Ryanair Cost-cutting?
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Just remember not all pilots post here. A large number of us love our jobs. The job I have now pays more than any job I've ever had and gives me the most time off. I may moan a bit when the alarm goes off again at 5 a.m., but I wouldn't swap it for anything. Well, may be a larger jet!
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Red Snake, By getting up at 500 AM makes me think that you are the guy who lives in the parking lot in his mobile home.
In all reality Ryanair is a good job with its goods and its bads. I for one do not want to leave for the sand dunes as people have been doing lately. I like my job and I think it can get better without increasing costs to the company. The 4 on 4 off we discussed would not cost Ryanair anything and it would be a great way to attract and keep people. Alot of us here are not after more money "Though I would never say no to extra money given to me" but a better way of doing things.
Everyone expects us to live up to our end of the deal but then when the going gets tough we are always the "pilots" the "overpaid" ones. It is a free country and if anyone wants to be a pilot, please come on onboard. Any one can be MOL or Ray Webster for that matter. If you think you can do the job go for it. I do not see anyone complaining about their 500 million combined, yet alot of people complain about my 5500 a month. It cannot be the same salaries for everyone in a company or in the job markets. Doctors get paid more than pilots, pilots get paid more than office workers.
It should be apparant by now that only in union can we succeed, and just because MOL wants to do something to increase the share price does not mean that it is correct.
JP
P.S. At present we are fighting to keep our contractualy agreed terms and conditions. We are not moaning about things that we would like to change, nor things that would be nice. We sat 5 years ago and agreed on a 5 year plan. MOL for had the picture and knew exactly what he was signing as he is an expert at this. All we are saying is live up to your word
In all reality Ryanair is a good job with its goods and its bads. I for one do not want to leave for the sand dunes as people have been doing lately. I like my job and I think it can get better without increasing costs to the company. The 4 on 4 off we discussed would not cost Ryanair anything and it would be a great way to attract and keep people. Alot of us here are not after more money "Though I would never say no to extra money given to me" but a better way of doing things.
Everyone expects us to live up to our end of the deal but then when the going gets tough we are always the "pilots" the "overpaid" ones. It is a free country and if anyone wants to be a pilot, please come on onboard. Any one can be MOL or Ray Webster for that matter. If you think you can do the job go for it. I do not see anyone complaining about their 500 million combined, yet alot of people complain about my 5500 a month. It cannot be the same salaries for everyone in a company or in the job markets. Doctors get paid more than pilots, pilots get paid more than office workers.
It should be apparant by now that only in union can we succeed, and just because MOL wants to do something to increase the share price does not mean that it is correct.
JP
P.S. At present we are fighting to keep our contractualy agreed terms and conditions. We are not moaning about things that we would like to change, nor things that would be nice. We sat 5 years ago and agreed on a 5 year plan. MOL for had the picture and knew exactly what he was signing as he is an expert at this. All we are saying is live up to your word
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Ryanair are modelled on the Southwest philosophy, yet the way they seem to treat their passengers & crews seem to fly right in the face of this.
Southwest are not always the cheapest on a route, and having spent two years in the Orlando area, I never saw anything like flights for $0.01 or whatever some of Ryanair's sales are like. But their service is well liked by business & leisure pax alike, by being fun, friendly & relaxed yet safe, secure & professional. Crews are not paid badly & there is an excellent work ethic there.
Ryanair don't seem to have followed this side of the Ryanair model. They don't have good relationships with their passengers or crews, but people are willing to say "you get what you pay for" and fly with them if the price is right.
Exactly what PEOPLExpress did. They also cut costs as much as they could, with poor relationships internally & externally, and it all fell apart after the boom. Unless FR improve their relationships a little bit, it could go the same way.
I don't dislike Ryanair. In fact, I use their flights a lot, and can't complain. Yes, you get less; luggage allowance, service, safety net when things go wrong ... but for the price I paid I'm prepared to support them!
Southwest are not always the cheapest on a route, and having spent two years in the Orlando area, I never saw anything like flights for $0.01 or whatever some of Ryanair's sales are like. But their service is well liked by business & leisure pax alike, by being fun, friendly & relaxed yet safe, secure & professional. Crews are not paid badly & there is an excellent work ethic there.
Ryanair don't seem to have followed this side of the Ryanair model. They don't have good relationships with their passengers or crews, but people are willing to say "you get what you pay for" and fly with them if the price is right.
Exactly what PEOPLExpress did. They also cut costs as much as they could, with poor relationships internally & externally, and it all fell apart after the boom. Unless FR improve their relationships a little bit, it could go the same way.
I don't dislike Ryanair. In fact, I use their flights a lot, and can't complain. Yes, you get less; luggage allowance, service, safety net when things go wrong ... but for the price I paid I'm prepared to support them!
Jet Blast Rat
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Coconuts
I think srjumbo is being rather unfair and petulant, not sticking to the conventions observed here that those not professional pilots are welcomed and in turn expected to be, as you are, open about their status.
On the subject of the thread, perhaps you are looking at this from the point of view of a passenger, who does not know what goes on inside an airline or the job pressures of a bonded pilot. It's very hard to leave a job in uncertain times, reducing income and having to repay a bond as well as damaging the future career
I have no involvement in Ryanair, but I know people that do and I see their operations regularly. The managment have a terrible attitude to their crews; to tell a group of potential recruits that they are to be considered as "units" by the company, for making profit, and if they leave when the company has made its money they don't care (in less poite terms) is frankly apalling. This shows an attitude that seems to be causing the grievances shown in the thread here.
I know from my experience of operating from the same airport as Ryanair flights that although the crews mostly act in a very professional manner there is a huge amount of pressure being put on pilots from somewhere, breaking that professional demeanor on very rare occasions.
