the captain and FO for keeping it on the centre line
good job anywayCould any of the professionals here explain to me how the decision for the runway is made in such a case (27 with better wind alignment, but 16 longer)?
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
From: Mainland Europe
The Boeing versions of X-wind landings. OK, they are steady winds and no gusts just as you flare, but impressive all the same. Love the sound track too!
http://www.linhadafrente.net/bin/Pousos.wmv
http://www.linhadafrente.net/bin/Pousos.wmv
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,190
Likes: 0
From: Wybacrik
Coxy said it was great that they kept it on the centre line! Is Coxy a pilot I wonder?
I mean, a thirty knot X wind for an A340, C'Mon!!!
We were doing that in 9's back in the 70's!!...
without blowing tyres!!
Get with it guys, basic airmanship beyond you perhaps?
I mean, a thirty knot X wind for an A340, C'Mon!!!
We were doing that in 9's back in the 70's!!...
without blowing tyres!!
Get with it guys, basic airmanship beyond you perhaps?
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
From: East of the Sun & West of the Moon
I mean, a thirty knot X wind for an A340, C'Mon!!!
You might also want to give a wee bit of consideration to things like the relative size and amount of inertia of an A340-600 versus a DC-9. They're not exactly the same, now are they? Not saying these guys did it right, or wrong, but I think it's a bit early to be slamming their airmanship.
ELAC
Last edited by ELAC; 28th October 2005 at 18:45.
"The INTRODUCER"
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 437
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From: London
Blueloo,
that is actually very funny. But you still haven't answered my question and I'm reasonably you haven't got an answer. Still, as I'm sure we both know, it's about equally rare for journalists and pilots to admit they were wrong. Probably because we both tend to make our mistakes in public (us more than you as it happens...but ours don't have quite the same consequences. Respect!)
that is actually very funny. But you still haven't answered my question and I'm reasonably you haven't got an answer. Still, as I'm sure we both know, it's about equally rare for journalists and pilots to admit they were wrong. Probably because we both tend to make our mistakes in public (us more than you as it happens...but ours don't have quite the same consequences. Respect!)
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 175
Likes: 0
From: Germany
Algy, was that your way of admitting you were wrong?
And is
this the question you want an answer to? No wonder then Blueloo doesn't answer it, since he never stated that.
And is
OK Blueloo you'll have to explain to me why accurately (as far as anyone knows) reporting the comments of an eyewitness makes a reporter "lazy"
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10
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From: Australia
Long and the short YES i am a pilot, maybe not an A340 but none the less
Max demonstrated Xwind A340-600 32 Kts
Quote
We were doing that in 9's back in the 70's!!...
I believe you i do, But there is a slight weight difference between a DC9 and an A340
DC-9 MTOW 54,885Kgs (correct me if i am wrong)
A340-600 MTOW 365,000 Kgs
Have a look at the amature video that was on the news (can be found on www.ninemsn.com.au) and you will see that it get's hit by a gust about 50 feet from the ground.
Max demonstrated Xwind A340-600 32 Kts
Quote
We were doing that in 9's back in the 70's!!...
I believe you i do, But there is a slight weight difference between a DC9 and an A340
DC-9 MTOW 54,885Kgs (correct me if i am wrong)
A340-600 MTOW 365,000 Kgs
Have a look at the amature video that was on the news (can be found on www.ninemsn.com.au) and you will see that it get's hit by a gust about 50 feet from the ground.
Last edited by flyboycoxy; 31st October 2005 at 01:22.
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,525
Likes: 6
From: In Frozen Chunks (Cloud Cuckoo Land)
Algy - see Hawks post.
I think you shouldnt look further into it than the explaination already given. I cant answer a question based on a quote which you havent understood. I have already explained it.
I think you shouldnt look further into it than the explaination already given. I cant answer a question based on a quote which you havent understood. I have already explained it.
Bottums Up
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 3,440
Likes: 3
From: dunnunda
flyboycoxy,
are you sure it was hit by a gust? I've only seen the footage once, on Ch9. There seemed to be a signifficant right rudder deflection just prior to landing. I don't recall noticing any comensurate yaw in the opposite direction.
If the wind was nominally westerly, I'd have expected to see left rudder on/approaching touchdown, to align with RWY16.
are you sure it was hit by a gust? I've only seen the footage once, on Ch9. There seemed to be a signifficant right rudder deflection just prior to landing. I don't recall noticing any comensurate yaw in the opposite direction.
If the wind was nominally westerly, I'd have expected to see left rudder on/approaching touchdown, to align with RWY16.
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
From: Australia
Capt Claret
There is two lots of video i have seen one from the end of RNW 16, which shows the pilot holding a alot of drift and then yawing Heavily to the the right. The pilot hits vast amounts of left rudder and some right wing down (again not much) about 50 feet from the ground, The other video is from the terminal and only gets the plane after it had landed so not much can be read from that other than the amount of rudder that is being used down the runway.
Flyboycoxy
There is two lots of video i have seen one from the end of RNW 16, which shows the pilot holding a alot of drift and then yawing Heavily to the the right. The pilot hits vast amounts of left rudder and some right wing down (again not much) about 50 feet from the ground, The other video is from the terminal and only gets the plane after it had landed so not much can be read from that other than the amount of rudder that is being used down the runway.
Flyboycoxy