You seem to have a good experience of the front end: from what I hear Ryanair crews are professional and very competent. It is easy for the customer to be kept away from the horror that management can be in a company.
I think srjumbo is being rather unfair and petulant, not sticking to the conventions observed here that those not professional pilots are welcomed and in turn expected to be, as you are, open about their status.
On the subject of the thread, perhaps you are looking at this from the point of view of a passenger, who does not know what goes on inside an airline or the job pressures of a bonded pilot. It's very hard to leave a job in uncertain times, reducing income and having to repay a bond as well as damaging the future career
I have no involvement in Ryanair, but I know people that do and I see their operations regularly. The managment have a terrible attitude to their crews; to tell a group of potential recruits that they are to be considered as "units" by the company, for making profit, and if they leave when the company has made its money they don't care (in less poite terms) is frankly apalling. This shows an attitude that seems to be causing the grievances shown in the thread here.
I know from my experience of operating from the same airport as Ryanair flights that although the crews mostly act in a very professional manner there is a huge amount of pressure being put on pilots from somewhere, breaking that professional demeanor on very rare occasions.
You seem to have a good experience of the front end: from what I hear Ryanair crews are professional and very competent. It is easy for the customer to be kept away from the horror that management can be in a company.
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There is another LCA doing very similar things to its crews (same type, less money and worse rosters). The two companies seem to be competing not only for growth, staff and headlines, but also to see who can treat staff the worst and get away with it.
It's a difficult position for the crews; the unions (where present) seem unable to help, direct (well intentioned) contact with management leads to sanctions on the crews, and the lack of cohesive opposition allows things to get worse. The only viable option to these crews is to leave - but to where? Things are picking up, but there are not that many places available out there, and these pilots have financial (and often geographical) commitments.
Maybe, when low morale and fatigue combine, a high sick rate will get their attention. However, at RYA's main competitor, this was just regarded as laziness, and nothing has changed in the comany's culture. The situation is catching up with them though, as they are having trouble recruiting crew and just as much trouble retaining them (I understand that 150 pilots left last year, and that they are 250 short for this summer season).
Whatever the solution, I hope it comes soon, as these 2 companies are driving down standards accross the whole industry year after year.
It's a difficult position for the crews; the unions (where present) seem unable to help, direct (well intentioned) contact with management leads to sanctions on the crews, and the lack of cohesive opposition allows things to get worse. The only viable option to these crews is to leave - but to where? Things are picking up, but there are not that many places available out there, and these pilots have financial (and often geographical) commitments.
Maybe, when low morale and fatigue combine, a high sick rate will get their attention. However, at RYA's main competitor, this was just regarded as laziness, and nothing has changed in the comany's culture. The situation is catching up with them though, as they are having trouble recruiting crew and just as much trouble retaining them (I understand that 150 pilots left last year, and that they are 250 short for this summer season).
Whatever the solution, I hope it comes soon, as these 2 companies are driving down standards accross the whole industry year after year.
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Partial reprieve
Ryanair abandons pay freeze plan
details here
http://www.rte.ie/business/2004/0506/ryanair.html
I suppose 3% is better than a freeze.
details here
http://www.rte.ie/business/2004/0506/ryanair.html
I suppose 3% is better than a freeze.
the Ryanair 3% pay rise with the associated loss of payment for medicals together with having to have medicals on days off and the destruction of the loss of licence and pension schemes is in fact a major pay cut for the pilots, especially those at or approaching 50 years of age. The rest of the company get a nice simple 3% rise, whilst those that MOL identified as being directly responsible for the company's excellent punctuality record are beining penalised with at least a 5% PAYCUT in net terms
3% GROSS IS SWEET FA TO ME
THANKS A BUNCH
GOD FORBID WE NEED A UNION NOW OR THIS STITCH WILL JUST GET WORSE AND WORSE
ryanair was a nice company to work foruntil about 2 years ago but NO MORE
3% GROSS IS SWEET FA TO ME
THANKS A BUNCH
GOD FORBID WE NEED A UNION NOW OR THIS STITCH WILL JUST GET WORSE AND WORSE
ryanair was a nice company to work foruntil about 2 years ago but NO MORE
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well said Brookmans Park
MOL gives with one hand what the staff are entitle anyway and takes with the other twice as much.
The worst thing is that the paycuts (pension, medicals etc) affect mostly the crews that have been with the company for years.
One gets the feeling that eventually his plan is to have mostly contract crews.......I wonder why?
..........another gem on the savings plan -
STN base pilots will have to D/H twice before SIM check so the company will save on car rentals (STN-DUB, DUB-EMA)
WHAT NEXT?
MOL gives with one hand what the staff are entitle anyway and takes with the other twice as much.
The worst thing is that the paycuts (pension, medicals etc) affect mostly the crews that have been with the company for years.
One gets the feeling that eventually his plan is to have mostly contract crews.......I wonder why?
..........another gem on the savings plan -
STN base pilots will have to D/H twice before SIM check so the company will save on car rentals (STN-DUB, DUB-EMA)
WHAT NEXT?
Join Date: Apr 2000
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If we keep burning fuel and snagging aircraft like we have been for the last month he'll give in on the medical and pension issues as well.
I've heard the fuel bill for the last month is up 15% and the schedule in Dublin has been destroyed at least every second day.
Keep it up lads.
I've heard the fuel bill for the last month is up 15% and the schedule in Dublin has been destroyed at least every second day.
Keep it up lads.
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Quote from the RTE piece -
Yeah right! Here we are about a month after the original plan was "proposed" and everything's all sweetness now? I don't think so!
Major climb down in the face of an adverse reaction from the employees!
The airline said today's move was not an indication of better times ahead, but a reward for 'continued productivity gains'.
Major climb down in the face of an adverse reaction from the employees!
